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Friday night prime time: Serbia v Switzerland

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    #76
    Xhaka was born in Switzerland to refugee parents. Shaqiri (and Behrami's) families fled Yugoslavia when they were kids.

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      #77
      Originally posted by The Awesome Berbaslug!!! View Post
      That foul on mitrovic was basically football's version of the spear tackle. Two players picked up a player and dumped him on his hole.

      When Embolo got the ball near the end I was thinking, "no, not today Breel, you're not an albanian from what used to be serbia. Today is not for you."

      The Serbs are wrong when they think the world is against them. It's actually the Universe. I'm struggling to think of anything equivalently annoying or hilarious, and I think it would be Ireland knocking England out of the next Euro's with goals by Shane Duffy and James McClean.
      Fucking Dana Uniternational.

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        #78
        I'll say it again, best game so far.

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          #79
          Originally posted by Defensive minded
          Serbia didn't really need to win, but kept on going forward.
          If Serbia would have drawn today, they'd need to beat Brazil to ensure qualification for the next round. Now that they have lost, they need to beat Brazil. So that makes no difference to them. However, if they'd have won today, a draw against Brazil would have sufficed.

          So yeah, they kept going forward. It was the sensible thing to do.

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            #80
            Originally posted by Wouter D View Post
            If Serbia would have drawn today, they'd need to beat Brazil to ensure qualification for the next round. Now that they have lost, they need to beat Brazil. So that makes no difference to them. However, if they'd have won today, a draw against Brazil would have sufficed.

            So yeah, they kept going forward. It was the sensible thing to do.
            Wouldn't they have qualified with 5 points?

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              #81
              Originally posted by EIM View Post
              It's Refugee Week. Weren't Xhaka and Shaqiri both refugees, or from refugee families?
              Good article from the Guardian from last year. https://www.theguardian.com/football...ottenham-derby

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                #82
                Originally posted by Defensive minded
                I find it despicable to see spoilt millionaires running over to a section of the crowd to provoke them, based on their version of identity politics. I know plenty of people from ex-Yugoslavia. None of them agree on the narrative that Serbia were the only perpetrators. There were victims and perpetrators on all sides.
                Oh.

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                  #83
                  I find it despicable to see spoilt millionaires running over to a section of the crowd to provoke them, based on their version of identity politics. I know plenty of people from ex-Yugoslavia. None of them agree on the narrative that Serbia were the only perpetrators. There were victims and perpetrators on all sides.
                  Footballers from teams you dislike are "spoilt millionaires".

                  There were probably at least 20 millionaires onthe pitch these evening- you have no idea who is "spoilt" and who isn't.

                  I imagine the majority of the players on both sides grew up in relative penury and are just as delighted that they now have enough money to stop their mum cleaning toilets as Raheem Sterling is.

                  We can have another thread about the Balkan war, if you want.
                  Here's Granit Xhaka
                  My mum and dad had full-time jobs and, on top of that, they worked at night as office cleaners, and they saved up the money for our tickets.
                  Last edited by Nefertiti2; 22-06-2018, 20:42.

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                    #84
                    Originally posted by Defensive minded
                    There might have been three teams with five points. The question is whether it is easier to draw with Brazil or beat Costa Rica.
                    Yes, I'm trying to get my head round it, almost there (although irrelevant now). It's just fixed in my brain, like 40 points to stay up in the Premier League: "nobody goes home with 5 points". But mathematically false, right?

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                      #85
                      Yes possible for three excellent teams to draw with each other and all to beat the dummy of the group.

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                        #86
                        Originally posted by tee rex View Post
                        Yes, I'm trying to get my head round it, almost there (although irrelevant now). It's just fixed in my brain, like 40 points to stay up in the Premier League: "nobody goes home with 5 points". But mathematically false, right?
                        Yes. A big Swiss win against Costa Rica would mean that Serbia would be eliminated on five points.

                        It is of course not a given that Switzerland would win against the Ticos, but I wouldn't count on them failing if I was Serbia.

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                          #87
                          I suppose Scotland went home with 5 points in 1974, in new money so to speak: one win, two draws.

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                            #88
                            Originally posted by Nefertiti2 View Post
                            Yes possible for three excellent teams to draw with each other and all to beat the dummy of the group.
                            As illustrated in 2004 by Italy,
                            Sweden, Denmark, and Bulgaria
                            .

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                              #89
                              That’s a powerful article from Sterling. Thanks for pointing me to it.

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                                #90
                                In theory it's also possible for a team to get six points and still not progress. In 1994, this happened in two of the groups but, that being the last 24 team World Cup, the four best third place teams still progressed into the last 16.

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                                  #91
                                  dm, I share your concern about the dangers of nationalism, but would suggest that these players' personal histories and the fact that they were whistled and booed every time they touched the ball by a large portion of the Serbian support (several of whom were brandishing "Kosovo is Serbia" banners and more of whom were chanting that slogan) in arguably the most important they've match they've ever played all means that there are much better targets for that concern.

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                                    #92
                                    In all wars there are victims and perpetrators on both sides. That doesn't mean that each side is equally guilty

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                                      #93
                                      Originally posted by Defensive minded
                                      I would agree that they were probably not the only millionaires in that match, regardless of whether I like them or not.

                                      The point I was trying to make it is that they are stoking the fire of nationalism from which other less fortunate people suffer.
                                      Any footballer playing for their national team can be seen to be "stoking the fires of nationalism".

                                      Granit Xhaka's father as a 22-year-old student spent three and a half years as a political prisoner in Yugoslavia after demonstrating for Kosovan autonomy.

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                                        #94
                                        Originally posted by Ek weet nie View Post
                                        That’s a powerful article from Sterling. Thanks for pointing me to it.
                                        the ghost writers (or interviewer/editors) at the players tribune are simply outstanding. the Lukaku piece was similarly astonishing.

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                                          #95
                                          There's another really good intterview with Shaqiri, as it turns out

                                          y family had left Kosovo before the war broke out, when I was four years old, and they tried to make a life in Switzerland with me and my two brothers. It was not easy. My father didn’t speak Swiss German, so he had to start out washing dishes in a restaurant. He eventually got a job working construction on roads. My mother worked as a cleaner in office buildings in the city. (I was her vacuum helper, and my brothers cleaned the windows.)

                                          Switzerland is very expensive for anyone, but it was extra difficult for my parents because they were sending a lot of money back home to our family members who were still in Kosovo. At first, we could fly back to see them every year. In fact, my mother always says, “On the plane, you were always being a Bad Boy! Always trying to climb over the seats and touch the people behind us! You would never be quiet!”

                                          But when the war started it became impossible to go back, and things were very difficult for my family members who were stuck there. My uncle’s house was burned to the ground, and there was a lot of suffering. My father would send as much money back as he could, so we never had any extra spending money when I was growing up, except for maybe one thing on birthdays.

                                          I remember that my big fear wasn’t even that I couldn’t go; my fear was that my teammates would find out that we couldn’t pay.

                                          You know how it is with kids mobbing and making fun of you, especially when you’re 16 or 17. After training, all the kids would go grab some food from the kiosk, and my brothers and I never had any money so we would make up some excuse that we had to go home right away.
                                          Last edited by Nefertiti2; 22-06-2018, 21:06.

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                                            #96
                                            Nothing to add to the identitydebate but Shaqiri is a fat wee gobshite.

                                            Felix Brych has ref'd two of the last three Swiss games. He's German. A bit rum?

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                                              #97
                                              Originally posted by Defensive minded
                                              You can't see the difference between playing for a national team and making nationalistic signs to the supporters of the other team?
                                              When the supporters of the other team are giving it large:
                                              the fact that they were whistled and booed every time they touched the ball by a large portion of the Serbian support (several of whom were brandishing "Kosovo is Serbia" banners and more of whom were chanting that slogan)
                                              and knowing their fathers were refugees/political prisoner I can understand why Xhaka and Shaqiri might respond as they did.

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                                                #98
                                                The only thing he;s posted on twitter (apart from that article) that anyone might object to as far as I can see is:

                                                https://twitter.com/XS_11official/status/1007508405731430400

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                                                  #99
                                                  Originally posted by Walt Flanagans Dog View Post
                                                  Enter Shaqiri.
                                                  For the life of me I can’t work out why Tosic didn’t just rugby tackle him and take the red card, madness.

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                                                    Originally posted by The Awesome Berbaslug!!! View Post
                                                    That foul on mitrovic was basically football's version of the spear tackle. Two players picked up a player and dumped him on his hole.
                                                    Worst refereeing decision of the tournament so far?

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