Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Brexit Thread

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    I genuinely, genuinely hate this country.
    I genuinely, genuinely hate the Tories for going ahead with Brexit and hate Labour in general, and Jeremy Corbyn in particular, for collaborating with that.

    Comment


      The ERG makes its move.

      Comment


        You can keep him, y’know.

        We won’t even ask for anything in return.

        Comment


          Originally posted by ad hoc View Post
          I think it might depend on how strong the rebellious Tories perceived the likelihood of a Corbyn led Labour government being the result of the government falling. If they thought that they could win an election after that, then they might go for it.

          It's also possible that the more crafty of them might wait until the deal is nearly signed, with pretty much no room for manoeuvre and then act to bring down May, reasoning that Corbyn would then own whatever mess the country would get into as a result. Given that there is a sizeable proportion of MPs (on both sides of the house) who appear to think that this is all about party politics and their own power/status and as a result are not in the least bit concerned in the effects of this on actual people, this seems possible too.
          May will be removed as leader of the Tory Party long before she loses a No Cofidence vote in the Commons. She will then announce that she will step down as Prime Minister in favour of her replacement in the Tories. None of this brings down the government, cf. the transition from Cameron to May, Thatcher to Major or indeed Blair to Brown. British Governments are allowed to change their Prime Minister mid-term, if they wish to.

          Comment


            https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1016357278612623360

            Comment


              Originally posted by Janik View Post
              May will be removed as leader of the Tory Party long before she loses a No Cofidence vote in the Commons. She will then announce that she will step down as Prime Minister in favour of her replacement in the Tories. None of this brings down the government, cf. the transition from Cameron to May, Thatcher to Major or indeed Blair to Brown. British Governments are allowed to change their Prime Minister mid-term, if they wish to.
              Yes, you're right. Apologies. However, I suspect May stepping down as leader of the Tories does result in a general election because the civil war that would erupt in the party over her successor would probably bring down the government. May is the compromise candidate now. Which other compromise candidates are sitting there waiting to be brought in? Jeremy Hunt?

              Comment


                Originally posted by johnr View Post
                Just wondering LW, is your occasional flagging up of these sort of tweets a response to those (of us) who claim that Kuenssberg is biased to the right? If so, I still don't resile from that; what she is describing in that tweet is very close to fact, and that is indeed her job
                I just find it funny, John. The BBC is the most institutionally left-leaning organisation I've ever worked for, and that includes the Guardian and the Labour Party.

                I think hatred of Kuenssberg (and it is all focused on Kuenssberg) has become calcified to the point where it can be very hard to step back from and see the double standard in claiming (for example) that when Kuenssberg says Labour is in chaos it's bias, and when she says the Tories are it's simply fact, especially when her interpretation is shown within hours to be incorrect.

                Comment


                  https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/1016357278612623360
                  That is a very hopeful way of looking at it. The variation here looks like noise and margin-of-error issues and little more. The bit of the graph around the turn of the year, when opinion apparently switchbacked repeatedly between an 8-10% majority agreeing to disagreeing then agreeing again and then finally a smaller margin disagreeing once more is probably the most instructive bit of it. In all likelihood overall opinion barely moved at all during this period, and the variation is just sampling error... which the record high remains with.
                  Last edited by Janik; 13-07-2018, 10:30.

                  Comment


                    SNP up in Scotland, Labour and Tories both significantly down:

                    https://mobile.twitter.com/britainel...08675086069762

                    Gives you:

                    SNP 48
                    Con 6
                    Lib Dems 4
                    Labour 1
                    Last edited by Diable Rouge; 13-07-2018, 14:55.

                    Comment


                      So, um, apparently the Treasury Select Committee is holding an evidence session on the impact of Brexit at the Farnborough Air Show. I didn't realise they could do that.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Lucy Waterman View Post
                        I just find it funny, John. The BBC is the most institutionally left-leaning organisation I've ever worked for, and that includes the Guardian and the Labour Party.

                        I think hatred of Kuenssberg (and it is all focused on Kuenssberg) has become calcified to the point where it can be very hard to step back from and see the double standard in claiming (for example) that when Kuenssberg says Labour is in chaos it's bias, and when she says the Tories are it's simply fact, especially when her interpretation is shown within hours to be incorrect.
                        Thanks Lucy. Not working for but just observing them, it always seems to me that the BBC is broadly culturally and institionally 'left', whereas its news/current affairs output/viewpoint is very 'right'. Fwiw, I don't just think its Kuennsberg, it's also Neil, Humphreys, Robinson, Dimbleby, the Editors, etc.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Crveni Vrag View Post
                          SNP up in Scotland, Labour and Tories both significantly down:

                          https://mobile.twitter.com/britainel...08675086069762

                          Gives you:

                          SNP 48
                          Con 6
                          Lib Dems 4
                          Labour 1
                          Haha fuck the fuck off Ruth Davidson. And shitey useless Lexit fanny Leonard and pals at the branch office).

                          Btw, what was yr old username (assuming it’s been changed)? The World Cup name changes twist my melon

                          Comment


                            Diable Rouge.

                            Comment


                              Cheers Snake

                              Comment


                                The BBC is socially liberal and economically liberal, as far as I can see. So, on balance, right wing.

                                Comment


                                  Originally posted by johnr View Post
                                  Thanks Lucy. Not working for but just observing them, it always seems to me that the BBC is broadly culturally and institionally 'left', whereas its news/current affairs output/viewpoint is very 'right'. Fwiw, I don't just think its Kuennsberg, it's also Neil, Humphreys, Robinson, Dimbleby, the Editors, etc.
                                  Their bias is such that, when people call them out on it, they respond by taking the piss.
                                  https://twitter.com/RegencyLabour/st...02346154332160

                                  Comment


                                    Originally posted by sw2borshch View Post
                                    The BBC is socially liberal and economically liberal, as far as I can see. So, on balance, right wing.
                                    Like the Democrats and New Labour

                                    Comment


                                      I think I've gone over to the full on Stop Brexit side now. Even the proper soft Brexit will lead to enough of a write down to bring (genuine) economic anxiety that'll probably help nationalist goons push the rest of the way to oblivion.

                                      I don't underestimate the practical difficulties for any mainstream politician having to get us out of this shit.

                                      Comment


                                        Looks like UKIP are back:

                                        Lab 40% (-)
                                        Con 36% (-6)
                                        UKIP 8% (+5)
                                        Lib Dem 8% (+1)

                                        https://www.theguardian.com/politics...neral-election

                                        Comment


                                          Further proof that these polls don't mean shit.

                                          Comment


                                            The seat projection, for what it's worth:

                                            Lab 300 (+38)
                                            Con 267 (-51)
                                            SNP 42 (+7)
                                            Lib Dem 19 (+7)
                                            Plaid 3 (-1)
                                            Green 1
                                            NI 18

                                            Comment


                                              Nick Cohen is obviously more often to wrong than right these days, but this is good (despite the by now standard non sequitur paragraph about the "Marxist" Labour Party)
                                              https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2018/0...lot-on-brexit/

                                              Comment


                                                I was going to post that with an identical comment.

                                                I imagine that it’s relative coherence is due to a different editor and his writing for a different audience.

                                                Comment


                                                  Old Labour "intellectual" left Eurosceptic, Bryan Gould.

                                                  http://www.bryangould.com/what-brexit-is-really-about/

                                                  In which he asserts that Britain's EU deal was "very bad" and good for France and Germany- which is an odd reading of the economic performance of Britain and France in the EU. And that working people had their "employment prospects" messed up by Eastern European immigrants, as well as access to housing and public services, apparently. No evidence is provided for these assertions at all.

                                                  Of all the political and media actors, he hones in on "bien pensants" associated with The Guardian who want to overturn the referendum result. Brussels is "punishing" Britain, but Brexit is an "opportunity" provided "hearts and minds are big enough". Not the slightest hint of a plan.

                                                  You won't get a better example of Lexitism being the mirror image of Rees Mogg Brexit.

                                                  How much of service Neil Kinnock did marginalizing this sort of nonsense in Labour.

                                                  Comment


                                                    From the Mail, so I'll spare you the link.

                                                    My deal is the only Brexit deal - wreck it at your peril: THERESA MAY's steely warning to Tory rebels AND those bully boys from Brussels

                                                    Our Brexit deal for Britain seizes the moment to deliver the democratic decision of the British people and secure a bright new future for our country outside the European Union.

                                                    It restores our national sovereignty, so that it is our Government that decides who comes into our country, our Parliaments that make our laws and our courts that enforce them.

                                                    It puts an end to the vast membership subscriptions we pay to Brussels, delivering a Brexit dividend to support domestic priorities like our long-term plan for the NHS.
                                                    Unbelievable.

                                                    Comment

                                                    Working...
                                                    X