Whither analogue radio?

[Discordant Resonance]

An interesting contrast in listening habits between the UK and Ireland has emerged in recent years - while live radio remains exceptionally popular in both markets, a plurality in the former are accessing programming through digital platforms, whereas in the latter, traditional FM still dominates, be that at home or in the car. Even so, when even the smallest community station is operating as an online broadcaster, and smart device ownership is approaching saturation point, how long will conventional analogue frequency bands remain in operation? AM is already a legacy bandwidth across much of Europe, with Britain for now its last redoubt, with the Scottish, Welsh and NI stations perhaps having more silver generation listeners than either Talksport or Five Live. FM will hold out significantly longer, given the plethora of local services, but as with TV previously, will radio become a largely digital activity within 25 years?

[Lang Spoon]

Ireland (meaning the useless Rte) phased out DAB after pointlessly only launching it in major urban centres, I'd say FM will hang in here 10-20 years longer than elsewhere on that account.

[Stumpy Pepys]

will radio become a largely digital activity within 25 years?

Yes, because the government will then be able to sell off the old frequencies.

The ironic thing about digital (and internet radio) is that the quality of FM is way better.

[anton pulisov]

The internet radio I listen to is definitely better quality than FM.

[Stumpy Pepys]

The internet radio I listen to is definitely better quality than FM.

A lot of broadcasters use 128kbps (and some DAB stations use even more compressed bitrates).

[Satchmo Distel]

Does long wave still get used commercially?

[Discordant Resonance]

Radio 4 still use it, of course, as do RTE, largely for signals to the UK - there aren't even that many radios sold anymore that tune into LW, in recent decades most have been strictly FM and AM.

[DCI Harry Batt]

I don't really understand why the internet stuff gets called radio.

[Discordant Resonance]

Presumably because they share platforms with stations who also broadcast offline, even if Internet-only stations aren't using radio bands.

[anton pulisov]

FM radio is not perfect quality either, there is some clipping of the higher frequencies. And of course a bit of noise when the reception isn't perfect.

128 kbps would be slightly better than FM (assuming the they aren't playing MP3s at the station but CDs or records), but of course some stations do broadcast at lower bitrates, which isn't great.

Take the test here regarding compressed sound: https://www.npr.org/sections/thereco...-audio-quality

I got all of them wrong (well, I skipped the Coldplay one). Wearing a pair of Sony MDR-7506 studio monitor headphones. My ears are not what they used to be though. I remember 20 years ago I could hear the difference.

[Stumpy Pepys]

I don't really understand why the internet stuff gets called radio.

What would you call it (without confusing the average person)?

[Stumpy Pepys]

FM radio is not perfect quality either, there is some clipping of the higher frequencies. And of course a bit of noise when the reception isn't perfect.

128 kbps would be slightly better than FM (assuming the they aren't playing MP3s at the station but CDs or records), but of course some stations do broadcast at lower bitrates, which isn't great.

Take the test here regarding compressed sound: https://www.npr.org/sections/thereco...-audio-quality

I got all of them wrong (well, I skipped the Coldplay one). Wearing a pair of Sony MDR-7506 studio monitor headphones. My ears are not what they used to be though. I remember 20 years ago I could hear the difference.

You're right, but we were sold this line about 'amazing audio quality', only for broadcasters to divide up their frequencies into increasing numbers of stations with diminishing bitrates and even mono output. (And I'm really no audiophile.)

[Discordant Resonance]

What would you call it (without confusing the average person)?

Technically, it's just live streaming, as opposed to streaming of recorded music.

[anton pulisov]

You're right, but we were sold this line about 'amazing audio quality', only for broadcasters to divide up their frequencies into increasing numbers of stations with diminishing bitrates and even mono output. (And I'm really no audiophile.)

Yeah DAB has been misused in that way. It never really caught on in Sweden either, because there's no real motivation for the end user to ditch their FM radio and upgrade to DAB. It's the same list of stations. In the UK they attempted to drive DAB uptake by creating DAB-only stations like BBC 6 Music. But that's now also streamable on the internet, and everybody has a smartphone. So ultimately internet radio will kill both FM and DAB. I have an internet radio app on my phone, and I can drive all the way from Stockholm to Malmö with 4G signal, allowing my phone to stream US college music radio stations into my car stereo. Or French radio, or Irish radio, or whatever.

[Sporting]

Does perfect sound quality matter that much?

[Ginger Yellow]

I haven't listened to radio that wasn't live sport (and even that I do via app now) for over a decade. Why would I when podcasts exist?

[Lang Spoon]

Does perfect sound quality matter that much?

I'm picturing you with a wax cylinder device.

[Belhaven]

I haven't listened to radio that wasn't live sport (and even that I do via app now) for over a decade. Why would I when podcasts exist?

I listen to live news while having breakfast.

[Ginger Yellow]

I find radio the worst possible way to consume news. A tiny handful of stories you have basically no control over the selection of, and no images/video.

[3 Colours Red]

Does perfect sound quality matter that much?

I don't think anyone really expects radio sound quality to be perfect but it must be good enough for purpose - that's why you don't get that many music stations on AM as opposed to FM, for example. You need that extra bandwidth for music.

There are podcasts I listen to that upload their episodes as low as 48kbps mono but generally that's tolerable for speech. I'd hate to hear music at that bit rate - it'd most likely sound like being put on hold.

[Sporting]

I find radio the worst possible way to consume news. A tiny handful of stories you have basically no control over the selection of, and no images/video.

Do you have much more control over TV news? And as for the lack of video, how important is this really?

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

The local radio stations here have only recently got onto DAB, due to an increase in capacity in the area. The new capacity is controlled by Bauer and mainly has their stations on, with the local BBC station allowed on as part of the deal.

At the same time the local Bauer-owned commercial station CFM - slogan "The Best Mix of Music" (sic) - is being rebranded as "Greatest Hits Cumbria" or something and its localised programming being reduced to an opt-out of a couple of hours per weekday.

The changes likely to happen in BBC local radio will effectively mean the same thing, with only a few hours of genuinely local programming and the rest being national or regionalised programming.

I'm guessing the pattern for commercial radio is much the same across the country and before long it will just be national stations broadcasting on DAB, and AM and FM will be run down to the point where "they" can justify switching them off completely and running everything through DAB and online.

[Ginger Yellow]

Do you have much more control over TV news? And as for the lack of video, how important is this really?

I mean, I don't watch much TV news either. I have an extensive list of RSS feeds and subs to several online newspapers. Video's not super important, except when it is, but the point is it's not even an option on radio. There's just no circumstance in which I'd rather listen to radio news than get it some other way.

[treibeis]

I mean, I don't watch much TV news either. I have an extensive list of RSS feeds and subs to several online newspapers. Video's not super important, except when it is, but the point is it's not even an option on radio. There's just no circumstance in which I'd rather listen to radio news than get it some other way.

I get most of my news from radio, as I work in a job where I can't look at RSS feeds every five minutes (or every five hours, come to that).

[steveeeeeeeee]

Yeah, RSS feeds are just hard work and typically modified without notice. The trouble with picking your own sources of information is that you close off new, unexpected avenues of information. Radio gives you the predictable, but also supplies things you never knew or have heard.

Anyway, I love radio, prefer it to TV, but hate the way internet radio is accessed. I struggle with podcasts, too much choice, where to start?

With internet accessed radio stations you go back to the same handful of stations rather than shifting across the frequency dial to find something new. I've often considered creating an app which looks like an FM dial and you set location and scan it for internet stations, just like an FM receiver. Quite simple to do, the mechanics of it are within my programming ability, but I'll never get around to it, or someone has already done it.