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    #26
    Either I am not following your point or you're not following mine

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      #27
      I'm guessing so, I just don't know which it is!

      Scotland won't be in a group with "two or three stronger qualifiers because of the Fifa rankings" ... as of this competition, subsequent groups will be drawn according to Nations League standings, so being in League D means every side they'll be drawn against will be stronger.

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        #28
        Originally posted by Jorge Porbillas View Post
        Presumably this:
        Yes, but I think ad hoc's point is that Scotland could throw the qualifiers for, say, Euro 2020 in order to get a League D route into World Cup 2022. They won't care about a low seeding in the next qualifiers because League D is a bigger prize.

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          #29
          I may be wrong, but I think the Nations League is just into the Euros and not the World Cup

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            #30
            It is the World Cup too:

            In addition, for the 2022 World Cup, the same principles will apply to both the UEFA Nations League and the European Qualifiers, but will be adapted to the number of slots available and final tournament dates.
            http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuro/news/ne...ormat+approved

            As I read it, that means one of Europe's 14 places in WC 2022 goes to a bottom 16 nation, although UEFA has not yet announced how they will get 55 down to 14 and still allow one of those to be the small-fry team, and I don't know if they've accounted for how FIFA would feel doing the draw in December with play-offs still not done. I don't think FIFA would allow March 2022 playoffs.

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              #31
              I thought this sounded like an interesting (if rather confusing until we actually see it in action) idea, until I realised proper tournament qualification places depended on it. If they're going to do it that way, surely the best solution for 'sporting integrity' is to just give the four spots to the top four teams not already qualified, even if that means four League A teams. So if you're ad hoc's hypothetical Scotland and you want to qualify for a given tournament via the UEFA Nations League, you have to try and first work your way up to League A in order to do so.

              Ad hoc's hypothetical Scotland sounds like a pretty good username, or something.

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                #32
                I've gone to wikipedia to try to understand this, they usually break things down simply.

                So UEFA, after years of having a prime number of competing countries, finally has a number that divides evenly by 6 or 5 and they have some groups of 5 and some of 6?

                I'm not sure I can be bothered to read any further.

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                  #33
                  Originally posted by Sam View Post
                  Ad hoc's hypothetical Scotland sounds like a pretty good username, or something.
                  Ad Hoc's Hypothetical Scotland is the most underrated Fall album.

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                    #34
                    *applause*

                    (To Bored, not whoever came up with this latest damn-fool way of massively confusing what was threatening to becoming a distressingly straightforward ranking/qualification situation.)

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                      #35
                      Draw takes place tomorrow. Article: https://www.theguardian.com/football...scotland-wales

                      "Europa League-ification" is good, assuming he coined it.

                      I don't think this gets rid of the Spring 2020 friendlies. The big teams will have already qualified so will play friendlies, while 16 clubs from tiers B-D scrap it out in play-offs.
                      Last edited by Satchmo Distel; 23-01-2018, 15:12.

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                        #36
                        Here's a sneak preview

                        To reprise the gag from last year

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                          #37
                          Originally posted by ad hoc View Post
                          What's to stop teams deliberately getting themselves relegated in order to give themselves a better shot at finishing number one in their section?
                          Show off. How can anyone have worked this out to the point where they see the potential conspiracies.

                          All I understand is tomorrow's draw is in a "Tech" in Switzerland. There's your conspiracy. Before the plastic balls appear in those podium goldfish bowls, they're obviously being popped round the Large Hadron Collider.

                          And, as I warned everyone the first time they switched that thing on, the space-time continuum will be fucked about until UEFA finally get what they want - a never-ending finals tournament for which everyone qualifies and about which no-one can complain because it's incorporating every format which ever existed.

                          It's leagues, play-offs, promotion, relegation and knock-out football both in a one-country and all-major-European-football-venues stylee, simultaneously. It's like nothing we've ever seen before and everything we've ever known.

                          "The Finals [of the 2018-19 Nations League]consist of four matches – semi-finals, third-place match and final – to be played in one of the finalist countries" ... that's 1960 to 1976 all over again. Yet Euro 2020 is half of Europe's nations playing in a quarter of Europe's nations. Yet one slots into the other. It's the past and the future melded.

                          What is more, the annoying minnows have been consigned to their own league - like what everyone who was held to a draw by them ever wanted - and friendlies have been dropped, like what everyone who would only cross their door for a meaningless game if it was against Brazil, Messi or those German/English bastards has ever said about them.

                          Everyone's a host, everyone's qualified, everyone's relegated - everyone's happy. UEFA have done it. NASA are watching closely. Scotland will miss out on goal-difference.

                          I hear Jon Pertwee's doing the draw.
                          Last edited by Alex Anderson; 23-01-2018, 15:14. Reason: And Italy already know how to work it. It favours countries with Proportional Representation.

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                            #38
                            Originally posted by Alex Anderson View Post
                            It's like nothing we've ever seen before. It's the past and the future melded. It's every format which ever existed.
                            ...
                            Everyone's a host, everyone's qualified, everyone's relegated - everyone's happy. UEFA have done it. NASA are watching closely. Scotland will still miss out on goal-difference.

                            I hear Jon Pertwee's doing the draw.
                            *applause*

                            Set these words to Beethoven's Symphony number 9 and you've got the theme for the competition.

                            And then Scotland will point out that they would have qualified on goal average.

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                              #39
                              I think "deliberately getting themselves relegated" only really applies to the bottom two tiers because the weakest team in Tier A would get a play-off anyway by virtue of all the other Tier A teams qualifying via the normal Euro 2020 group phase. The bottom half of Tier C is where I'd expect the throwing of matches, because they are not going to make one of the A-C play-offs so have to aim for D.

                              Unless there's another sneaky way to rig it that I have not twigged.
                              Last edited by Satchmo Distel; 23-01-2018, 15:25.

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                                #40
                                Everyone's a host, everyone's qualified
                                Making love to you is such a thrill.

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                                  #41
                                  The self relegation to section D conspiracy is only a runner if you're already in C with no realistic hope of making the C playoff presumably, and you're willing to drop to D two years later. And if you're bad enough that the C playoffs seem unobtainable then theres no guarantee you'll steamroller Georgia and Moldova to be the best of the bottom 16 two years later.
                                  Last edited by seand; 23-01-2018, 17:04.

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                                    #42
                                    It was just a question. I'm not David Icke

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                                      #43
                                      But lizard people...

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                                        #44
                                        Originally posted by ad hoc View Post
                                        It was just a question. I'm not David Icke
                                        No, but I am.

                                        Sorry ad hoc - just ripping the piss out myself mate, and my complete inability to work out what's going on with this.

                                        Plus Icke did say stuff about the Isle of Arran, which I could see from my bedroom window when I was growing up ... and a picture of which hangs above my telly now ...

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                                          #45
                                          I confuse Arran (Scotland) and Aran (Ireland)

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                                            #46
                                            Well the two of them are in the Euro Nations Development League draw tomorrow, Satchmo (an hour before the big one. Master of ceremomies, Dermot O'Leary; pulling the balls out, Barry Fry and Pak Do Ik)

                                            Soon their distinct cultural identities will be as famous as the knitwear of other former Nations Conference League stalwarts like Slovenia, Slovakia and Stornoway.
                                            Last edited by Alex Anderson; 23-01-2018, 18:43. Reason: It's not all about the big guns ye ken

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                                              #47
                                              Pots:

                                              http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/when-...m1kgivyd70pi18

                                              Scotland cannot draw Slovenia this time but might face them in the League C play-offs, I would guess.

                                              What happens in there is a tie on goal difference and goals scored in one of the groups of three, say all 6 games are 1-1 draws?
                                              Last edited by Satchmo Distel; 23-01-2018, 19:29.

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                                                #48
                                                New detail I didn't know about the play-offs:

                                                If there is not enough unqualified teams in a League - again, this is very likely in League A - to fill the four-team play-off mini-tournament, teams from the League below will slide up to complete the field.

                                                These teams will have not qualified for their own League's play-offs, though, so as not to punish the best teams in the League below by moving them up to a harder competition.

                                                For example, if there are only three unqualified teams for the League A play-offs, the fifth-best unqualified team in League B will join the League A play-offs - not any of the top four
                                                The League A countries will not have to play a top League B country: only the 5th or below.

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                                                  #49
                                                  Group winners are easy to spot, but to find the 5th best team are they using inter-group comparisons?

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                                                    #50
                                                    Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View Post
                                                    New detail I didn't know about the play-offs:



                                                    The League A countries will not have to play a top League B country: only the 5th or below.
                                                    I’m still scratching my head as to how that increases fairness.

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