Twitter

[delicatemoth]

But if it dies it won't be replaced by something better. That'll be it. And see my earlier post about left-wing media - too much red-brown around town.

Yesterday I posted a fundraiser for trans youth in Ireland. At least three people (plus me) donated because I posted it. I got it off Twitter.

[WOM]

But if it dies it won't be replaced by something better.

Yeah, see, I don't see this at all. As a platform, I can't see any technological 'moat' around it that would keep something better from cropping up rather quickly...and with a better interface. And hopefully with 'official' verified status for all users. It's a cesspool, but one with such a critical mass that it appears to be a monopoly.

[Hot Pepsi]

Yeah, see, I don't see this at all. As a platform, I can't see any technological 'moat' around it that would keep something better from cropping up rather quickly...and with a better interface. And hopefully with 'official' verified status for all users. It's a cesspool, but one with such a critical mass that it appears to be a monopoly.

Yeah, perhaps that will happen. There's clearly demand for it. *

The alternative to allowing the shit to take over this or that unmoderated platform is to be on there every single day trying to fight an unwinnable battle against it.
I'm sorry, but I'm not going to spend the rest of my days doing that. It's exhausting, depressing (literally, not in the way people say that Scandinavian films are depressing) and, most importantly, it ultimately doesn't really accomplish anything.

If that isn't your experience and you find that it is helpful, I sincerely wish you all the luck in the world.


But, as I understand it, Twitter does not make money because its ad revenue just isn't good enough. I don't see how that's going to get any better and I can't see any other platform that uses a similar everyone-shouting-at-once interface is going to do any better as far as that goes. It's just not a good way to get ads in front of people that might actual engage with them. Instagram and TikTock and, of course, TV ads during sports seem like an infinitely better bet.

I gather that Musk agrees because he's hoping to make money off of charging people to use it with more premium features or something. I can't see that taking off.

As somebody in the ad business, perhaps you know more.

[Snake Plissken]

I did like this.

You fucked up real good, kiddo.

Twitter is a disaster clown car company that is successful despite itself, and there is no possible way to grow users and revenue without making a series of enormous compromises that will ultimately destroy your reputation and possibly cause grievous damage to your other companies.

I say this with utter confidence because the problems with Twitter are not engineering problems. They are political problems. Twitter, the company, makes very little interesting technology; the tech stack is not the valuable asset. The asset is the user base: hopelessly addicted politicians, reporters, celebrities, and other people who should know better but keep posting anyway. You! You, Elon Musk, are addicted to Twitter. You’re the asset. You just bought yourself for $44 billion dollars.

The problem when the asset is people is that people are intensely complicated, and trying to regulate how people behave is historically a miserable experience, especially when that authority is vested in a single powerful individual.

What I mean is that you are now the King of Twitter, and people think that you, personally, are responsible for everything that happens on Twitter now. It also turns out that absolute monarchs usually get murdered when shit goes sideways.

[delicatemoth]

https://twitter.com/ProfSunnySingh/status/1585894472906326018

[delicatemoth]

And hopefully with 'official' verified status for all users

This would be chilling for people in precarious positions. There is no way I would be on a social media platform where I have to use my legal name. It would be an invitation for harassment and possibly worse - as I've posted more than once, the DWP comb people's social media accounts to see if they're having more fun than they're supposed to be.

Donald Trump didn't build his base with his Twitter account. He just offends people's sensibilities with it. See Sunny's thread above. Twitter is a cesspit where people can build forms of community. Many of my favourite people call it a 'hellsite' (including Sunny, above). We know it's terrible in multiple ways, but it can also be used positively. We've spent years working out how to use it positively. You and HP haven't, you hate it cos it's ugly. We live in ugliness, it's our reality.

L*bsofT*kT*k foment violence against hospitals on Twitter, but would have little impact without the likes of Tucker Carlson boosting them on his national TV show, without Republican officials saying the same things on TV. Tucker Carlson tells viewers to "arm themselves" against trans people - on TV. Fascists make their deals and whip up their base on TV, at their rallies, (not least) in their churches, in the hotel conference rooms where they meet. None of those are places we can access and subvert to make forms of community. Twitter is.

And honestly, if you want to go after the social media network that really helps fascism, go after Facebook. An echo chamber where 40- and 50-something nice people convince each other that Muslims, travellers and trannies are distractions at best and maaaayyyybeeee problems that ideally wouldn't exist.

[WOM]

This would be chilling for people in precarious positions.

Yes, I suppose you're right. I was thinking more of not allowing racists and trolls (and bots) their anonymity. But I guess there's always a predictable downside.

[Hot Pepsi]

https://twitter.com/ProfSunnySingh/status/1585894472906326018

She is right that it's always been a wretched hive of scum and villainy, but Musk's takeover does seem to snuff out the last bit of vain hope that it might somehow someday get better.


On a side note, I've observed that "medical twitter" such as it was, seems to have been greatly damaged by COVID insofar as that's all any of the medical people want to talk about - still - and, like all twitter discussions, it's dominated by the most shrill and self-righteous voices.

Yes, masks and vaccines are great, but there's an awful lot of choir-oriented-preaching going on there and a whole lot of people with lots of letters after their name trying to show off that they love their children more than we do because they still make them wear masks 24/7 something something long-COVID.

[ad hoc]

I'm broadly with DM on twitter. There are lots of shitty people on twitter (who haven't been banned) but there are also a lot of really good people too. And the voices of the shitty ones will be heard even if twitter disappears but the voices of the good ones will be silenced

Anyway, what's Mastodon? Is it worth looking into?

[Hot Pepsi]

This would be chilling for people in precarious positions. There is no way I would be on a social media platform where I have to use my legal name. It would be an invitation for harassment and possibly worse - as I've posted more than once, the DWP comb people's social media accounts to see if they're having more fun than they're supposed to be.

Donald Trump didn't build his base with his Twitter account. He just offends liberals' sensibilities with it. See Sunny's thread above. Twitter is a cesspit where people can build forms of community. Many of my favourite people call it a 'hellsite' (including Sunny, above). We know it's terrible in multiple ways, but it can also be used positively. We've spent years working out how to use it positively. You and HP haven't, you hate it cos it's ugly. We live in ugliness, it's our reality.

L*bsofT*kT*k foment violence against hospitals on Twitter, but would have little impact without the likes of Tucker Carlson boosting them on his national TV show, without Republican officials saying the same things on TV. Tucker Carlson tells viewers to "arm themselves" against trans people - on TV. Fascists make their deals and whip up their base on TV, at their rallies, (not least) in their churches, in the hotel conference rooms where they meet. None of those are places we can access and subvert to make forms of community. Twitter is.

And honestly, if you want to go after the social media network that really helps fascism, go after Facebook. An echo chamber where 40- and 50-something nice people convince each other that Muslims, travellers and trannies are distractions at best and maaaayyyybeeee problems that ideally wouldn't exist.

I don't just hate it because it's ugly. I hate it because it's built on a libertarian lie. And because it is ugly - aesthetically as a UX.

Facebook is terrible too. I'm well aware of that. If it it's worse, it's because it's actually much more popular than twitter, and for whatever reason much more popular with older people.

I can see how either of those platforms could be used for good, as you have explained, and I don't doubt that you've found ways to use them that way. But it seems to me like there are alternatives - or could be - that could work even better and not give oxygen to so much terrible shit.

I'm not 100% confident on that assertion, however, because I'm not confident in any thing right now. But I hope I'm right on this one. Because if the only way for marginalized kids, especially, to find other marginalized kids is to wade through an ocean of hate, then I don't know if that's really much progress.*

You are right about cable TV. I don't think TV is going to matter much longer, though. The only people who actually sit there and watch Fox when it's on are people who don't know how to use streaming or the internet and those people will all be dead in a decade or so. Unfortunately, that will just leave them more time to explore even worse shit on the internet.

I don't know what to do, really.

Basically my position in this discussion is "Well, fuck, there's got to be a better way, right" And you seem to be saying "No, I don't think there is." And I'm saying "Well, then .... fuck."

*It's also worth noting, perhaps, that as far as I'm aware, very few kids use twitter. I can't be sure of that though. The only research I could find just asked kids if they *ever* used a particular platform. The percentage using twitter has declined (although notably it is higher for Black kids than white kids) but anecdotally, at least, it doesn't seem to be one that many young people want to really deal with.

https://www.pewresearch.org/internet...chnology-2022/

[Hot Pepsi]

And the voices of the shitty ones will be heard even if twitter disappears but the voices of the good ones will be silenced

I just don't understand that conclusion. It seems to be conflating Twitter with all of social media and, perhaps, the Internet in general.

[delicatemoth]

Basically my position in this discussion is "Well, fuck, there's got to be a better way, right" And you seem to be saying "No, I don't think there is." And I'm saying "Well, then .... fuck."

It's a terrible situation. And you and WOM are not wrong about its badness, and I hate feeling like I'm defending it. But thanks for reading and considering my points. And I'm sorry you apparently have to use it for your job, I hope you can get that sorted soon.

Two tips for using Twitter.

1. Block early, block often. block for any reason you like. It's not rude, or cowardly, it's common sense. You wouldn't feel obliged to engage with someone who shouted at you on the street.
2. It's good for information gathering and making connections, but terrible for nuanced discussion. Don't bother trying.

I'll look into Mastodon etc. But I don't really want to have to rebuild elsewhere. I'm slowly piecing back together all the links I lost when my computer blew up, that's bad enough.

[Hot Pepsi]

I’ve blocked thousands. What I want to do is also cull a lot of the people I decided to follow recklessly. I’ve tried Apps that help with that, but they often don’t work.

[beak]

a great tip for sanitising ones twtitter experience, or at least returning it to the original twitter vision of a chronological timeline of statements by people you choose to follow, is to mute the following terms (without quotation marks):

"suggest_activity"
"suggest_ranked_timeline_tweet"
"suggest_pyle_tweet"
"suggest_activity_tweet"
"suggest_recycled_timeline_tweet"
"suggest_recycled_tweet"
"suggest_recap"
"suggest_who_to_follow"

in fact, it's possibly worth punting any one of those into the twitter search as i'm sure there might have been more added since i initially found that list.

[Uncle Ethan]

Well, go and look at my latest post on the trans thread and tell me where I might be able to find this information if Twitter didn't exist. "Oh but it's terrible." So is the mainstream media. At least on Twitter I can find trans voices, Puerto Rican voices, Aotearoa voices, anarchist voices, peasant voices, Iranian voices, science voices, music voices etc. etc. that aren't corporate mouthpieces.



No, that would be the rising tide of fascism, which the gross aspects of Twitter are a symptom of.

Agree. I find it strange that people don't seem to realise you can curate your own feed. I have been much better informed about a wide range of issues via Twitter than any other platform.

[Nefertiti2]

https://twitter.com/ericholthaus/status/1586518345133719553?s=21&t=2OPg_uIliLh86VQzi8psag

[ursus arctos]

https://twitter.com/mollyjongfast/status/1586702056487796737?s=61&t=k-FBXbCooUPrAf0zBXCjgw

[S. aureus]

https://twitter.com/ericholthaus/status/1586518345133719553?s=21&t=2OPg_uIliLh86VQzi8psag

https://twitter.com/EricHolthaus/status/1586704568624324612

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

https://twitter.com/mollyjongfast/status/1586702056487796737?s=61&t=k-FBXbCooUPrAf0zBXCjgw

Getting real gr*ham l**eh*n vibes off all this nonsense.

[Hot Pepsi]

Agree. I find it strange that people don't seem to realise you can curate your own feed. I have been much better informed about a wide range of issues via Twitter than any other platform.

They don’t make it easy to learn how to do that. On purpose.

It’s an immoral company owned by an immoral demagogue.

[Nefertiti2]

the Brazil thread shows how immensely valuable twitter can be in finding news in real time

[Lymeswold Snork]

https://twitter.com/mollyjongfast/status/1586702056487796737?s=61&t=k-FBXbCooUPrAf0zBXCjgw

He's deleted it now.

[caja-dglh]

He's deleted it now.

Well that's all okay then.

[WOM]

Apparently they worked all weekend and the whacking begins today. 7,000 people's worth of stuff that got done on Friday won't get done tomorrow. How does that actually work in the real world?

[ursus arctos]

In my experience, redundancies of that magnitude are usually connected with a decision to sell or terminate lines of business, and the units in question operate in a kind of suspended animation until they are transferred to new ownership or liquidated. They will continue to manage existing business, but won't take on anything new (not that they are seen as attractive business partners).

It is more difficult for me to see how that would work with Twitter. I don't think that they had anywhere near 7,000 people working on finding new advertisers, for example.

The hot rumour over the weekend was that they were going to start requiring "verified accounts" with blue check marks to subscribe to an enhanced level of service at either USD 4.99 or USD 19.99 a month (accounts differ on the price) if they want to keep that status.

That has a very high potential for carnage, and it continues to look like Musk is primarily setting money on fire.