It's astonishing that people manage to blame Puigdemont for the behaviour of the Spanish state.
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Originally posted by steveeeeeeeee View PostSo, since last week, Puigdemont's actions have stripped Catalonia of the autonomy it had and they will spend the next 5 years grovelling to regain the autonomy they once had. To top it all off, he flees the country whilst all his senior colleagues are imprisoned. What is "complete and utter twat" in Catalan?
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He fled of his own accord. He was elected democratically yet didn't follow the rules of democracy himself. He's a fool who has damaged any possibility of Catalonia seeing independence in his own lifetime.
There is no good guy, bad guy in this scenario, just right wing nationalist bad guy and foolish posturing regionalist bad guy. I'm over the moon the the only consequences of this horrible situation are politicians being arrested rather than innocent people being harmed.
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Actually, fked of his own accord, i mean there was no threat of arrest when he went to Belgium. The fact he fled and stayed there probably led to the arrest of his colleagues.
Yeah, in a ideal world states would not exist and laws would not be required to define borders. But for now, they don't and to play with people's lives to create more borders deserves punishment from someone.
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Originally posted by steveeeeeeeee View PostActually, fked of his own accord, i mean there was no threat of arrest when he went to Belgium. The fact he fled and stayed there probably led to the arrest of his colleagues.
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Originally posted by steveeeeeeeee View PostIdeally, Rajoy will get his comeuppance eventually as a result of that. But to defend puigdemont just because Rajoy also makes bad decisions does not compute.
I agree, that's not the only reason for defending Catalonian independence.
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Originally posted by steveeeeeeeee View PostActually, fked of his own accord, i mean there was no threat of arrest when he went to Belgium. The fact he fled and stayed there probably led to the arrest of his colleagues.
Yeah, in a ideal world states would not exist and laws would not be required to define borders. But for now, they don't and to play with people's lives to create more borders deserves punishment from someone.
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Originally posted by Nefertiti2 View PostAre you really saying Puigemont is responsible for the actions of the Spanish government? He didn't need increased autonomy since he was already in power in Madrid?
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Puigdemont has had nothing to do with arms or conflict. He's called for mediation. The only people whose strategy may involve the use of arms are the Spanish Government. If there's armed conflict the responsibility lies with those who are ready to use the arms, not the people who they use them on.
I don't see how you can blame Puigdemont for the Spanish Government's apparent readiness to use arms on what it still considers are its own citizens.
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Originally posted by steveeeeeeeee View PostThis again? Of course he's not responsible for the actions of the Spanish government. Puigdemont is responsible for playing with the safety and security of Catalans by dragging them dangerously close to a an armed conflict. When he realises his people don't want this in the numbers he anticipated, that those human barriers around the Catalan Assembly are unlikely, he buggers off to Belgium. A coward and a hypocrite, like most flame-fanners of regionalism.
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35,000 protesting in Bilbao today:
http://www.eldiario.es/catalunya/pol...685361458.html
And interestingly, without any official PNV attendance.Last edited by Diable Rouge; 04-11-2017, 18:49.
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My definition of harm is losing jobs, land, housing and lives, all things Catalans have in relative abundance compared to much of Spain. Yet all things Puigdemont was willing to play with to satisfy his greed and ego. If your definition of harm is being baton charged by police then tell me a police force, national or local, in Iberia that we shouldn't have beef with?
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Originally posted by E10 Rifle View PostI'm happy to have beef with all of them to be honest. So, again, baton-charging people in polling stations: right or wrong?
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