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  1. #1

    I, I, I am gonna play Sun City

    Fuck Radiohead. Fuck Pharell. Fuck Nick Cave. Fuck (oh man, this hurts) Bob Dylan. Fuck Elton John who actually played Sun City. Fuck the Rolling Stones. Fuck Alicia Keys. Fuck Paul McCartney. Fuck Red Hot Chili Peppers. Fuck Justin Timberlake. Fuck Sia. Fuck cowardly Rihanna. Fuck Aerosmith. Fuck Guns and Roses. Fuck Vanessa Mae. Fuck Jethro Tull. Fuck Madonna, wrapped in a fucking Israel flag. Fuck Alice Cooper. Fuck Tears for Fears. Fuck Grandaddy. Fuck Fatboy Slim. Fuck Paul Young. Fuck Justin Bieber. And, for good measures, fuck Radiohead again and again and again.

    And the latest addition to the Israel-playing fuck list is another one that really disappoints me: Chrissie Hynde, waving the Israeli flag. Fuck the fucking Pretenders, and thanks for pissing on my fond memories of your music, Chrissie. But, hey, if you let Rush Limbaugh off the hook for using your song as a theme to his Nazi freak show, you deserve to be on the fuck list anyway. Fuck Chrissie Hynde.

    Who else goes on the Fuck List?

  2. #2
    Toby Gymshorts's Avatar
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  3. #3
    foster and allen

  4. #4
    jwdd27's Avatar
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    Ian Brown was one that disappointed me - after vowing to never play there in 2006, he played Tel Aviv in 2008.

    It's not where you're from, it's where you're at, eh Ian?

  5. #5
    Pet Shop Boys.

  6. #6
    WOM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by G-Man View Post
    Fuck Radiohead. Fuck Pharell. Fuck Nick Cave. Fuck (oh man, this hurts) Bob Dylan. Fuck Elton John who actually played Sun City. Fuck the Rolling Stones. Fuck Alicia Keys. Fuck Paul McCartney. Fuck Red Hot Chili Peppers. Fuck Justin Timberlake. Fuck Sia. Fuck cowardly Rihanna. Fuck Aerosmith. Fuck Guns and Roses. Fuck Vanessa Mae. Fuck Jethro Tull. Fuck Madonna, wrapped in a fucking Israel flag. Fuck Alice Cooper. Fuck Tears for Fears. Fuck Grandaddy. Fuck Fatboy Slim. Fuck Paul Young. Fuck Justin Bieber. And, for good measures, fuck Radiohead again and again and again.

    And the latest addition to the Israel-playing fuck list is another one that really disappoints me: Chrissie Hynde, waving the Israeli flag. Fuck the fucking Pretenders, and thanks for pissing on my fond memories of your music, Chrissie. But, hey, if you let Rush Limbaugh off the hook for using your song as a theme to his Nazi freak show, you deserve to be on the fuck list anyway. Fuck Chrissie Hynde.

    Who else goes on the Fuck List?
    This is really a rather awkward question to ask, but - given your vehemence - I feel I sort of have to: you don't boycott Israel, so why are you so hard on them?

  7. #7
    I support Palestine. To be with Palestinians, you have you go through Israel. But that is besides the point. The representative voices have not called for a travel boycott (which would be a disaster for many Palestinians), but they have explicitly and prominently called for an artistic boycott. If you play Tel Aviv in spite of the boycott, you are knowingly legitimising the crimes of the Israeli state. And fuck people who do that.

  8. #8
    WOM's Avatar
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    A couple of follows-up, if I may: does travel to be with Palestinians not economically benefit (ergo, support) the state of Israel?
    And if the representative voices called for a travel boycott, would you abide it?
    And if not, why not?
    And if so, why not just do it yourself now?

  9. #9
    WOM's Avatar
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    Anyway, we're big fans of Steve Earle and he's very vocal about the fact that he still visits Israel and plays there with local musicians. I can't quite figure out his position on the matter, despite him talking about it at two or three of his shows. His throwaway line is "cuz I'm not scared of Roger Waters", but he's a deeply thoughtful man, so I know it runs deeper than that. I mean, he has an album called Jerusalem after all.

  10. #10
    Satchmo Distel's Avatar
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    If they are playing to an audience that excludes Palestinians, they are scumbags. Playing for Palestinians or an integrated audience is different, I believe.

    On a related note, should artists boycott, say, Florida in view of its police and judicial racism?

  11. #11
    ad hoc's Avatar
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    If the black community of Florida asks for such a boycott

  12. #12
    Exactly. Be guided by what the oppressed wish to be the strategy.

    And it's not a question of playing to mixed audiences; nominally the concerts are open to Palestinians, as were those in Sun City to blacks. It's a question of legitimising the 50-year-long occupation, the ethnic cleansing and the human rights abuses that make apartheid look benign.

    And fuck Steve Earle.

  13. #13
    And fuck Bryan Adams. As if there needed to be any more reasons.

  14. #14
    Satchmo Distel's Avatar
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    "(Everything I Do) I Do It for Ethnic Cleansing"

  15. #15
    6 Music played an extract this morning from a news conference Nick Cave gave about his decision to play Israel which seems to have been precipitated by Brian Eno contacting him to ask him to sign the list for Artists for Palestine. Here's a summary of his position:

    1) I don't like lists
    2) I don't believe in musicians being silenced
    3) I love Israel and I love the Israeli people
    4) Palestinians can get to fuck

    Three of those points he made explicitly. The fourth can only be inferred.

  16. #16
    evilC's Avatar
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    Atari Teenage Riot / Alec Empire are a strange (left-wing, anti-Nazi) addition to this list. Empire is a vociferous anti-boycott campaigner.

    Here's a link to a list of search results for the word 'Israel' on his Twitter account. Be warned - it's likely to wind some of you up, though.

  17. #17
    Lang Spoon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artificial Hipster View Post
    6 Music played an extract this morning from a news conference Nick Cave gave about his decision to play Israel which seems to have been precipitated by Brian Eno contacting him to ask him to sign the list for Artists for Palestine. Here's a summary of his position:

    1) I don't like lists
    2) I don't believe in musicians being silenced
    3) I love Israel and I love the Israeli people
    4) Palestinians can get to fuck

    Three of those points he made explicitly. The fourth can only be inferred.
    Will be easy for me to boycott this tool, can’t stand his whole Southern Gothic Sin and Redemption schtick. Grated with me almost as much as the whole Tom Waits thing. Shit croony voice too. Disturbingly, my parents are now fans. I blame Jools Holland.

  18. #18
    Lang Spoon's Avatar
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    The record with Kylie was alright but.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by G-Man View Post
    And fuck Bryan Adams. As if there needed to be any more reasons.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by G-Man View Post
    Exactly. Be guided by what the oppressed wish to be the strategy.
    Not sure if I agree or not - depends on what you mean by "guided".

    Don't get me wrong, I think there is a moral imperative to listen incredibly carefully to what they are saying and use it very critically to reassess what you think. However, I think it is dangerous if it veers towards the assumption that we should automatically agree with whatever is said. It can presume that there is a singular "oppressed" with a singular voice who agree what makes sense. I also think it has the danger of being patronising and assuming that the situation they are in leads them to some view of what can be done that you can't query or criticise from the outside as you haven't "lived" the same way they have (which verges on fairly dubious identity politics).There's a pretty poor history of people in the West uncritically lauding whatever the trendy left-wing group is overseas. I've seen all types of people, including myself in the past, defend some organisations that are or have been fairly dodgy.

    Again, just to stress, I think it depends on how you define the terms so I may not be disagreeing with you on this...

  21. #21
    Hot Pepsi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrLeam View Post
    Not sure if I agree or not - depends on what you mean by "guided".

    Don't get me wrong, I think there is a moral imperative to listen incredibly carefully to what they are saying and use it very critically to reassess what you think. However, I think it is dangerous if it veers towards the assumption that we should automatically agree with whatever is said. It can presume that there is a singular "oppressed" with a singular voice who agree what makes sense. I also think it has the danger of being patronising and assuming that the situation they are in leads them to some view of what can be done that you can't query or criticise from the outside as you haven't "lived" the same way they have (which verges on fairly dubious identity politics).There's a pretty poor history of people in the West uncritically lauding whatever the trendy left-wing group is overseas. I've seen all types of people, including myself in the past, defend some organisations that are or have been fairly dodgy.

    Again, just to stress, I think it depends on how you define the terms so I may not be disagreeing with you on this...
    This sounds sensible. But I'd need more examples.

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by MrLeam View Post
    Not sure if I agree or not - depends on what you mean by "guided".

    Don't get me wrong, I think there is a moral imperative to listen incredibly carefully to what they are saying and use it very critically to reassess what you think. However, I think it is dangerous if it veers towards the assumption that we should automatically agree with whatever is said. It can presume that there is a singular "oppressed" with a singular voice who agree what makes sense. I also think it has the danger of being patronising and assuming that the situation they are in leads them to some view of what can be done that you can't query or criticise from the outside as you haven't "lived" the same way they have (which verges on fairly dubious identity politics).There's a pretty poor history of people in the West uncritically lauding whatever the trendy left-wing group is overseas. I've seen all types of people, including myself in the past, defend some organisations that are or have been fairly dodgy.

    Again, just to stress, I think it depends on how you define the terms so I may not be disagreeing with you on this...
    The issue came up with reference to a blanket tourism boycott. The Palestinian leadership is unanimous that such a boycott would be against the interest of Palestinian people. There has been no call made for a tourism boycott. So rather than well-meaning supporters of Palestinian rights making up a strategy in that regard, they should take guidance from those who know the situation and define strategy accordingly. There is a call to use Palestinian services as much as possible, and to use tourism to educate visitors about the political and social realities. Obviously, tourism to the beaches of Eilat or Tel Aviv or wherever is discouraged.

    Obviously one can draw lines: if leaders of a struggle transgress ethical boundaries of struggle, one must question that and, if necessary, part ways with that leadership. But that was not at issue here.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Hot Pepsi View Post
    This sounds sensible. But I'd need more examples.
    I guess what's most prominent in my mind is seeing people on pro-Palestine marches waving Hezbollah and Hamas flags and getting into a bit of a discussion/argument with that. Same goes for some people I've come across in the UK who won't entertain any criticism of the IRA.

    I also remember going to a barbeque once and meeting a clearly left-wing South African guy who I tried to ingratiate myself with by saying something positive about Nelson Mandela. Turned out he was on the scene when an ANC bomb went off in a pub in Durban and killed a few people and, quite understandably, had given him a different view of a lot of their activity. I felt a complete idiot at the time but at least it showed me that the type of stuff I'd treat fairly uncritically or see as a forgiveable consequence had huge real world consequences for people. Still took me rather too long to figure that out though.

  24. #24
    I hold no brief for Hezbollah, but surely it is obvious that the Western perception of them is clouded by Western propaganda. In the view of Middle Easterners -- including many/most Christians there -- they are a political party, not a militia or terrorist movement (they are also seen as liberation movement, founded in response to Israel's invasion of South Lebanon). And it's fair to say that Hezbollah's actions and utterly benign when contrasted to the terror Israel inflicts on Gaza and the occupied West Bank. I'd object no more to a Hezbollah banner than I object to Communist banner in the anti-apartheid struggle.

    Hamas, are more problematic than Hezbollah, but are also seen as a political party, which they of course are. Fun fact: Hamas was set up by Israel and the United Stares, as an opposition to the PLO.

  25. #25

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