Hosts as automatic qualifiers

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

One does have to question, if the hosts are going to be so abject that they just roll up and lose games 7-1, if they really deserve the automatic place. Or at the very least, the automatic "A1" seeding slot in the draw.

[Southport Zeb]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

In 1934 Italy had to qualify, despite being hosts. They beat Greece 4-0 in Milan before the Greeks withdrew.

[anton pulisov]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

Yeah, even Ireland can do better than 7-1 at home.

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

My flippancy aside, do you think Brazil would have been a better team at this World Cup if they'd had to go through qualifying? The closest they've had to a competitive game in the last three years was the Confed Cup Final against Spain, who treated the thing as a "B" team holiday at best.

[Satchmo Distel]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

They made the semi-finals, which is farther than they got in 06 and 2010, when they had to qualify. Germany might do the same to Argentina for all we know.

[Sean of the Shed]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

Rogin o adepto de sofá wrote: My flippancy aside, do you think Brazil would have been a better team at this World Cup if they'd had to go through qualifying? The closest they've had to a competitive game in the last three years was the Confed Cup Final against Spain, who treated the thing as a "B" team holiday at best.

They probably wish they'd sent the "B" team back there this summer.

[tee rex]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

The shift in economic power (i.e. TV and advertisers) means Asia will be hosting more World Cups. So we may have to get used to early exits.

Stand by for the big controversy of c. 2030, when Australia get the gig (thanks to Asian timezones) and toss a couple of group games over to New Zealand - who then qualify as co-hosts. Although by then it'll be a 64 team tournament ...

[Pietro Paolo Virdis]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

satchmo76 wrote: They made the semi-finals

Kind'a answered right there

[jason voorhees]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

An interesting thing is how often or not hosts are at their peak or top fighting form when hosting.

2014 - Brasil was obviously the weakest they've been in about 20 years. Who knows how long until they're back in fighting form.

2010 - South Africa was in a very weak stage, and 8 years off their peak.

2006 - Germany was 8 years off their peak in the future, and 16 years off their peak before.

2002 - South Korea was at their peak, and Japan was close.

1998 - France was at their absolute peak, and maybe the most of any host ever.

1994 - The USA was 8 years off their peak.

1990 - Italy was 8 years off their past peak, and 4 years away from their future.

1986 - Mexico was close or at its peak.

1982 - Spain was nowhere near its peak, but 4 years away from fighting form.

1978 - They still had to win a lot of games, if not all.

1974 - This team probably shaded France as greatest host, but only because they had to beat a better finalist. However, France probably would've stuffed both Cruyff and Beckenbauer.

1970 - Not at their peak.

1966 - ....

[Sam]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

satchmo76 wrote: They made the semi-finals, which is farther than they got in 06 and 2010, when they had to qualify. Germany might do the same to Argentina for all we know.

Or to the Netherlands.

[tuckwat]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

Will Brazil even qualify for the next world cup?

[Jah Womble]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

2006 - Germany was 8 years off their peak in the future, and 16 years off their peak before.

I don't think that Germany at their own World Cup (or in 2010, for that matter) were any worse than the current crop, tbh.

2010 - South Africa was in a very weak stage, and 8 years off their peak.

Interesting prediction.

[Jah Womble]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

My flippancy aside, do you think Brazil would have been a better team at this World Cup if they'd had to go through qualifying? The closest they've had to a competitive game in the last three years was the Confed Cup Final against Spain, who treated the thing as a "B" team holiday at best.

Completely agree that not having top-line competition has hampered Brazil, but Spain really didn't go into the Confeds without a care: it wasn't a World Cup, but they wanted to win that tournament nonetheless. During the final (wherein of course Brazil gave their ageing side a serious working-over), the cracks were seriously beginning to show. Which was then highlighted - obviously - by their own capitulation at this World Cup.

[Satchmo Distel]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

tuckwat wrote: Will Brazil even qualify for the next world cup?

FIFA would do everything in their power to ensure it, such as a play-off versus Tahiti.

[Ek weet nie]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

Didn't South Africa play in the qualifiers for 2010 as it doubled up as the CAF qualifiers. They were assured of a place regardless and didn't do well as I remember.

[Satchmo Distel]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

If Russia get similarly humiliated in 2018, will it make policians think twice about whether hosting is something that's good for their national image?

[Jah Womble]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

FIFA would do everything in their power to ensure it, such as a play-off versus Tahiti.

Anyone would think that Brazil had never qualified fairly in their history.

This stuff is now becoming over-egged to the point of omelettegeddon.

[Harbinger of Hope]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

I don't think they should have to qualify, but I don't think they should be automatically seeded in the top pot.

If 2022 goes ahead in Qatar, it could be the weakest Group A in history. Practically a bye for the pot 2 team. Unless it's England of course.

[Southport Zeb]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

Ek weet nie wrote: Didn't South Africa play in the qualifiers for 2010 as it doubled up as the CAF qualifiers. They were assured of a place regardless and didn't do well as I remember.

Correct. South Africa were eliminated at the first group stage - to qualify for the World Cup a side had to win their second round group; for Nations Cup qualification a side had to be in the top three in the final group.

[jwdd27]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

Harbinger of Hulk wrote: I don't think they should have to qualify, but I don't think they should be automatically seeded in the top pot.

If 2022 goes ahead in Qatar, it could be the weakest Group A in history. Practically a bye for the pot 2 team. Unless it's England of course.

South Africa's Group A was with Mexico, Uruguay and France, which was fairly competitive. They finished 3rd on goal difference from Mexico.

However, that Group A could conceivably have been with North Korea, Paraguay and Slovenia, so you do have a point.

I'm sure there are rules where the (non-European) host can't get a same federation team in the group, so if the host is from a weak federation, e.g. Asia, Africa, they automatically get tough European/South American opposition, which evens out their seeding.

[danielmak]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

What's the story with the roving Euro in 2020? If the tournament is played in multiple countries does that mean there are multiple automatic entrants or will every country be playing in qualifying?

[N est à?]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

European and South American opposition is not automatically tough though.

[Satchmo Distel]

Hosts as automatic qualifiers

It does not "even out their seeding" because they avoid the Top 8 seeds and thus will get the 2nd or 3rd tier of European and South American sides, whose quality is not necessarily superior. Meanwhile it also ensures that a big side gets demoted to 2nd tier status, so there's more chance of unbalanced groups (more chances of, e.g. the quality of Spain's group in 2014 versus that of Colombia's group)