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    Barcelona Van Crash

    In the Ramblas.

    #2
    Bit scary, this. Our hotel is a few metres inside the police roadblock, a block from Plaça Catalunya, so we can't get back to it. But mostly, in case anyone here was aware I was in Barcelona at present, we're okay.

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      #3
      I thought that one of us was there currently. Glad to hear that you're ok Sam.

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        #4
        Deaths confirmed.

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          #5
          El Pais reports three deaths confirmed.

          Stay safe, Sam.

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            #6
            Fuck. Be safe, Sam. I'm going there in 6 weeks, so this news is making me really nervous.

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              #7
              Now up to "at least 13" confirmed dead.

              Jesus Cristo

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                #8
                Police have just confirmed one dead and 32 injured apparently, though I've only got the Guardian live blog to go on. It'll be amazing if the toll is that low given the van apparently got halfway down the Rambla before coming to a halt.

                I'm now drinking sangria with my girlfriend and my ex-flatmate on the roof of the latter's hotel, because doing anything else would feel like letting the dickheads win. Although it is mostly because we can't get into our own hotel. Could really do with a shower.

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                  #9
                  Going there in 5 weeks time but that doesn't really matter, the security will be beefed up by then. Glad to hear you're safe, Sam.

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by Bruno
                    Trump has leaped at the chance to call this terrorism.
                    Much faster than when a neo-Nazi ran people over in his own country. What a surprise!

                    Anyway, the shock of these kinds of attacks never lessens. I keep expecting them to stop. How many people could there really be in the world willing to carry them out? They always make me feel sick and useless.

                    Glad you're safe, Sam.

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                      #11
                      Great to see you back, kid.

                      Wish the occasion was more propitious.

                      As to your question, I'm afraid the number is at least in the hundreds, if not the thousands.

                      I'm also afraid that the muppets who are using vehicles as weapons harbour a belief that they can escape (as this one did momentarily).

                      If their own death is not a certainty, the number increases significantly.

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                        #12
                        Thanks, ursus. It's been a busy year, so that and the site changes have kept me off OTF for a while.

                        I know you're right about the numbers of people willing to do this, but when you think about everything entailed, physically and mentally, it seems insane that anybody could do it. But of course they do.

                        Mrs. Renart and I have been planning a trip to Barcelona for next summer.

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                          #13
                          You should definitely go.

                          It's a very special place and today doesn't change that at all.

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                            #14
                            I want to say "shocked" but that's just not true any more.

                            It doesn't even qualify as any kind of silver lining, but once again I'm impressed by the calm and clarity of so many eye witnesses in the news. Keeping their cool when suddenly thrust into the media spotlight. I don't think I would.

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                              #15
                              Barcelona has survived far worse in the last century, but this news is sickening on many levels.

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                                #16
                                Empire State Building lit up in the color's of Spain's flag. But many in Barcelona don't consider themselves part of Spain, right? So what's the right thing to do here, colorwise. Or will they accept the gesture regardless?

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                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by Renart View Post
                                  Much faster than when a neo-Nazi ran people over in his own country. What a surprise!

                                  Anyway, the shock of these kinds of attacks never lessens. I keep expecting them to stop. How many people could there really be in the world willing to carry them out? They always make me feel sick and useless.

                                  Glad you're safe, Sam.
                                  Still hasn't said anything about a full-on attack on a Mosque in Minnesota.


                                  The thing is, what can be possibly done about stopping these kind of car attacks? Put hard concrete thingies on every street curb everywhere? Maybe some European cities will consider something like that for especially busy areas, but that's not very practical.

                                  I was thinking it would be nice if every road and street everywhere had some kind of barrier along it to prevent small animals from getting squished, stopping pedestrians from jay-walking, and stopping cars from accidentally or intentionally going on the sidewalk. But the cost of that...

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                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Hot Pepsi View Post
                                    Empire State Building lit up in the color's of Spain's flag. But many in Barcelona don't consider themselves part of Spain, right? So what's the right thing to do here, colorwise. Or will they accept the gesture regardless?
                                    Thankfully, the Catalan flag has the same colours

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                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by ursus arctos View Post
                                      Thankfully, the Catalan flag has the same colours
                                      Oh. I thought they had more blue, like Barca's shirts.

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                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Hot Pepsi View Post
                                        Still hasn't said anything about a full-on attack on a Mosque in Minnesota.


                                        The thing is, what can be possibly done about stopping these kind of car attacks? Put hard concrete thingies on every street curb everywhere? Maybe some European cities will consider something like that for especially busy areas, but that's not very practical.

                                        I was thinking it would be nice if every road and street everywhere had some kind of barrier along it to prevent small animals from getting squished, stopping pedestrians from jay-walking, and stopping cars from accidentally or intentionally going on the sidewalk. But the cost of that...
                                        Pedestrianise city centres. There would be massive health and livability benefits in addition to heavily reducing the risk of these attacks. Plus people really, really need to get used to driving less, because global warming. You'd need to make allowances for deliveries and such, but this needs to happen. The reasons why it won't, and won't even get suggested by anyone with influence, are depressingly obvious.

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                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by delicatemoth View Post
                                          Pedestrianise city centres. There would be massive health and livability benefits in addition to heavily reducing the risk of these attacks. Plus people really, really need to get used to driving less, because global warming. You'd need to make allowances for deliveries and such, but this needs to happen. The reasons why it won't, and won't even get suggested by anyone with influence, are depressingly obvious.
                                          Totally agree. But as long as it's physically possible to drive a car or truck through a particular area, there's a chance that terrorists can do it. So there still need to be barriers of various sorts that prevent that while letting pedestrians and/or bicycles to move through. But you probably can't just line every street with New Jersey barriers, because that's very expensive and increases the risk of accidents if a car accidentally veers off course.

                                          After Oklahoma City - or maybe it was after all those Marines were killed in Beruit in the 80s - a lot of office buildings in Washington DC put up protections that would prevent a vehicle from driving over the sidewalk and into the building.

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                                            #22
                                            Las Vegas already has plans for bollards to go up all along the strip. These things can take a truck driving at 50mph with a force of 15,000lbs. So, the bollard will go straight through the vehicle, unless it's an armoured van or something.

                                            However, there may be an uprise in the number of accidents where drunk people have fallen off the pavement and been hit by a car.

                                            *Incidentally, these plans were already in place long before people started getting all weapon-y with their cars for terrorism purposes. Last year, a woman who was having some mental health issues, drove her car into the pedestrians on the strip, and killed 1 and injured 37.
                                            Last edited by Gerontophile; 18-08-2017, 04:12.

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                                              #23
                                              Originally posted by Hot Pepsi View Post
                                              The thing is, what can be possibly done about stopping these kind of car attacks?
                                              You can't, really. And even if we could, terrorists would just find another way to do their thing. We cannot protect ourselves completely from such horrible events. My personal revenge is to live well.

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                                                #24
                                                Some attack in Turku in Finland apparently now as well.

                                                Turku is a small town on the edge of Europe where you'd think you'd be safe from this kind of shit.
                                                Last edited by anton pulisov; 18-08-2017, 14:56.

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                                                  #25
                                                  It's unclear at the moment whether Turku is terrorism or just someone with a knife running amok.

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