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In awe of a narky Scottish God

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    Given the previous inbalance is favour, particularly so. Though Federer has give up trying to compete with Nadal on clay.

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      How likely is Federer to be No. 1 after the Australian Open?

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        Originally posted by Janik View Post
        Given the previous inbalance is favour, particularly so. Though Federer has give up trying to compete with Nadal on clay.
        Judging by Nadal's display at the French Open this year, i would say that was the smart move.

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          Based on the extended highlights I've just watched, Rafa might want to skip any hard court events where Federer is fully fit for similar reasons. The scoreline today looks fairly tight at 6-4 6-3. The reality was anything but, it was a thrashing. I'm not sure Rafa ever had a break point on Roger's serve and he certainly never looked like he had him in any sort of trouble. As with Miami. As with Indian Wells. Nadal hasn't broken Federer's serve in any of the six sets played in those events, whilst Roger has broken Rafa's around once every three service games.

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            This thread has gone a little quiet due to the form and injury slumps of the respective British No.1s (Konta has ended her season and split with her coach). However it's been a decent week this week on the WTA Tour.
            Naomi Broady got a break as she landed a lucky loser spot into the main draw in Luxembourg following defeat to Pauline Parmentier in final qualifying. She made the most of it, beating #6 Tatjana Maria and Sabine Lisicki [WC] before losing in the QFs to Olympic Champion Monica Puig (just like Big Serving Sam Groth, that is now Puig's full name I believe). Heather Watson didn't need any such shenanigans to get into the main draw, she qualified by right, and she also made the QFs with two good wins (Yanina Wickamyer [Q] and #3 Anett Kontaveit) before also losing yesterday to #5 Elise Mertens. Broady also lost in R1 of the Luxembourg doubles. However there is one Brit who plays WTA Tour-level only whose season is not quite done, as Smith/Melichar have made the final of the Moscow Premier event. The title match will be tough as their opponents are top seeds Babos/Hlavackova. Anna Smith will break into the top 50 by dint of the run to the final alone and would push up to just outside the top 40 if she and Melichar can win the title. Either way she can book her flights and accommodation for Melbourne as baring injury she will be playing. Heck she and Melichar will be close to being seeded in the next Slam!

            Fuller update to come... at some point.

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              Andy Murray is the greatest Scottish sportsman of my lifetime. Chris Hoy and Kenny Dalglish are next.

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                Chris Hoy aye? Alan Wells on wheels, I await the revelations in twenty years about his special juice (he says without a jot of proof other than Hoy being a Tory cnut).

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                  However wonderful Murray is in both sporting and political terms, he is not the best of his generation at his sport. Or even the second, three others stand clearly in front of him. I tend to regard that as a disqualifying criteria from being a countries Greatest Ever, unless that country is small enough to have never produced a dominant sporting figure. Which isn't the case for Scotland (Hoy as acknowledged, probably others if I thought about it for a few minutes).

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                    Jocky Wilson. Not joking.

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                      And Stephen Fucking Hendry, to continue on the Tory cnut theme.

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                        Originally posted by Lang Spoon View Post
                        Chris Hoy aye? Alan Wells on wheels, I await the revelations in twenty years about his special juice (he says without a jot of proof other than Hoy being a Tory cnut).
                        Is there proof about Wells?

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                          Panorama/BBC Scotland investigation that focused on Mr Farrah’s Fantastic Trainer at NikeLand also historically reported an ex track mate of Wells saying he was a wrong ‘un.

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                            OK. Will post links to the drugs thread to avoid derailing this.

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                              Originally posted by Janik View Post
                              However wonderful Murray is in both sporting and political terms, he is not the best of his generation at his sport. Or even the second, three others stand clearly in front of him. I tend to regard that as a disqualifying criteria from being a countries Greatest Ever, unless that country is small enough to have never produced a dominant sporting figure. Which isn't the case for Scotland (Hoy as acknowledged, probably others if I thought about it for a few minutes).
                              Hang on though Janik, that doesn't disqualify him from being potentially Scotland's greatest sportsman. It's neither here nor there how many other countries have managed to produce simultaneously greater ones, which is hardly Scotland's fault. He's still indubitably a great player and would hold his own against nearly any other to have played the sport; to be able to eventually forge a path to the very top even in the face of competition from the aforementioned trio is by itself a huge achievement.
                              And it's a much more worldwide sport, too; the likes of Hoy, Hendry and others – Jocky Wilson too, if it comes to it – have won great and sustained individual success, yes, but in what are however relatively niche sports where serious competition is confined to comparatively few countries, which happen to include the UK/Scotland.

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                                That all seems bang on, Various.

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                                  I agree that he had more competition than exists in cycling. However, he also had the benefit of being able to develop his talents overseas, not confined to Scottish facilities.

                                  Other contenders to consider: Jackie Stewart, Denis Law, Yvonne Murray or even heroes from very old days like Hughie Gallacher. But not wrong 'un Allan Wells.

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                                    I don’t feel “proud” of Scottish people just cos I’m Scottish. Can’t be gassed with that shite as a rule. It was pretty extraordinary that a Scottish player has won two of the four Big Tournaments. At a Sport most Scots only play for a few weeks in summer across washing lines in wee back greens, with wooden or plastic racquets. But I couldn’t help feeling a bit teared up when Murray won his Majors.
                                    Last edited by Lang Spoon; 21-10-2017, 00:47.

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                                      Jim Clark as well.

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                                        I'm unconvinced by Murray as an overall great of Tennis. He hasn't won enough and won't do so in the handful of years he has remaining. World class in his era? Yes, that is for sure. A future Hall of Famer? Very much touch and go. His achievements pale next to Hendry's.

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                                          I dont disagree with your overall assessment, but Michael Chang is in the International Tennis Hall of Fane.

                                          Murray is a lock.

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                                            Hall of Fame threshold is fairly low (Roddick, Safin, Kuerten). There ought to be another Hall for GOAT Top 10 or so. Murray for me is about 12th-15th in the Open era, which is not bad but not Hendry or Jim Clark.

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                                              Yeah, even Sabatini is in the HoF (1 singles major, 1 doubles major). Murray is clearly ahead of many in there.

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                                                I didn't even know such a thing existed. Is it an actual place you can go to, or just a metaphorical 'Hall'?

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                                                  It's a place. In the former Casino of Newport, Rhode Island

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                                                    With all due respect to players of snooker and other geographically niche sports, I think Murray's having become, say, around the 15th greatest male tennis player in history (if that's in the right ballpark, historical ranking-wise) must, given the relative extent of worldwide competition, be roughly equivalent to becoming something around the 2nd best snooker player in history, whoever that might be.

                                                    I don't know enough about cycling to judge how that stacks up in terms of the size of the competitive field compared to tennis.

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