Irish Times

[Borracho]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Noonan is droning his way through the Budget speech.

Top ten twitter trends here right now:

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#Budget15
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#getsocial
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Ebola

What in the name of jaysus does anyone typing in "Ireland" expect to get?

[Ginger Yellow]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Ebola, apparently.

[Diable Rouge]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Robert Frost sales and searches will presumably skyrocket after Noonan declared us to be on "the road less travelled" of fiscal prudence and caution, unfortunately the broadcast still drones on, so we don't "have miles to go before we sleep"!

[Duncan Gardner]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Green Calx wrote: "Thousands of murders", strictly speaking, is a misnomer

Perhaps, but I'm not the biggest fan of your paper's style guide (see threads passim)

Suppose I could have said "about 2,000 murders".

The fully researched figure is a still-gruesome 1,823, and that includes all vaguely republican-associated murders and internecine killings not claimed by the PIRA or any other group. It works out at 49% of all the deaths in the Troubles

I use the Sutton Index, but would be interested in any source more reliable and up-to-date. Crudely- responsibility breaks down at 60% Nationalist paramilitaries, 30% Unionist, 10% Brits and unexplained. Take off a tenth or even fifth of the first two groups to allow for collusion and you're still looking at 70%+ from men in balaclavas.

I maintain that the deliberate and systematic degradation of the Irish health service since 1987 or so, carried out primarily in order to force the middle classes of Ireland into the waiting arms of private healthcare interests, has bumped off a lot more people than the Provos did

And no doubt you'll back that with fully-researched figures. You'll understand that I'm a little wary of, essentially, 'Say what ye like about the Provies but Reynolds and Bruton killed more people'. I think Denis Skinner and George Galloway would be wary of saying that about Thatcher or Blair to be honest.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

I maintain that the deliberate and systematic degradation of the Irish health service since 1987 or so, carried out primarily in order to force the middle classes of Ireland into the waiting arms of private healthcare interests, has bumped off a lot more people than the Provos did. Not that it makes the Provos any better, but I don't want to hear it from a shower of ghouls like Fianna Fail or their blue buddies

ah now, do you have any idea how much money we have spent on health in the last 20 years?

[Borracho]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

A hell of a lot less than we've spent on (for instance) paying off the bondholders in the last five years. Mary Harney was health minister from 2004 to 2011 and even her reign wasn't as bad as what happened when Haughey got back in in 1987.

DG -- the 1,823 figure comes from the CAIN project at the University of Ulster. Which on closer inspection also appears to be linked to your Sutton Index.

http://www.cain.ulst.ac.uk/sutton/book/index.html#append

[Duncan Gardner]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Talking of Charlie, the current Ulster unionist branch chair at BelAir Uni (previous incumbents include Arlene Foster) is one Skye Haughey.

OK, Aughey, but it'd be funny if they were even distantly related.

[Diable Rouge]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Just when Gerry thought SF were unstoppable, those sex abuse allegations aren't going away, you know.

[Duncan Gardner]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

I saw the BBC programme on the Cahill case this week. It should be said that her alleged attacker has already been tried and cleared by a Belfast Court.

More generally, the shit will stick as long as Adams is in nominal charge. Any rumors down South of him retiring to watch pre-school TV with his grandkids?

[Diable Rouge]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Latest wheeze by An Quango Nua, otherwise known as Irish Water:

Staff to get 19% bonus for exceeding targets, 14% for meeting targets, and 9% if performance requires improvement.

[Duncan Gardner]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Watched the end of that Mairia Cahill programme. She describes the Bon Jovi Kangaroo Court where some half-witted female Joey is reading out the charge sheet. "By the authority of Oglaigh Erin...Ugly Eireann...er, the Army". I mean, how hard is it to remember a pub stripper's name?

[Diable Rouge]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Yet another Independents Day:

Red C poll:

FG 26% (-2)
SF 20%(-3)
FF 18% (0)
Lab 8% (0)
Ind/Oth 28% (+5)

Sunday Times:

FG 25% (+1)
SF 19% (0)
FF 18% (0)
Lab 9% (-5)
Ind/Oth 28% (+4)

Clearly, the others have gained on the back of the water protests.

[Diable Rouge]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Today, it seems every medium to large-sized town and city is holding a protest over water charges. Ironically, the spread may actually dilute the campaign's impact, compared to the last concentrated march in Dublin.

[Duncan Gardner]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Paul Culloty wrote: Ironically, the spread may actually dilute the campaign's impact

And presumably, increase the charge...

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

well if you don't pay at the beginning, you'll wind up paying twice as much apparently.

[Borracho]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

The government are making it up as they go along.

The amount they would extract from the public even if everybody paid up instantly is €175 million, which is not the kind of sum that makes a huge difference to anything in the national context. The main motive behind this whole thing has always been to privatise the water supply.

[Borracho]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Overall nationwide turnout for the protests is estimated at 150,000, or 3.5 per cent of the population. That's despite the utterly shitty weather all over the country this afternoon (fittingly in the circumstances).

Given how notoriously reluctant the Irish electorate usually is to protest publicly about anything, that's a serious figure. The turnout in Donegal appears to have been the highest by a mile, in terms of per head of population.

[Toro Toro]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

The government should offer Donegal people a referendum to reverse the water charges. It would completely blow their minds.

[Diable Rouge]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Meanwhile, SF are the largest party, in a new Sunday Independent poll:

Sinn Féin: 26%(+4)
Fine Gael 22%(-3)
Fianna Fáil 20%(-1)
Labour 7%(-2)
Ind/Others 25%(0)

[Borracho]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

That poll is startling for two reasons. One, SF's support appears actually to have hardened, suggesting that a lot of people perceive the Mairia Cahill controversy as a rape victim being cynically used by other parties. Two, it's a Sindo poll. Certain people in there will be going nuts tonight.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

that is indeed startling, because she is doing most of the pushing herself, and while the other parties may be using it against sinn fein, that is because sinn fein moved a load of child rapists into unsuspecting communities south of the border, even after the cease fire and the acceptance of the PSNI.

[Borracho]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

I don't think that's the only reason why they're using it against SF.

Anyway, it just shows you how bad things have got. There is apparently an economic recovery in full swing, but it has so far left about 80% of the population untouched.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

well how exactly are you supposed to bring up the delicate topic that a political party has a leadership made up of evil sociopaths?

[Borracho]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

They do it literally two or three times a week in the Dail.

[Diable Rouge]

The 2016 Irish election is over!

Expect the Sindo headline to be something like "Fewer voters than ever trust Adams", not that Harris & Co will need much motivation. Most interesting is that a potential "Troika Coalition" adding FF to the current mix only comes to 49%, so less than 60% of seats.

Apparently, Enda now saying that the only alternative to Irish Water is increasing income tax 4%, yes, that's the ideal way to get waverers in line ...