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    Bradford and Bingley

    Clause 4 is backhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7640143.stm
    Roseburys and MFI gone bust
    What next in this recession.

    #2
    Bradford and Bingley

    Intersting quote on the bbc website yu link to, TG

    He said: "It will mean that every building society that floated on the stock market in the wave of demutualisations of the past two decades will either have collapsed or been sold to a conventional bank."
    That was a really successful policy, wasn't it? Gave everyone a bit more spare cash to pump into the economy whilst destroying the culture of mutuality, care, savings and understanding local conditions, whcih had worked exceptionally well for the last 150 odd years.

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      #3
      Bradford and Bingley

      Are there any other banks that sponsor county cricket sides?

      If so, can they be shorted.

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        #4
        Bradford and Bingley

        supposing you had an account with the chesire building scoiety and/or derbyshire building soicety recently. both hoovered up by the nationwide at the request of the FSA. No payout to members

        you would be pretty pissed off right?

        and yes I am!

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          #5
          Bradford and Bingley

          Well, at least your money is safe. The FSA doesn't make requests like that for shits and giggles.

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            #6
            Bradford and Bingley

            We did this already.

            You are lucky to have your deposits, and shouldn't be expecting a windfall.

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              #7
              Bradford and Bingley

              Also OTF's favourite supermarket the John Lewis group is also in trouble.

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                #8
                Bradford and Bingley

                I understand, just in the last 12 months both boards have turned down merger proposals which would have been bonus city for all members, saying their finances were fine and they would be better alone

                I understand the nature of the CC, but still, I could have wasted some more money on a carbon road bike I don't need

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                  #9
                  Bradford and Bingley

                  MI5 on the brink as well, or is it MFI?

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                    #10
                    Bradford and Bingley

                    I had to try really hard to stop myself giggling like a loon at some braying twat I was speaking to in the pub on Friday night who was boasting how he had 'cleverly' bought 250 worth of B&B shares.

                    Told every single person he encountered and kept going on about how much financial acumen he has.

                    I hope I see him again soon.

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                      #11
                      Bradford and Bingley

                      So what would OTF's economic brains have done with banks such as B&B etc.

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                        #12
                        Bradford and Bingley

                        I'm not gonna pretend I'm an economics whizz but I wanna see Bradford and bingley saved and bought out by the new lloyds tsb Halifax Royal Bank of Scotland. Just to see them fit it all in a sign, even abbreviated would be worth it. LTSBHBOSBAB.

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                          #13
                          Bradford and Bingley

                          Woolies are in choppy waters at the moment, as well.

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                            #14
                            Bradford and Bingley

                            TG, at this point nationalisation is almost certainly the best course for a bank like B&B. The state will always end up with the downside risk in these situations, at least nationalisation allows it to get the upside as well.

                            Contrast the original Paulson plan in the US, which would have left the upside to the banks.

                            Nefertiti makes an interesting point about the social aspects of the crisis, which in many ways parallel those of the US "savings and loan" crisis of the late 80s. While they obviously operate on a differnt scale, there is a lesson to be learned from the fact that informal, culturally-based lending networks (like those common in the Islamic world or Korean or Taiwanese friends and family groups) have proven much more resilient than massive commercial and investment banks (see also the Benelux governments putting 11 billion euro into Fortis over the weekend). The fact that the networks never severed the bond between their members and those making decisions is a big part of that.

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                              #15
                              Bradford and Bingley

                              Tactical Genius wrote:
                              Also OTF's favourite supermarket the John Lewis group is also in trouble.
                              Define "trouble". Down the pan trouble or profits cut through belt tightening trouble?

                              Because I'll be pissed off if they go down because their department stores shit all over most others and also I'll be blowed if I ever buying any of the colossal tat masquerading as furniture that IKEA or Argos have on show again.

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                                #16
                                Bradford and Bingley

                                The state will always end up with the downside risk in these situations, at least nationalisation allows it to get the upside as well.
                                Um, I thought we have taken on the B&B mortgages. Savings and investments have been sold to Santander.

                                Likewise with Northern Rock - we only got the shitty mortgages.

                                I may have misread this though.

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                                  #17
                                  Bradford and Bingley

                                  I was under the impression that the Government took over everything with Northern Rock.

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                                    #18
                                    Bradford and Bingley

                                    So, as I understand it, the savings & branches bit of B&B is being flogged to Santander, whereas HM Government is holding on to the buy-to-let mortgages so wisely lent.

                                    We seem to have ended up with the grotesque farce of a Labour government - a Labour government - funding buy-to-let mortgages for well-off folks to make a living off the backs of those unable to afford a place of their own.

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                                      #19
                                      Bradford and Bingley

                                      CTT and others are right, my comment about the upside was based on this morning's reports available here, before the Santander part of the deal was public.

                                      There is still some upside in the mortgage portfolio, but Santander is likely getting a very good deal on what they've bought.

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                                        #20
                                        Bradford and Bingley

                                        Santander are loving this crisis - John Paulson referenced it as Southern European banks being happy to escape through their highly inefficient banking system. (He also proposed a ridiculously non-viable solution with preferred equity stakes that a man short the banks would obviously love)

                                        With B&B vs the Hank Paulson solution, I think it is an apples and oranges comparison. The US seems to be focused on rescuing the international capital markets (so, the IB's), and has followed identical models to B&B with WaMu and Wachovia.

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                                          #21
                                          Bradford and Bingley

                                          Santander shares are a pain in the arse, though. Spanish withholding tax on the dividends and the share Registrars (Equiniti, why protect the guilty) give a whole new meaning to the word incompetent.

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                                            #22
                                            Bradford and Bingley

                                            Does anyone else think that Santander's logo looks like a steaming dog turd?

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                                              #23
                                              Bradford and Bingley

                                              As with Arsenal, you are not alone in this, GO.

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                                                #24
                                                Bradford and Bingley

                                                Abbey employees said very much the same of the logo when it first arrived. I always thought it looked more like an iced gem.

                                                The winner in bad bank logos has to be the Cat's Asshole, RBS. Maybe they can get the St Andrew's flag now Bank of Scotland is likely to disappear (unless Lloyds, having trashed the TSB name have a weird change of heart).

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                                                  #25
                                                  Bradford and Bingley

                                                  I thought it was interesting that all of the press releases from Her Majesty's Government on that part of the B&B situation referred to Abbey instead of Santander.

                                                  I guess they didn't want to scare the Daily Mail.
                                                  Or maybe they still think that Abbey is independent.

                                                  Both RBS and Santander are big sponsors of Formula One (as are ING and their intellectually-challenged lion), though at least the Spaniard keep the turd off of the car.

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