The White Supremacy thread

[ursus arctos]

They do if there is a colourable claim of violations of civil rights or other federal law, but they are going to struggle to reach that threshold here.

[Tactical Genius]

I agree with Donald Trump.

(I just wanted to actually type the words.)

I do not necessarily disagree with you or Trump here. However, if this is going to be thre trend going forward, then all those white people who call the police on black people on a false premise. At least Jussie wasn't trying to get anyone killed.

To me this is providing a convenient distraction for the Democrats and Republicans.

[Gerontophile]

To me this is providing a convenient distraction for the Democrats and Republicans.

Unfortunately... and that's it, really.

[Gerontophile]

TG: it should be noted, that you are a lot more clued up on American politics than I am. (Although, locally, I am a little better than nothing)

For the anti-lynching bill, which I barely knew was a thing (my brain only has so much space for so much outrage, and I am sorry for that) I had a vague idea of the attempted exclusions of the christians doing their thing, but there is such a huge amount of shit ongoing that I barely noticed. I am getting too fucking old to fight on so many fronts, with so few weapons. And, I am tired of it, which should be no excuse.

Thanks for keeping me honest.

[Lurgee]

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1111214993293357056?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1111214993293357056&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Ftalkingpointsmemo.com%2Fnews%2Ftrump-announces-fbi-doj-probe-into-smollett

So he like the FBI this week.

[ursus arctos]

https://twitter.com/samswey/status/1111700084822028288

[Satchmo Distel]

I'm not much clearer from the video on what the cops were thinking except that there seem to have been around six or seven cops there with guns raised to take down a sleeping man. Not raising hands seems to be interpreted now as a valid reason to shoot even if the guy is unable to raise his hands.

But I'd welcome a neat summary of why the verdict was perverse.

[ursus arctos]

There's some more detail in this Guardian piece, none of which is helpful to the police.

There hasn't been any "verdict", unless you are talking about the cops acting as judge, jury and executioner. The family hasn't even filed suit yet, though they undoubtedly will.

[Satchmo Distel]

Thanks. And here's an earlier Guardian report showing that there was a history of profiling in the department:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...g-willie-mccoy

[ursus arctos]

And one of the cops in this incident had previously shot a different unarmed man.

[Tactical Genius]

Reposting from a couple of weeks ago that got zero response

https://abc13.com/man-charged-for-re...spot-/5211491/

So a man gets into an argument with a lady and pulls a gun on her
She pulls out her phone to call the police
He slaps the phone out of her hand (probably smashing it)
She strikes him and he starts to punch her repeatedly in the face.


He is initially charged with Misdemeanors, aggravated assault, interfering with a 911 call and Public intoxication.
After demonstrations from the black community, his charges were upgraded to Felonies, however, the black lady was also charged with a felony
After another uproar, the felony charges have been dropped.

Also note in a video article, they already had a mitigation from her boss so as to frame the narrative the black woman obviously provoked him into behaving out of character.

[Tactical Genius]

Another strange occurrence.

Rapper Nipsey Hustle was shot dead on 31st March in suspicious circumstances. Alot of people suspect this was an organised hit due to the effect he was having in the community.

Without going into so-call conspiracy theories, certain facts of what happened afterwards do not add up:

After the shooting the killer managed to make a clean getaway:- Now, I am not an expert on the street layout of Los Angeles. However, on the handful of times I have been there one thing was constant, getting anywhere fast, especially at street level during the day is almost impossible.

He managed to hide out in LA for two days with Law enforcement and practically every black and Latino gang from looking for him.

The so-called getaway driver claimed she did not know what he was going to do before hand and when he got in the car, had no idea he had committed a shooting. The police accepted her explanation and til today have not arrested or charged her

He was arrested when checking into a mental institution by a handful of police officers with no fuss. no struggle, no SWAT. Bear in mind he has a long criminal record and has killed before.

He is being represented by Christopher Darden (yes, him from the OJ Simpson trial)

He was given Bail of $7 Million, which was reduced to $5 million.

Is this usual for a low level black street criminal with gang affiliations.

[Tactical Genius]

I would like the observations of the OTF legal contingent on the points above, especially how he managed to retain the services for Christopher Darden, and who's paying for all of this?

Did I mention he is a known police informant (the accused not Darden).

[WOM]

Convenient disclaimers about conspiracy theories aside, what exactly do you suspect is going on? What are the mysterious circumstances in which NH was shot?
What's so suspicious about a murder suspect evading police for TWO ENTIRE DAYS in a huge city? What's the value of immediately arresting the getaway driver if her story appears to check out?
What's suspicious about the time and place of his arrest? What's suspicious about a high-dollar bail amount in a high-profile killing of a celebrity?
The Christopher Darden thing is interesting, but it wouldn't be the first time a high-profile lawyer took a pro-bono case in the name of publicity.

[Tactical Genius]

Convenient disclaimers about conspiracy theories aside, what exactly do you suspect is going on? What are the mysterious circumstances in which NH was shot?
What's so suspicious about a murder suspect evading police for TWO ENTIRE DAYS in a huge city? What's the value of immediately arresting the getaway driver if her story appears to check out?
What's suspicious about the time and place of his arrest? What's suspicious about a high-dollar bail amount in a high-profile killing of a celebrity?
The Christopher Darden thing is interesting, but it wouldn't be the first time a high-profile lawyer took a pro-bono case in the name of publicity.

I am asking the questions as I wanted the opinions of others rather than wading in with mine.
My "convenient disclaimers" are to do with some theorising why he may have been shot in the first place. I have not mention those as I didn't wish to muddy the waters at this moment. I am happy to discuss them later (and if i don't feel free to remind me).

Do you not see any red flags, if not, that's interesting........

[WOM]

No, I genuinely don't. I see a black guy who shot another black guy - in a city with a strong gang culture - who may have been a target either due to celebrity or activism. The cops caught the suspect in a reasonable amount of time, and bail was set responsibly high for a murder suspect. A publicity-hungry celeb lawyer shouldn't be much of an issue, either. Honestly, I'm curious as to what you're seeing that I'm not.

[Tactical Genius]

Convenient disclaimers about conspiracy theories aside, what exactly do you suspect is going on? What are the mysterious circumstances in which NH was shot?
What's so suspicious about a murder suspect evading police for TWO ENTIRE DAYS in a huge city? What's the value of immediately arresting the getaway driver if her story appears to check out?
What's suspicious about the time and place of his arrest? What's suspicious about a high-dollar bail amount in a high-profile killing of a celebrity?
The Christopher Darden thing is interesting, but it wouldn't be the first time a high-profile lawyer took a pro-bono case in the name of publicity.

Is a a bail amount for a known criminal with a long rap sheet and gang affiliations killing someone famous common. Is lowering this bail amount common. I can assure you it wouldn't be in the UK

The Christopher Darden thing is interesting, but it wouldn't be the first time a high-profile lawyer took a pro-bono case in the name of publicity

Any other similar examples of a similar stripe, I would be interested to see them. Christopher Darden doesn't really need publicity does he. He is pretty much known world-wide for the OJ Simpson case and he could live off that comfortably for the rest of his life giving seminars, wriging books etc. Also the People vs OJ docudrama was on TV pretty recently so even the Millennials are acquainted with him

[WOM]

I'm not sure where you're going with the bail amount. It was lowered from an astronomical amount to a slightly less astronomical amount. Either way, I don't suspect he has the ready 10% ($500,000) to post a bond, so it's perhaps an academic question.

Um, yes, celeb lawyers keep coming back to the flame even after they've made their nut. You want a list of US celebrity lawyers who don't need the fame but still need the fame? Really? Dershowitz, Allred, Geragos, Howard K Stern, uh....

[Edit: Keep an eye out for Michael Avenatti after the Stormy Daniels finally thing goes away. That man loves the spotlight and will happily take on pro-bono if it gets him face time on CNN, etc. He's not a rarity in the genre.]

[Tactical Genius]

I'm not sure where you're going with the bail amount. It was lowered from an astronomical amount to a slightly less astronomical amount. Either way, I don't suspect he has the ready 10% ($500,000) to post a bond, so it's perhaps an academic question.

It is possible....

[/quote]
Um, yes, celeb lawyers keep coming back to the flame even after they've made their nut. You want a list of US celebrity lawyers who don't need the fame but still need the fame? Really? Dershowitz, Allred, Geragos, Howard K Stern, uh....

[Edit: Keep an eye out for Michael Avenatti after the Stormy Daniels finally thing goes away. That man loves the spotlight and will happily take on pro-bono if it gets him face time on CNN, etc. He's not a rarity in the genre.][/QUOTE]

Thanks, I googled the names and i am struggling to specific examples of Pro Bono Murder defence cases like this.

Aren't Pro Bono cases more common with civil cases (where the lawyer can get a percentage of any award) or overturning wrongful convictions where there is an apparent miscarriage of justice.
Defence cases like this often involve over a dozen people (Darden, assistant lawyers, Paraleagals, researchers and PI's) The best they can get is an insanity case.
Also bear in mind Darden earned his reputation as a prosecutor not a defence Attorney. I need help understanding all of this.

Again Avenatti got a cut of the Stormy Daniels money, plus he (if he had not messed up) would have been the go to guy for disgruntled side pieces looking for a payout.

[WOM]

Then I come to you again, with cap in hand, eyes downcast, and ask you respectfully 'what do you suspect is going on here?' What's the game that you think is afoot? If you think LA law enforcement and Big Law are conspiring to hush up the murder of a low-level rapper / community activist, by god man tell me.

[Tactical Genius]

Nipsey Hustle is not a low level rapper.
He is probably the best known underground rapper of the last decade.
His debut album released in 2018 was nominated for a Grammy (best Rap Album) losing out to Cardi B

Does that sound like the CV of a low level rapper, can you name a low level musicion in any Genre that has a Grammy noimination for best Albun?

Then I come to you again, with cap in hand, eyes downcast, and ask you respectfully 'what do you suspect is going on here?' What's the game that you think is afoot? If you think LA law enforcement and Big Law are conspiring to hush up the murder of a low-level rapper / community activist, by god man tell me.

I don't have an informed position as I don't know enough about the US legal system. You are telling me there is nothing strange.. because you say so. Like me, you are not US based, nor are you a lawyer. If you don't know, then it's cool. there isn't really any need for the passive/aggressive patronising tone is there.

[WOM]

You started this dialogue with 'Another strange occurrence'. What are you seeing that's strange. I don't give a damn about your 'informed position', I want to know what you suspect. If you don't actually suspect something, you probably wouldn't have started the dialogue.

[ursus arctos]

TG, I'm both US based and a lawyer, so:

1) Pro bono representation is indeed much more common in civil cases than it is criminal cases, but it isn't unheard of in the latter, up to an including murder. It so happens that I worked on a pro bono murder case very early in my career, where the primary issue was whether a variety of medical, chemical and psychological issues that plagued the defendant rendered incapable of forming the level of intent needed to be prosecuted under what was then California's capital murder statute. My firm, like many "major" New York law firms, has also worked on a number of death penalty appeals.

That said, these circumstances are not at all those where one would most expect pro bono criminal representation. However, given the number of murder prosecutions in the US every year, I'm pretty sure that it has happened before. Do we know for sure that Darden isn't being paid by someone?

2) It isn't uncommon for bail to be reduced in US criminal cases. Bail is often set by a judge before the defendant has informed representation (or indeed, any representation) and will be reduced after an informed lawyer can make a convincing argument that it should be lower. By US standards, USD 5 million is still very high for a defendant in these circumstances.

3) As I imagine you know, the LAPD has an extensive history of criminal activity that goes back at least to the 40s, and Black people are been the prime targets of that criminal activity much more often than mere chance would suggest. The circumstances of the investigation that you note strike me as being very worthy of skeptical review.

4) Virtually every notable criminal defence attorney in the US began his or her career as a prosecutor. It is an incredibly common career path, particularly for the talented and/or ambitious.

Hope this helps. As always, I'm happy to respond to other questions you (or anyone else) may have.

[Tactical Genius]

You started this dialogue with 'Another strange occurrence'. What are you seeing that's strange. I don't give a damn about your 'informed position', I want to know what you suspect. If you don't actually suspect something, you probably wouldn't have started the dialogue.

I have already outlined what I found strange. You seem to have missed them when the red mist descended (as it does whenever you address me lately I noticed).

[ursus arctos]

WOM, I know better than to try to speak for TG, but there are numerous aspects of this case that I find strange and inexplicable.

And yet I don't have any real suspicions as to exactly why that may be.