Why do we dislike England?

[RobM]

Why do we dislike England?

meregreen wrote:

Surely therein lies the rub? For Wales, beating England would be a big deal. One sided as it may be that still constitutes a rivalry of sorts in that they are looking to put one over on you when able. It does sound arrogant and patronising and that is pretty much the whole ABE thing in a nutshell, we enjoy it more when there's plenty hubris on the Angles part, the higher the fall the funnier.

Of course it would be a big deal for Wales. But it wouldn't be much of a deal for England to beat Wales. For Tranmere, beating Everton would be a big deal, but it wouldn't be a big deal for Everton fans to beat Tranmere.

Is that patronising or just an an accurate reflection of the way things are? Wouldn't it be more patronising to feign interest in the fixture?

This does neglect to take into account the fact that England are in no way good enough to take for granted a result against any of the home nations (poor as we currently are). There's the arrogance that helps fuel the ABE fire.

[Jah Womble]

Why do we dislike England?

In the 1970s, I can recall disliking Keegan because he was a superstar footballer with no obvious gifts who somehow dominated the team. Although I was English, I could see that Scotland had better players (1977 being the classic case).

Yes, they did - the teams that went to the 1974 and 1978 World Cups were both pretty mighty. Shame they couldn't get it together while out there.

As for Keegan, he 'dominated the team' because he was by some way the best we had at the time. Not as gifted as some, but arguably more consistent in his international performances than anyone since Charlton. (You couldn't be sure what you were going to get from Ray Wilkins, let alone someone like Tony Currie.) Keegan always seemed a pretty straight-up kind of guy to me - okay, there were the Brut ads, Superstars, his 'recording career' and that Little & Large moment, but it was all pretty innocuous stuff, tbh.

Mark Wright was as obnoxious as John Terry, we just didn't know (or worse, care).

The incidents with the referee (2001) and Peterborough staff member (2005) were some time after Wright's playing career, though. If he made any racial slurs as a player, then they either went unreported or uncontested.

[Gangster Octopus]

Why do we dislike England?

satchmo76 wrote: politicians at games

Yeah, only England do that...

[meregreen]

Why do we dislike England?

RoberMnicus wrote:

This does neglect to take into account the fact that England are in no way good enough to take for granted a result against any of the home nations (poor as we currently are). There's the arrogance that helps fuel the ABE fire.

Well, naturally, any win for this England team is welcome, but I'd get no more pleasure out of beating Wales than I would out of beating Peru or Slovakia (the teams directly above and below Wales in the current FIFA rankings).

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Why do we dislike England?

Symbols of "Big country nationalism" just reflexively piss off people from the smaller countries around them. At least the germans had the decency to be embarrassed a bit for a while. but 10-15 years of actual football hooligan invasions and the warlike talk around every england campaign just subconsciously raises the hackles. maybe we've heard too many folksongs or something.

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

Why do we dislike England?

Well, I was taking it from a Welsh perspective as the thread isn't called "Why do we dislike Wales?".

Ooh, can we have a "why do we dislike Wales?" thread?

[Bored Of Education]

Why do we dislike England?

This does neglect to take into account the fact that England are in no way good enough to take for granted a result against any of the home nations (poor as we currently are).

Well, especially as the last win was so close. I have to say that, though it would be wonderful the first time or second time we beat them, the way that England are atrophying, I am not sure how much of a scalp it would become with only rivalry providing interest.

It is already getting boring being drawn against them. They aren't the prestige draw that they used to be. If we beat England now, unless it was a stylish shellacking, I am not sure it would be on the same level as when we beat Italy or Germany, for instance.

Ooh, can we have a "why do we dislike Wales?" thread?

We'd be pleased with the oxygen of publicity. Actually, I think I am enjoying our stealth rise.

[VTTBoscombe]

Why do we dislike England?

[quote]Jah Tomaszewski wrote:

Mark Wright was as obnoxious as John Terry, we just didn't know (or worse, care).

The incidents with the referee (2001) and Peterborough staff member (2005) were some time after Wright's playing career, though. If he made any racial slurs as a player, then they either went unreported or uncontested.

Actually wasn't there something earlier on with Mark Wright when he was at Southampton as a young'un, and sexual high jinks charges being bought against him and a number of the "Saints" after some party or something?
I remember someone "laughingly" claiming on TV that it was actually Laurie McMenemy with Alan Ball on his shoulders, who "did it".

[My Name Is Ian]

Why do we dislike England?

Mark Wright was involved with the Vaughans at Chester a few years ago and again this year. Widnes FC applied to join the NWCL this summer and their application was withdrawn. Pffft.

[Satchmo Distel]

Why do we dislike England?

Wales's history in 1976-1996 proved Tony Hancock's maxim, "It's not the despair, it's the hope." A 24 team Euros brings back hope so is dangerous in a way for teams in their position.

[Wyatt Earp]

Why do we dislike England?

VTTBoscombe wrote: Actually wasn't there something earlier on with Mark Wright when he was at Southampton as a young'un, and sexual high jinks charges being bought against him and a number of the "Saints" after some party or something?
I remember someone "laughingly" claiming on TV that it was actually Laurie McMenemy with Alan Ball on his shoulders, who "did it".

Hang on: "sexual hi-jinks" isn't generally something people are charged with. What exactly are we on about here?

[Ray de Galles]

Why do we dislike England?

satchmo76 wrote: Wales's history in 1976-1996 proved Tony Hancock's maxim, "It's not the despair, it's the hope." A 24 team Euros brings back hope so is dangerous in a way for teams in their position.

John Cleese in 'Clockwise' rather than Hancock and widely referenced.

[Evan Evian]

Why do we dislike England?

I really could write a book on this topic. But how about we start with this?

Hubris often indicates a loss of contact with reality and an overestimation of one's own competence or capabilities.

Alan Shearer at one point in the build up to that game declared with glee to the world at large that not a single German player could possibly get into the England team: Germany comfortably beat them 4-1.

Sadly I have not yet found the clip of him saying that but I'll keep looking.

Other factors include the element of 'oxygen thieves' in the fan-base that gather in pubs to indulge in barely 'one level above the EDL' tub-thumping.

The radically 'deflationary' footballing ethos embodied and embraced by the England national team.

I could go on but I want to gather my thoughts before I go all Theodore Dalrymple or Roger Scruton on the rejection of beauty and the pro-active celebration of ugliness and vulgarity in many aspects of modern English life.

I'm joking about Dalrymple or Scruton - I'm more an Alasdair MacIntyre type. But to be fair Scruton has written quite a good book on beauty and its value in human life.

Anyways I'm rapidly getting off-topic...

[dalliance]

Why do we dislike England?

Well, especially as the last win was so close. I have to say that, though it would be wonderful the first time or second time we beat them, the way that England are atrophying, I am not sure how much of a scalp it would become with only rivalry providing interest.

Another way of looking at it is that England simply don't actually care about qualifiers against Wales. International football for players of bigger nations is a case of what's the least we can get away with doing between tournaments as we have a Champions League game next week, or a Sky Super Sunday fixture coming up.

So England might well be atrophying, but it's not going to be to the level where it brings Wales or the other home nations to any sort of equal playing field.

[Moonlight Shadow]

Why do we dislike England?

I have to say that, keeping in line with far more modest buildup before the usual silliness crept in the minute Rooney opened his gob, the postmortem appears to be really restrained and realistic. In a few days, no doubt, the first "Only a good manager away from greatness" and "Best players in the best league" will creep back in from the usual dick in the media but right now, there is much to like about the modesty on show.

[jeanmid]

Why do we dislike England?

Ok as other have mentioned who is behind Evan? for he has got to be a parody

[Ray de Galles]

Why do we dislike England?

I think it's all too obvious now that it's EIM.

[DCI Harry Batt]

Why do we dislike England?

Seems odd to have yet another thread, but anyway - it's England, it's where I live. I imagine I might well be anti-France if I lived there.

[Bruno]

Why do we dislike England?

jonmid wrote: Ok as other have mentioned who is behind Evan? for he has got to be a parody

You have to admit, the footballing ethos embodied and embraced by the England national team is radically 'deflationary'.

[VTTBoscombe]

Why do we dislike England?

Mykolai on Earth wrote:

Actually wasn't there something earlier on with Mark Wright when he was at Southampton as a young'un, and sexual high jinks charges being bought against him and a number of the "Saints" after some party or something?
I remember someone "laughingly" claiming on TV that it was actually Laurie McMenemy with Alan Ball on his shoulders, who "did it".

Hang on: "sexual hi-jinks" isn't generally something people are charged with. What exactly are we on about here?

Doing a bit of Googling, to try and dust of memory banks - It was actually after a UEFA cup game in Swerden when Steve Moran and Mark Wright were accused of raping a local woman, near Norrkoping - cannot find what happened to case; but seem to remember it being dropped.
So slightly more than high jinks .
Rather confusing link, as it looks at the start like it was Sophia Loren was somehow involved.
Scanned Newspaper cutting

[VTTBoscombe]

Why do we dislike England?

In my discussions over the footie with French colleagues/friends - either they are being super polite (which they are not usually); but the way England played, especially , I kid you not, against Italy, has won a lot of admirers.

I thought that, although the French had issues, their quality was higher than England's; but to these guys, those Rosbifs showed the French the right way to play, tried hard, and could have won.
While their Bleus, in their opinion, never tried, never created and nothing poistive to say about them.
Amazing really.

[EIM]

Why do we dislike England?

Beltrano Carpinteiro wrote: I think it's all too obvious now that it's EIM.

To highbrow for me. Is it not Chippy?

[Sean of the Shed]

Why do we dislike England?

Erics Inner Monologue wrote:

I think it's all too obvious now that it's EIM.

To highbrow for me. Is it not Chippy?

Plus it's gone on too long, you'd have ceased to have been arsed with such a tedious character long before now.

[Ray de Galles]

Why do we dislike England?

Erics Inner Monologue wrote:

I think it's all too obvious now that it's EIM.

To highbrow for me.

Yeah, it was a gag because he was so un-you.

[EIM]

Why do we dislike England?

Beltrano Carpinteiro wrote:

I think it's all too obvious now that it's EIM.

To highbrow for me.

Yeah, it was a gag because he was so un-you.

That's twice in a couple of days I've made a to/too error an all. Awful

You say that it's un-me, I've been carrying on my Wyatt Earp charade for over a decade now and no one has twigged.