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  1. #326
    ursus arctos's Avatar
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    Will they depart in as close proximity?

    Lyon gets Moeen

  2. #327
    Satchmo Distel's Avatar
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    Ali is Lyon's bunny. England 19/4 in last 11 overs.

  3. #328
    Satchmo Distel's Avatar
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    England lost this on the first two days by conceding 400. Smith let them have a glimmer with the non-enforcement of the f/o but a 215 1st innings deficit is fatal.

  4. #329

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    This one-off day/nighter in its own time zone confuses me. By the time I've worked out the hours of play, it's over.

  5. #330

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ray de Galles View Post
    It’s OK when men “talk with exaggerated excitement about cricket” then? For fuck’s sake.
    Hahahaha, whoops - that left my head in a Harry Enfield "Wimmin know their place" whimsical way, I didn't realise how sensitive the locals are around here. Not that it matters a jot, since you don't know me, and I don't know you, and this is all pixels, but I could hardly be more pro-women - my disappointment was at Mitchell demonstrating exactly the same traits as the males who I almost universally hate. I hoped she'd be better than that, that's all. My first wife loved cricket, and I always loved following England around the country with her - she never tried to tell me it was a great shot or a 4 in an exaggerated voice though, maybe that's why we survived it.

  6. #331
    SouthdownRebel's Avatar
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    I'm afraid the horse has already bolted, hurdled the fence and is now happily grazing in the neighbour's vegetable garden. The locals here are no more sensitive than anywhere else when people express outdated, offensive views.

    Meanwhile, I set my alarm for 3am this morning with a sense of barely contained hope. My subconscious must have known better, I have a vague memory of switching the alarm off but must have gone straight back to sleep. So 2-0 it is and the Ashes are (virtually) gone. Perhaps further beatings would be beneficial in the long run, if painful, as it may have the effect of focussing minds back onto the problem of producing top quality international cricketers out of the counties rather than milking the T20 cash cow.

  7. #332
    Uncle Ethan's Avatar
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    And now to Perth, where the only people more self-delusional than England fans expecting a win at the WACA are the 20,000 plus who have bought tickets for the fourth day. Much less bouncy than it used to be for the last ever Ashes test in Perth - but still bouncy enough to ensure a very quick match unless England's batting improves out of sight. Very frustrating given every shortcoming that has been exposed was obvious even to my far from expert eyes through the series against the Saffers and the Windies.

  8. #333
    Ray de Galles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chopper View Post
    Hahahaha, whoops - that left my head in a Harry Enfield "Wimmin know their place" whimsical way, I didn't realise how sensitive the locals are around here. Not that it matters a jot, since you don't know me, and I don't know you, and this is all pixels, but I could hardly be more pro-women - my disappointment was at Mitchell demonstrating exactly the same traits as the males who I almost universally hate. I hoped she'd be better than that, that's all. My first wife loved cricket, and I always loved following England around the country with her - she never tried to tell me it was a great shot or a 4 in an exaggerated voice though, maybe that's why we survived it.
    “Some of my best friends are women.”

    I actually put money on an England win, partly as a consolation bet granted, and at least thought they may make a fight of it. The contrast between their purpose and resolve under the lights late yesterday and their capitulation in excellent batting conditions today is absurd.

    You would question if they get any coaching but I keep hearing they’re over-coached.
    Last edited by Ray de Galles; 06-12-2017 at 09:50.

  9. #334
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    Significantly, their best batting day so far was the first day of the series, the only time they have looked like making 300. Moeen and Bairstow not making enough. No centuries from Root, or anyone else, in contrast the Smith and Marsh ones that anchored Aus's wins. Cook having a 'mare.

    Aussie bowlers are good but you can see why their away results are not great. Their batsmen still struggle when it swings.

  10. #335
    Quote Originally Posted by pebblethefish View Post
    Right, if no one else will predict it, I will. England to win 3-1.
    Ha ha. I've just noticed my hilarious typing mistake of a few weeks ago. I meant, of course, to say England to win 3-2.

  11. #336
    Satchmo Distel's Avatar
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    It's looking less likely that England will nick one, unless Australia relax after the Ashes are secure.

  12. #337
    Kevin S's Avatar
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    Dear old Blowers said as much when asked for comment this morning. The next test is a very Aussie-friendly wicket and it will be hard for England to pick themselves up from being 3-0 down with the series gone.

  13. #338
    Could be worse. At least Perth sounds like a result track, which means we could win the toss, bat first etc.

    Do they do featherbeds in Australia? Or shirtfronts?

  14. #339
    longeared's Avatar
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    Think England's best bet for avoiding the whitewash now is at Melbourne. Weather there can be a bit dodgy, often have a pudding of a (drop in?) pitch these days, England usually are at least competitive there. Or hope that all the Australian quicks get injured and we pick up a consolation at Sydney, a la 2003.

  15. #340
    E10 Rifle's Avatar
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    Perth's been a batting paradise of late. But unfortunately that is likely to mean Australia 601-7 declared by the end of day two.

    Anyway:
    Every shortcoming that has been exposed was obvious even to my far from expert eyes through the series against the Saffers and the Windies
    Yep. We can't say we weren't warned, though to be fair the back-up bowling for Broad and Anderson was better than I'd feared in Adelaide. Nonetheless, the post-Broad/Anderson future for England looks pretty grim.

    It's gonna be 5-0. Not the sort of clown-car catastrophe 5-0 of 2013-14 or 06-07, just a slow-burn but inevitable whitewash. For the third consecutive away tour England haven't remotely been up to it. Again, this can hardly come as a surprise

  16. #341
    Satchmo Distel's Avatar
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    I think South Africa is the only away destination where England won the most recent series they played. Pakistan, WI, NZ, Bangladesh, Australia, SL, India were all drawn or lost. Admittedly most other countries (except South Africa) have a similar problem, but England have camouflaged theirs behind their home Ashes wins against a moderate transitioning Australia (and admittedly a seam attack that is/was outstanding in home conditions, esapecially Anderson, who is the best 'home' England bowler since peak Willis and Botham).

  17. #342

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    England have apparently lost their last seven matches in Perth. We might as well make it 8 now. It's only going into day four if there's rain.

  18. #343
    Ray de Galles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antepli Ejderha View Post
    England have apparently lost their last seven matches in Perth. We might as well make it 8 now. It's only going into day four if there's rain.
    Even the last win in Perth was to a Packer-weakened side in ‘78, apparently.

  19. #344
    E10 Rifle's Avatar
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    Yup. We got a high-scoring draw there in 86-87, which is about the best we can hope for this time round too

  20. #345
    Satchmo Distel's Avatar
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    Cummins has never played a Test at the WACA so it's hard to judge if the Aus attack will be as toothless as in its last two Tests there.

  21. #346
    The bowling shortcomings have been the difference in this series so far – they don't look like taking 20 wickets. And yet, I don't see what they could have done about them, except make the players they have better, because there's no-one obvious waiting in the wings. Toby Roland-Jones would have been a shoe-in, but there's no way you can rely on either Finn or Wood. So the batting shortcomings are where coaching failures are most apparent, with sticking by past-it Ballance and the not-ready Vince, and messing about with Duckett, Jennings and many others in a way that leaves them confused about whether they're good enough or not.

    If the batting had been sorted out, and lord they've had long enough, maybe the bowling would have found a way.

    It was interesting to hear George Dobell say in an ESPN video yesterday that Andrew Strauss has done nothing good for English cricket. Teflon Strauss, he called him. I wonder what, in particular, he has in mind?

  22. #347
    I don't really get that. He was a very good captain in my view, and has been away from the England team for quite a while now, so I fail to see how any of this is his fault.

  23. #348
    Ray de Galles's Avatar
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    He's the current "Director of Cricket" for England.
    Last edited by Ray de Galles; 07-12-2017 at 13:32.

  24. #349
    nmrfox's Avatar
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    Recent victories over South Africa and the West Indies were a bit fortuitous, particularly the former, and did give rise in some quarters to false optimism. What was pretty obvious then and is patrently so now is the talent cupboard is pretty bare and with the likely retirements of Broad and Anderson, it's only going to get harder (though there is a least some glimmers of hope in the bowling department). The levels of opprobrium being leveled at Cook in some quarters (not here I hasten to add) could mean him speeding his departure earlier than I think he should and that would leave England in a desperate position with regards to a batting line-up. I also fear that a 5-0 drubbing and the backlash that will inevitably follow it could play havoc with the one true batting talent we do have, who looked far happier not having the weight of captaincy upon him.

  25. #350
    Perhaps Morgan could be recalled as captain. Don't think he'd score many runs, but neither are any obvious alternatives.

    I think England recognise that there are weaknesses hence trying to fast track Duckett, Livingstone etc into the team, but none of them really convinced, hence them going back to players in their mid-late 20s and older for this tour - Stoneman, Vince and Malan.

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