English fourth division 2023-24

[shadsworth cloud]

There has been a great deal of angst at Accrington after the dismissal of Coleman and Bell last Sunday, I will try to put it in some context.
Coleman and Bell have been at the club for decades, they took a short break from (I think) 2010 to 2013 but other wise there since 1990's. In that time the club went from Unibond league to League One (and then back to League 2). Inevitably that has led to icon status amongst some of the fans, although all but one of those promotions are now nearly 20 years ago. Fans who recall the non-league years see Coleman and Bell as instrumental in bringing the club forward.
However, the past 3 seasons has seen a sharp downturn in performances and results. The reasons will vary depending on who you speak to. Some put it down to injuries, capricious refs, or even the laws of football gravity that it was impossible to survive in League One with a budget dwarfed by other teams there. Others question the quality of players brought in, the tactical decisions, the motivation of Coleman and Bell.
Of course, many fans expected them to leave at the end of last season, but if you support Accrington you have to accept the management team will always be there and like it or lump it.

Andy Holt, the owner, is a self made local man who has earned his wealth in plastics. He obviously did not get to be a millionaire by tolerating failure, and last season was certainly that. However, he stuck with Coleman and Bell partly through recognition of past success and (more likely) through faith that they could turn it around.
Coleman and Bell apparently demanded 3 year contracts after relegation, which Holt declined to offer. Instead he offered to discuss one-year renewable contracts once the threat of relegation from League 2 was gone. However, the atmosphere deteriorated after Bell went ton local radio to say that he and Coleman had built this club from nothing, it was their doing, etc. On the face of it, not controversial but Holt who was writing cheques to keep the club going after the relegation blew his top. He felt that his financing played as big a part in building the club as his manager's contribution.

It then all went quiet (from the fan's point of view) but clearly behind the scenes things were not going well. Neither were they going well on the pitch as defeat followed defeat. On Saturday, a 4-0 defeat at Wrexham was followed by dismissal for Coleman and Bell. The statement on the website was curt, to say the least. Barely 7 lines. Many fans felt this disrespectful to the management who had given so much success (albeit most of that was 20 years ago)
Holt has tried to put his side of the story but inevitably battle lines are drawn and fair to say, the fanbase is pretty well split. From my viewpoint, many believe it was time for a change but feel unhappy at how it was handled. Some of the louder ones on social media think it is a huge injustice and are ready to march on the stadium waving pitchforks and burning torches. Some others are delighted to see the back of the management and hope to find some improvement on the pitch.

It is sad to see such animosity. We have few enough fans as it is without driving any away under a hail of insults. but crowds have been dropping as the team has failed this past 2 years and it was a shame to see Coleman/Bell's legacy draining away.
Saturday we play Bradford. I am hoping everyone can just get behind the team and we can get back to footabll after a week of recriminations

[Cousin Boneless]

There has been a great deal of angst at Accrington after the dismissal of Coleman and Bell last Sunday, I will try to put it in some context.
Coleman and Bell have been at the club for decades, they took a short break from (I think) 2010 to 2013 but other wise there since 1990's. In that time the club went from Unibond league to League One (and then back to League 2). Inevitably that has led to icon status amongst some of the fans, although all but one of those promotions are now nearly 20 years ago. Fans who recall the non-league years see Coleman and Bell as instrumental in bringing the club forward.
However, the past 3 seasons has seen a sharp downturn in performances and results. The reasons will vary depending on who you speak to. Some put it down to injuries, capricious refs, or even the laws of football gravity that it was impossible to survive in League One with a budget dwarfed by other teams there. Others question the quality of players brought in, the tactical decisions, the motivation of Coleman and Bell.
Of course, many fans expected them to leave at the end of last season, but if you support Accrington you have to accept the management team will always be there and like it or lump it.

Andy Holt, the owner, is a self made local man who has earned his wealth in plastics. He obviously did not get to be a millionaire by tolerating failure, and last season was certainly that. However, he stuck with Coleman and Bell partly through recognition of past success and (more likely) through faith that they could turn it around.
Coleman and Bell apparently demanded 3 year contracts after relegation, which Holt declined to offer. Instead he offered to discuss one-year renewable contracts once the threat of relegation from League 2 was gone. However, the atmosphere deteriorated after Bell went ton local radio to say that he and Coleman had built this club from nothing, it was their doing, etc. On the face of it, not controversial but Holt who was writing cheques to keep the club going after the relegation blew his top. He felt that his financing played as big a part in building the club as his manager's contribution.

It then all went quiet (from the fan's point of view) but clearly behind the scenes things were not going well. Neither were they going well on the pitch as defeat followed defeat. On Saturday, a 4-0 defeat at Wrexham was followed by dismissal for Coleman and Bell. The statement on the website was curt, to say the least. Barely 7 lines. Many fans felt this disrespectful to the management who had given so much success (albeit most of that was 20 years ago)
Holt has tried to put his side of the story but inevitably battle lines are drawn and fair to say, the fanbase is pretty well split. From my viewpoint, many believe it was time for a change but feel unhappy at how it was handled. Some of the louder ones on social media think it is a huge injustice and are ready to march on the stadium waving pitchforks and burning torches. Some others are delighted to see the back of the management and hope to find some improvement on the pitch.

It is sad to see such animosity. We have few enough fans as it is without driving any away under a hail of insults. but crowds have been dropping as the team has failed this past 2 years and it was a shame to see Coleman/Bell's legacy draining away.
Saturday we play Bradford. I am hoping everyone can just get behind the team and we can get back to footabll after a week of recriminations

I think Andy Holt loves the sound of his own voice. Not sure if airing dirty laundry in public is wise.

[Snake Plissken]

One of those situations where there are only losers. Holt might have taken offence at being told he had little to do with the success of the club, but he will have been right to.

[ad hoc]

I think Andy Holt loves the sound of his own voice. Not sure if airing dirty laundry in public is wise.

Reading the story above it doesn't sound like he did air it in public, nor go public

[shadsworth cloud]

In fact, for the past 3 months Holt has been very quiet in public about the management of the club. (he did say some odd stuff about George Galloway and he pushes hard for the independent regulator).
Yesterday, he made a statement which i think was provoked by some of the wild speculation (e.g he woke up with a hangover on sunday morning and decided to can his manager)

[Crystal Staples]

Quite excited by this planned stadium expansion, it's going to look a really neat ground if this all happens.

[Uros Predic]

Quite excited by this planned stadium expansion, it's going to look a really neat ground if this all happens.

Is a ground of that capacity really needed?

And I ask this as the fan of a club who enjoyed an upward surge that brought in bigger crowds than we'd had for some years resulting in the construction of a 15,000 capacity stadium that is now rarely more than half full after said upward surge faded back into third and fourth tier inevitability. A bracket I don't think it's unfair to suggest Stockport could put themselves in.

[Harbinger of Hope]

Is a ground of that capacity really needed?

And I ask this as the fan of a club who enjoyed an upward surge that brought in bigger crowds than we'd had for some years resulting in the construction of a 15,000 capacity stadium that is now rarely more than half full after said upward surge faded back into third and fourth tier inevitability. A bracket I don't think it's unfair to suggest Stockport could put themselves in.

I'd heard a rumour that during the non-league years, a number of Stockport fans has started going to the Etihad instead. Any truth in that?

[Baptiste]

We’ve now beaten the top 3 in our last 7 games. Run out of games for a play off push but just makes the decision making last spring/summer look even worse.

[Crystal Staples]

I'd heard a rumour that during the non-league years, a number of Stockport fans has started going to the Etihad instead. Any truth in that?

Seems unlikely that that would have been anything more than one or two occasional followers, a notable element of the fan culture is being proud of having resisted the easy option of the Manchester clubs, and no-one was stopping them watching their football there pre-2011 anyway.

Is a ground of that capacity really needed?

And I ask this as the fan of a club who enjoyed an upward surge that brought in bigger crowds than we'd had for some years resulting in the construction of a 15,000 capacity stadium that is now rarely more than half full after said upward surge faded back into third and fourth tier inevitability. A bracket I don't think it's unfair to suggest Stockport could put themselves in.

There's always the down-cycle, this is true. It's all about how many you retain when that happens. We went from 2k to 8k during our 90s rise up the divisions, retaining about half of the newbies when back in division four, then troughing again in the first two NLN seasons to 2.5k. If we build up a similar head of steam now, it's starting from a much higher base. The other thing is the redevelopment is to happen in phases:

1. Extending the main stand in one direction (600 seat increase)
2. New end stand (3,000 seat increase)
3. New pop side stand (3,000 seat increase)
4. Extending the main stand in the other direction (600 seat increase)

Some supporters are saying the plan is to go through the phases as and when required, although I can't see that having been officially said. There have been enough sell outs in the last two years that the first two phases are justified as soon as possible. Then it would just be practical to wait and see what happens with attendances in the new capacity if Mark Stott keeps pumping money in.

[George C.]

7.2k increase?

Fair enough if you get the crowds, though haven't always had a positive impression of Stockport fans...

[HORN]

Back when I was completing the WSC L2 predictions, Newport County faced an uncertain future. There was a one million quid discrepancy in the accounts, the entire back four had swanned off to lucrative pastures new, our manager seemed to have given up hope, we were in turmoil. Not wishing to be a stick-in-the-mud I optimistically predicted we'd finish 22nd.

Currently we're one win off the playoff places. It's comical. Is this the shittest L2 ever or are Newport actually half-decent?

[Uros Predic]

D W D W W L D W W W W W

That's Doncaster's form over the last 12 matches. You can probably guess which one of those matches I attended.

[Discordant Resonance]

Back when I was completing the WSC L2 predictions, Newport County faced an uncertain future. There was a one million quid discrepancy in the accounts, the entire back four had swanned off to lucrative pastures new, our manager seemed to have given up hope, we were in turmoil. Not wishing to be a stick-in-the-mud I optimistically predicted we'd finish 22nd.

Currently we're one win off the playoff places. It's comical. Is this the shittest L2 ever or are Newport actually half-decent?

Admittedly, it doesn't take much these days to give Man United a good rattle, but you certainly played attractive football in that tie, and giving your cup record in recent seasons, there was definitely potential for league development if the Rodney Parade pitch remained in one piece.

[Ray de Galles]

Gah, now I have a rare positive feeling towards FGR :

https://twitter.com/fgrfc_official/status/1778729271822794923?s=46&t=YPTuyXx_pzpV4Wjm6pdF-Q

[MrLeam]

Gah, now I have a rare positive feeling towards FGR :

Don't be too complacent. Those fiends at FGR are cleverly saying that they don't want anti-Welsh language ahead of the game, but encouraging an anything-goes approach goes during it...

[Simon G]

Tbh - they probably only put that out because there was anti-Welsh singing in the home games against Wrexham or Newport earlier in the season and are fearing a fine from the EFL/FA.

[3 Colours Red]

Don't be too complacent. Those fiends at FGR are cleverly saying that they don't want anti-Welsh language ahead of the game, but encouraging an anything-goes approach goes during it...

Yeah - apparently it's OK to shag sheep as long as we don't eat them.

[Uros Predic]

I'd read that Forest Green tweet as anti Welsh language, as in mocking Cymraeg, rather than language that is anti Welsh people/things etc. Only clocked I read it wrong when coming on here.

[Patrick Thistle]

Don't be too complacent. Those fiends at FGR are cleverly saying that they don't want anti-Welsh language ahead of the game, but encouraging an anything-goes approach goes during it...

Interpretive cynicism like this could earn you honorary Welsh status

[3 Colours Red]

[Kowalski]

I was in Rhyl's Sainsbury's when Wrexham and Stockport were promoted.

[blameless]

Did Franchise just spectacularly shit the bed, losing a vital promotion six-pointer 4-1 at home to Mansfield? Why, yes. Yes, they did.

After looking doomed for most of the season Sutton have woken up and taken 13 points from their last 6 games, but it still looks like it'll be too little too late (especially as Colchester have just remembered how to win again).

[Simon G]

I was hoping Sutton might just do it - they're a game I wouldn't mind going to next season.

[Sporting]

Paul Mullin: is he?

• a flat-track bully
• a late developer
• a goal hanger
• good at support play
• likely to stay at Wrexham

All I really know about him are his stats and goals. Seems to be a nice bloke in interviews.