XTC were also on the scene from punk's early days (although formed in the early seventies): I'd class them as 'new wave' - concurrent to punk - but they definitely developed their sound and ideas after spikier beginnings. So, yeah, maybe.
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No, not a clear division but the bands we tend to think of as post-punk were a bit avant-garde, indie is a bit ... twee. Not really pushing the envelope in terms of rhythms or lyrics. I love a lot of it, I love pure pop, but there's a difference between say, The Pop Group, Throbbing Gristle, PiL, and Orange Juice or Felt.
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There isn't really a clear division, but yes absolutely a darker, more serious angle to the post-punk contingent. (And I guess 'indie' still meant 'independent label' in 1980.)
Personally, I think I'm going to stick with XTC as new wave rather than post-punk, however. (Ditto The Only Ones, who I don't believe have been mentioned yet.)
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I think the interesting thing about post-punk is that there was (and is) a spectrum of sounds that fit under that umbrella. But I would agree with MsD in that once we start to get closer to the mid-1980s some of those early sounds became a bit more conventional when consider the poppier side of post-punk. I don't know when Felt, for example, formed but I never really thought about them as a post-punk band. In the same way that I never thought about Loop or MBV as post-punk bands. Not that I have too much invested in these categories, although I did start the thread because I think there are some unique and interesting sounds that we could share and discuss that differ from other sounds. For example, if we also had a New Wave thread I assume that might alter how we consider post-punk. Gary Numann is someone I like (esp. the song "Down in the Park") but he seams more New Wave than Cabaret Voltaire (see post above), for example. I dig both so the differentiation isn't really about quality, more about aesthetic.
Also, I think the waters are a little murkier in the past than now. That is, there were a lot of bands forming because they were inspired by early punks bands; they were literally post-punk (not that punk was dead--still not dead). But if you listen to some of the links I posted to start the thread and then compare the sounds of those bands to other punk bands, it is clear how those bands fit into a post-punk aesthetic. Not hardcore. Not pop-punk (and I'm referring to good pop punk here, not mall punk). Not crust. And the list could go on.Last edited by danielmak; 27-03-2019, 07:45.
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Felt (formed in 1979) predated Loop and MBV by several years - hence their (or 'his') inclusion and not the latter pair, who only really emerged in the mid-eighties.
Tubeway Army - ie, before Numan solo - should certainly be considered in the post-punk mix.
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Originally posted by danielmak View PostAlso, I think the waters are a little murkier in the past than now. That is, there were a lot of bands forming because they were inspired by early punks bands; they were literally post-punk (not that punk was dead--still not dead). But if you listen to some of the links I posted to start the thread and then compare the sounds of those bands to other punk bands, it is clear how those bands fit into a post-punk aesthetic. Not hardcore. Not pop-punk (and I'm referring to good pop punk here, not mall punk). Not crust. And the list could go on.
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Fans of the dancier, no wave, arty-sax variety of post-punk will love this one:
The World, Reddish
Also, all of the DIY mailorder emails I received this week listed a mix-tape cassette of Japanese post-punk, goth, and new wave. None feature a tracklist but I found this mix on Youtube that might fit. Double-cassette, two links. Perhaps the same mixes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jElaxhpNbVY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3chbIFKu6woLast edited by danielmak; 18-04-2019, 19:20.
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This one was reviewed on Pitchfork today. I like what I've listened to so far.
Control Top: https://controltop.bandcamp.com/
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A bit more new wave than post-punk but still relevant if you like synth-heavy post punk with new wave melodies:
Riki: https://riki.bandcamp.com/releases
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I don't know if I have a top 10 post punk albums list, but Pornography would certainly be near the top if not at the top. And "The Hanging Garden" is really the perfect representation of gothy post-punk (now often called dark punk):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPIsj1wqdfU
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If we're talking The Cure, Seventeen Seconds earns the spot more readily for me, with its sparse landscape and decidedly 'un-punk' musicality.
A personal (ie, non-definitive) take:
01 Unknown Pleasures Joy Division
02 Second Edition PIL
03 Closer Joy Division
04 Cut The Slits
05 Seventeen Seconds The Cure
06 Colossal Youth Young Marble Giants
07 The Modern Dance Pere Ubu
08 Real Life Magazine
09 Live at the Witch Trials The Fall
10 Entertainment! Gang Of Four
(Dunno. Ask me again next week and it will likely be different.)
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For me, Unknown Pleasures, Pornography, something from Siouxsie and then it's all up in the air. On that last note, here's something I heard on a recent Maximum Rockandroll radio show that sounds a bit like Siouxsie:
Current Affairs from Glasgow
https://currentaffairs.bandcamp.com/...-draw-the-line
And this band from London, Child's Pose, also fits the thread
https://childspose.bandcamp.com/album/s-tLast edited by danielmak; 01-06-2019, 17:28.
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Originally posted by Jah Womble View PostIf we're talking The Cure, Seventeen Seconds earns the spot more readily for me, with its sparse landscape and decidedly 'un-punk' musicality.
A personal (ie, non-definitive) take:
01 Unknown Pleasures Joy Division
02 Second Edition PIL
03 Closer Joy Division
04 Cut The Slits
05 Seventeen Seconds The Cure
06 Colossal Youth Young Marble Giants
07 The Modern Dance Pere Ubu
08 Real Life Magazine
09 Live at the Witch Trials The Fall
10 Entertainment! Gang Of Four
(Dunno. Ask me again next week and it will likely be different.)Last edited by ale; 31-05-2019, 18:57.
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I listened to Seventeen Seconds the other day. 'Play For Today' is just bliss.
Originally posted by ale View PostPindrop- PassageLast edited by delicatemoth; 31-05-2019, 21:42.
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Originally posted by ale View PostThis more or less works for me with PiL swapping Joy Division. Would chop Young Marble Giants Pere Ubu & Gang Of Four for Playing With A Different Sex- Au Pairs, Pindrop- Passage & Heaven Up Here by Bunnymen. Though still surprising no room for any Banshees. Or Associates.
The only reason there's no Passage, Bunnymen, Banshees, Au Pairs or Associates was that there were only ten spaces. All top bands.
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Originally posted by Jah Womble View PostSo, in other words, it 'doesn't' really work for you!
The only reason there's no Passage, Bunnymen, Banshees, Au Pairs or Associates was that there were only ten spaces. All top bands.
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Originally posted by Sporting View PostThe first Fall LP has quite a number of tracks which I would categorize as punk rather than post punk, such as Industrial Estate, No Xmas for John Quays and Futures and Pasts.
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