Corb Blimey!

[Nefertiti2]

Macron backs corbyn

https://twitter.com/SamCoatesTimes/status/973983768657694720

https://twitter.com/SamCoatesTimes/status/973983998438531072

[johnr]

I don't even know what that is supposed to mean.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Murray and Milne aren't exactly known for being hard on Russia.

[ad hoc]

I have no truck with Putinistas and Russiaphilia but I thought Corbyn today was good (good in the sense of thinking and not rushing to judgement and coming out with a reasonable approach, not good in the sense of soundbite politics that feeds the press)

[Nefertiti2]

Agreed. It's scary that what the right of the Labour Party seemed to want is a combination of empty warmongering rhetoric to please the press and inaction to please the City of London.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Who on the right gas expressed any worry about the City?

[Pérou Flaquettes]

Macron backs corbyn

https://twitter.com/SamCoatesTimes/status/973983768657694720

https://twitter.com/SamCoatesTimes/status/973983998438531072

Quite apart from what this French official said to Reuters, and IMO the ever-growing feeling of Brexit-induced "indifference" towards the UK from the main EU players, it isn't surprising to see France having such cold feet to back the UK: the Franco-Russian relationships have been very tense in the last decade (in last two presidential terms, 2007-2017). Macron has since tried to patch things up (Macron and Putin seek reset in splendour of Versailles), but you can't help feeling that it's a very fragile entente cordiale.

(2007 – over Chechnya) Nicolas Sarkozy, the French president, risked the anger of the Kremlin yesterday by meeting some of Vladimir Putin's fiercest critics on his first official visit to Russia.

(2007) Putin to Sarkozy: keep speaking that way and I will crush you, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_sFoW6aIHo

(2008 – over Georgia) Sarkozy threatened to leave stormy Russian talks

Relations then thawed a bit (a few arms deals helped).

Then, in 2011, the Syrian civil war broke out and François Hollande arrived a year later.

(2013) Russia–France: A Strained Political Relationship

(2013) Hollande visits Russia to press Putin on Syria

(2014) Ukraine crisis: France halts warship delivery to Russia

(2015) Ukraine conflict: France hopes to end Russia sanctions

(2016) Vladimir Putin cancels Paris trip as diplomatic crisis over Syria deepens

(2017) How Russia hacked the French election

[ursus arctos]

Not to mention Macron’s wet dream of having Canary Wharf decamp to La Defense

[Tubby Isaacs]

He said something about sending Russia a sample, which was a Putin line he should have swerved.

Talking about a proper process of testing was fine.

[Pérou Flaquettes]

Not to mention Macron’s wet dream of having Canary Wharf decamp to La Defense

Quite (it's sort of part of the "ever-growing feeling of Brexit-induced 'indifference' towards the UK from the main EU players" package). When you hear French officials mention this crisis you get the feeling that what they really want to say is this: "Why should we go out on a limb and imperil the fragile relation we have with Russia just for you mates who have chosen to leave the EU and been pretty fucking insulting to all and sundry in the process? Besides, you've kept turning a blind eye to these Russian shenanigans on British soil (Home secretary responds to calls to examine alleged Russian involvement in up to 14 deaths) so sorry, but 'as you make your bed you lie on it' as you lot say".

[Tubby Isaacs]

They didn't have to go out on a limb, just find a helpful statement and not brief anonymously. They have a point, and we've brought the Brexit isolation on ourselves.

[johnr]

Murray and Milne aren't exactly known for being hard on Russia.

Ah yes, that's what's needed, we need to be 'hard' on Russia.

[Tubby Isaacs]

I don't want unadulterated Stop The War at the top table, no.

[E10 Rifle]

You don't have unadulterated STW at the top table, there are other tendencies and outlooks there

[Nefertiti2]

He said something about sending Russia a sample, which was a Putin line he should have swerved.

Talking about a proper process of testing was fine.

It’s not a “putin line he should have swerved “ it’s the appropriate protocol.

Here’s his speech in full

https://twitter.com/dancardenmp/status/974002450985299968

[johnr]

I don't want unadulterated Stop The War at the top table, no.

Well, if we're setting up false binaries, then I don't want unadulterated 'let's be hard (whatever that means) on Russia' either. At least, not until we've got some actual facts about what happened, and who exactly instigated it.

[HeavyDracula]

Much better CLP meeting tonight, which actually got to end and was 98% comradely. The PPC for Northampton South gave a good speech, and I really think he has a chance of winning at the next election, whenever that may be.

Lots of focus on the shit that the County Council have gotten themselves into - with the assumption being that the government will be sending in the commissioners next week, which should lead to more slash and burn. I didn't enjoy food and shelter, anyway.

They're asking for submissions to delegate to conference - anyone ever been? What's expected of you?

[Tubby Isaacs]

Well, if we're setting up false binaries, then I don't want unadulterated 'let's be hard (whatever that means) on Russia' either. At least, not until we've got some actual facts about what happened, and who exactly instigated it.

That's sensible.

It's not where Stop the War are coming from.

[Tubby Isaacs]

You don't have unadulterated STW at the top table, there are other tendencies and outlooks there

I meant Murray would be offering that, not that everybody would be.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Then again why you'd bring in Murray at all, God knows. Who thinks, we need someone like that?

[Lang Spoon]

You meaning Craig Murray? Labour are officially taking on that problem? Even citing him is madness.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Apologies Nef, I didn't hear the bit that it was protocol.

But I don't know, that speech underwhelms me. Not all that much sense of Putin's considerable previous there. Sure, a line on human rights, but not much. Maybe it's just that he's not the best speaker.

[Tubby Isaacs]

You meaning Craig Murray? Labour are officially taking on that problem? Even citing him is madness.

Andrew Murray, I mean.

Labour swerve Craig Murray well enough. He's talking about evidence today (as one might). He wasn't so insistent on evidence when he was telling me that there was loads of Asian voting fraud. "It's part of the Labour plan" was about the extent of it.

[johnr]

Wow, there's three paragraphs on Putin and Russia's previous, and current. Can you not see it all?

[Tubby Isaacs]

On Russia being a bad place, sure. It's more than that. It's imperial.