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2018 Copa Libertadores

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    An absolute peach.

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      Benedetto! Fourth goal in 3 games!

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        They showed a shot of a River player messing with his wrist and such is the reputation of this match that I was slightly disappointed that he wasn’t pulling out a pair of brass knuckles.

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          I was going to say that was poor defending but on replay that was a perfectly delivered free kick.

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            Keeper made himself huge. Great save. Although should have been a goal.

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              Carlos Tevez still playing? Gets booked.

              Good game that.

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                The first half was very open and exciting. The second half a lot of chippy play. River looked very good going forward in that first half but their defense looked extremely shaky. I think the second leg should be set up well with this result.

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                  Oh sure, now you all start paying attention. Invading this cosy little thread cantagalo and danielmak and I had going ...

                  Thought that was good, all in all. Not as good as some recent superclásicos, but a lot better than most superclásicos in living memory, because the last three years have thrown up some ridiculous ones. And for a Libertadores final it was good stuff, and very nicely poised for the second leg (away goals aren't a tie-breaker if the aggregate score is level, remember).

                  Bit annoyed at the BT Sport commentator's habit of stressing the wrong syllable in almost every single name, and pronouncing Ábila's name as if it had a double L. But that was more forgivable than the at least three occasions when he referred to the bloke in the River Plate technical area as 'Marcelo Gallardo', in spite of having mentioned near the start that Gallardo wasn't in the stadium because he was serving a touchline ban. The bloke giving the orders today was his assistant, Matías Biscay.

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                    Oh, and for the podcast listeners among you, I'll be on Monday's Totally Football Show talking about it.

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                      My silence in the second half was due to the fact I had a ticket for Fluminense v Sport and had to stop watching at half-time to get there for kick-off. It was one of my poorest ever decisions as I witnessed a 0-0 draw devoid of any entertainment whatsoever.

                      Sam, I’d stopped downloading the Totally Football Show as there were far too many football podcasts cluttering up my life but I’ll make an exception if you’re on.

                      And I’ve just seen danielmak’s question which I’ll attempt to answer tomorrow.

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                        From a neutral perspective another thing this final had going for it was goals. Just eyeballing back to 2010 there has not been a first leg of a final with this many goals.

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                          Originally posted by cantagalo View Post
                          My silence in the second half was due to the fact I had a ticket for Fluminense v Sport and had to stop watching at half-time to get there for kick-off. It was one of my poorest ever decisions as I witnessed a 0-0 draw devoid of any entertainment whatsoever.

                          Sam, I’d stopped downloading the Totally Football Show as there were far too many football podcasts cluttering up my life but I’ll make an exception if you’re on.

                          And I’ve just seen danielmak’s question which I’ll attempt to answer tomorrow.
                          Any chance you will go to the second leg of the Sudamericana semi-final? Flu didn't look good in that first leg but they have looked very good in this tournament. I expect that second leg to be a good match.

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                            Originally posted by cantagalo View Post

                            Sam, I’d stopped downloading the Totally Football Show as there were far too many football podcasts cluttering up my life but I’ll make an exception if you’re on.
                            This.

                            Though I have just seen that the Guardian one has Marcela Mora y Araujo on for the same reason (I assume), and I have to say that as much as i am looking forward to hearing Sam on this subject, his voice doesn't quite do it for me in the way that Marcela Mora y Araujo's does. In fact I am not sure that anyone's voice quite does it for me in the way that Marcela Mora y Araujo's does

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                              Originally posted by danielmak View Post
                              Fanatiz might be the way to go. Perhaps sign up for a free test and then cancel. The good thing about Fanatiz is a 24 hour on-demand window for Libertadores.

                              I finally got around to scanning that bit from The Baffler. @Cantagalo: What are your thoughts about these coaches?





                              Most uses of "he" are in reference to Tite.
                              First of all a spoiler alert. Every single one of them has resigned or been sacked. This is not that surprising as with 5 games still to go in the Brasileirão, the 20 Série A teams have amassed a total of 55 managers between them this season. The latest to be sacked was São Paulo’s Diego Aguirre yesterday. Of the 20 managers that started the season, only two are still in place; Grêmio’s Renato Gaúcho and Internacional’s Odair Hellmann.*

                              Fábio Carille won the 2017 Brasileiro and the 2018 Paulista with Corinthians but due to financial difficulties the team was dismantled and Carille jumped ship and is now managing in Saudi Arabia. He did a very pragmatic job at Corinthians. They weren’t great to watch but won the 2017 title at a canter.

                              Roger Machado lasted just 7 months at Palmeiras but had trouble meeting the inflated expectations of a club with the biggest budget in the league and despite a record of W 27 D 9 L 8, he was sacked in July. He was blamed for losing the Paulista to Corinthians and a league position of 5th in the league but they had started well in the Libertadores. I liked him as a manager and his football compared favourably to the attritional style if his sucessor Scolari, though it should said that Scolari has turned round their league form and they are now strong favourites for the title.

                              Zé Ricardo’s spell at Vasco was also short-lived. He did a reasonable job at Flamengo but Vasco’s financial problems are such that anyone would have difficulty achieving success with the quality of players at his disposal.

                              And then there’s the strange case of Fernando Diniz. At Atlético-PR, he started the season superbly with a brand of football hitherto unseen in the Brazilian league. His short passing, high risk tiki-taka style was initially a joy to watch but opponents quickly sussed him out with a high pressing game, mistakes cost games and results deteriorated rapidly. The experiment was short-lived and he lasted just 21 games. It is now unlikely the any other Série A club will take a risk on him.

                              So there you have it. I also rated each of the managers in the article but 6 or 7 months on, not one of them is working in Brazilian football.

                              * Edit: forgot Mano Menezes at Cruzeiro - so 3 out of 20.
                              Last edited by cantagalo; 16-11-2018, 11:38.

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                                Originally posted by danielmak View Post
                                Any chance you will go to the second leg of the Sudamericana semi-final? Flu didn't look good in that first leg but they have looked very good in this tournament. I expect that second leg to be a good match.
                                Unfortunately, I’ll be back in England by the time of the second leg.

                                I expect Atlético to go through quite comfortably. Atlético have been on a superb run under Thiago Nunes who replaced the aforementioned Fernando Diniz and has taken them from the relegation zone to the verge of a Libertadores qualifying position, as well as progressing in the Sul-Americana. They have a number of promising young players such as Rafael Veiga, Bruno Guimarães and Renan Lodi and an excellent striker in Pablo. Their first leg lead should be enough to see them through against a Flu team lacking in confidence and, with Pedro still injured, I think they lack the cutting edge to trouble Atlético.

                                It looks like their opponents in the final will be Junior Barranquilla who take a 2-0 away lead into the second leg against Santa Fé.

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                                  Originally posted by ad hoc View Post
                                  This.

                                  Though I have just seen that the Guardian one has Marcela Mora y Araujo on for the same reason (I assume), and I have to say that as much as i am looking forward to hearing Sam on this subject, his voice doesn't quite do it for me in the way that Marcela Mora y Araujo's does. In fact I am not sure that anyone's voice quite does it for me in the way that Marcela Mora y Araujo's does
                                  She's great. I wish she had her own podcast, I could imagine her doing something really well with a less frequent show that had more in-depth features/interviews, etc.

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                                    Originally posted by ad hoc View Post
                                    This.

                                    Though I have just seen that the Guardian one has Marcela Mora y Araujo on for the same reason (I assume), and I have to say that as much as i am looking forward to hearing Sam on this subject, his voice doesn't quite do it for me in the way that Marcela Mora y Araujo's does. In fact I am not sure that anyone's voice quite does it for me in the way that Marcela Mora y Araujo's does
                                    Well, if we ever actually manage to line things up properly to get her on Hand Of Pod, I'll be sure to let you know.

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                                      Thanks for that update about the Brasil coaches. My viewing of league matches is too sporadic. GolTV in the US shows some games each weekend (depends on what they're doing with Ecuadoran and Portuguese leagues). So I try to DVR what looks most exciting but am behind. And I don't understand enough Spanish to track discussions of coaching changes during a Libertadores or Sudamericana match. But the problems seem steady in South America, where most coaches don't get much of a run. In Colombia it seems like coaches will be given a semester. If the team was competitive in the league and in whatever continental cup then the coach sticks around. If not, he is sacked. Santa Fe are on their third coach this year (although one seemed to be a caretaker).

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                                        https://twitter.com/RorySmith/status/1065911028469387265

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                                          If Boca win this - I don't think they will but who knows - where are they going to celebrate and how the f...k will they get away from the Monumental in one piece?

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                                            Doesn't sound good at the moment. Is anyone watching a live feed from Argentina that explains what's going on? BBC is reporting the match may be cancelled.

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                                              River "supporters" attacked the Boca bus with rocks and other projectiles as it approached the Monumental, breaking most/all of the windows. The police then fired pepper spray to disperse the attackers, only for the spray to enter the bus due to the broken windows.

                                              A number of Boca players including Tevez are on their way to the hospital for treatment and kickoff has been delayed.

                                              Kickoff has been offically delayed, but is still unclear as to whether the match will be played later today.

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                                                Postponed again.

                                                Date of replay now unclear, but will be after the G20 summit this week.

                                                8 December being rumoured.

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                                                  Was tonight’s rescheduling going to be played behind closed doors, as I’ve heard claimed?

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                                                    No.

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