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    Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

    Being one half of a double act lightened what Stewart Lee did/does considerably, though. It would have to - one need only look at Richard Herring's more recent material by comparison.

    Corden may well have watched and enjoyed Fist of Fun, but, as I say, I don't really think that's the point here. He's clearly the kind of one-dimensional people-pleaser Lee would hate - someone who his management milk to the nth degree, stretching somewhat limited talent to its thinnest. Seems pretty obvious to me that any 'admiration' - stage-managed or otherwise - isn't likely to be reciprocated here.

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      Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

      There's also, you know, the snobbery angle that's the theme of the entire episode.

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        Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

        People are complicated.

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          Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

          Ginger Yellow wrote: There's also, you know, the snobbery angle that's the theme of the entire episode.
          Well, quite. But he means it anyway. Or at least his on-stage persona does. Which is pretty much him.

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            Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

            Or at least his on-stage persona does. Which is pretty much him

            I would say there is probably a small but significant difference.

            Other than to use them to mock his own fan's attitudes, I'm not sure he particularly dislikes Corden or Mack. Not really enough to do a bit about them anyway.

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              Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

              Simon's interview addresses the persona issue in depth. Lee talks about how it's
              had to evolve as he (real Lee) becomes more (relatively) successful.

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                Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                Luke R wrote: Or at least his on-stage persona does. Which is pretty much him

                I would say there is probably a small but significant difference.

                Other than to use them to mock his own fan's attitudes, I'm not sure he particularly dislikes Corden or Mack. Not really enough to do a bit about them anyway.
                I'm sure he doesn't actively 'dislike' either - but they're perfect foils for his on-stage persona, which is clearly just an exaggeration of his real standpoints. (Mack, of course, slighted him in his book - not something that probably bothered him much, but a good angle to exploit: ditto Corden, who likely just irritates him for the reasons suggested above.)

                I've not read that interview, but I knew Stewart quite well a while back and, from what I could ascertain back then, most of his targets seemed based on existing bêtes-noir. (A then-ongoing rivalry/feud with Patrick Marber was one area frequently skewed for comic effect, IIRC.) But I used to talk more about music with him, to be honest.

                But, as GY notes, he's had to evolve. It's what he does, no biggie.

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                  Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                  Well, for your sake I hope you never win an award Stewart Lee is up for.

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                    Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                    On the other hand, it could be a badge of honour. I mean, I'm sure Graham Norton is quietly flattered.

                    But it's not going to happen, so let's not worry about it.

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                      Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                      The best punchline would be if Lee and Corden are in real life men of strikingly similar temperaments, but whose comedic personas veer off in diametrically opposed directons.

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                        Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                        I certainly shouldn't think Lee's as misanthropic IRL as he is on stage. Mind you, for one so keen to avoid cliched ideas of comedy the whole "intellectual stand up = misanthrope" is a pretty well-worn route.

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                          Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                          But the character isn't really much of a misanthrope, by comedy standards. He's no Doug Stanhope. What he is, is antagonistic to the (imagined) audience.

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                            Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                            Just started watching the latest series due to Reasons and thought I'd go through the thread. Episode 1 was glorious, the slow decay during the Norton bit had me rolling. I've seen him live a couple of times, and to be honest, didn't really get it all that much - it was beautifully written and performed, but I was expecting much more in the way of comedy. The way this show is put together makes it all work, that wilful deconstruction, the fact that you never quite know when he is improvising or it is part of a honed routine.

                            Just a note on Sadowitz, and why he isn't the star that his talent richly deserves. As anyone who has ever tried to deal with him on a professional level knows, the reason Jerry Sadowitz is not the biggest star in the comedy universe is purely down to Jerry Sadowitz. To describe him as a suicide bomb to his own career doesn't get across how effectively he can sabotage himself. If he is reduced to playing small rooms in pubs in Greenwich, it is purely because he has pissed off everyone who has tried to support him, promote him, book him and so on.

                            Why isn't the Pallbearers Review available anywhere? Why aren't clips on YouTube? Why doesn't he get booked for comedy clubs big and small? And then you find out that the Review isn't available because Sadowitz won't let it be, clips aren't on Youtube because he gets them pulled and clubs don't book him because they don't tend to book people who fuck them about multiple times, and then every couple of years he gets an article in the Guardian bemoaning his lack of fame. Such a bloody waste.

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                              Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                              Watched this last night, it was pisspoor. I'd made me old Ma tune in too, so she kept turning around and saying, "Do you really find this funny? If you weren't here I'd have turned it off after two minutes." For once, I couldn't argue with her. I kept thinking there was going to be some point and pay-off to the whole routine, but it never came. Or is it part of some genre called post-comedy stand-up?

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                                Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                                imp wrote: Or is it part of some genre called post-comedy stand-up?
                                Afraid I found the last three episodes a chore.

                                I was at my Mother's when one of them was on, but she demurred. "All these modern comics are disgusting, why can't they be clean like Frank Carson?". A shame, as that loses me the chance for a lame gag about Meta*-post-modernism...

                                * short for 'Martha'

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                                  Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                                  Yeah, I would count myself as quite a big fan of Lee, seeing him live on every tour for a decade or so until the last couple, but he's taken the schtick a bit far even for me with this series (which is seemingly what he wants, taking the "character" at face value).

                                  I still find the shows watchable but for long passages of the last few it's been a case of toughens it out. The appeal of "showing the workings" of an act/routine just isn't enough when it is amour all there is.

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                                    Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                                    Axed.

                                    Cretinously stupid decision. Cheap to make, helps the BBC's reputation with creative comedy-makers. Netflix will buy him up.

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                                      Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                                      Four series though, not bad. If it spurs him on to create something else, it's a good outcome.

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                                        Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                                        The BBC would not necessarily be wrong not to want more of the same, based on the last series. They should probably have given him more credit to be able to take it in a different direction, given his track record and prestige.

                                        Did he want to do more? It's sometimes hard to tell when the hard-done-by angle is for real and when it is part of the schtick.

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                                          Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                                          His statement which revealed it hadn't been recommissioned indicated he was very keen to carry it on.

                                          Personally, I think he'd done all he can with the format and the last series suffered from diminishing returns. I think Lee probably believes he was getting it exactly where he really wanted it though.

                                          .

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                                            Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                                            This is all just a sign that the BBC does not give a shit about comedy. Putting all their eggs in the prestige drama basket.

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                                              Stewart Lee's Comedy Vehicle

                                              The blurb for his summer show suggests he was at least considering doing another season:
                                              A new work-in-progress show, which will either become more telly or a big live effort.

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                                                "The piece about "Braveheart" in front of a Scottish audience" which Taylor mentioned above is available in this excellent book:

                                                https://www.amazon.com/How-Escaped-M.../dp/0571254810

                                                In addition to a full transcript, there are loads of footnotes which really break down the material and its context.

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                                                  Yeah, the book’s great. The follow up is worth having too.

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                                                    Good interview here recorded on January 22; poignant as it discusses The Fall just 2 days before MES died.

                                                    https://audioboom.com/posts/6659202-...ntent-provider

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