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    Originally posted by antoine polus View Post
    Well the ones from 2008-2014 certainly do, and would have influenced how people were thinking in 2016.

    I'd love to find the stats from 2008-2016.
    This looks like it fits the bill.

    https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA672N

    Not spectacular, but as I say, if Cameron delivers that, he romps home by 100 seats. Cleaned up Labour's mess for a couple of years, and vote your wage slip. The campaign doesn't get defined by how Port Talbot or Peterlee are doing.

    Add in the handy recovery of manufacturing that the US had, and Cameron would be walking on water, with talk of rebalancing the economy,

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      Originally posted by Tubby Isaacs View Post
      This looks like it fits the bill.

      https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA672N

      Not spectacular, but as I say, if Cameron delivers that, he romps home by 100 seats. Cleaned up Labour's mess for a couple of years, and vote your wage slip. The campaign doesn't get defined by how Port Talbot or Peterlee are doing.

      Add in the handy recovery of manufacturing that the US had, and Cameron would be walking on water, with talk of rebalancing the economy,
      You can look at how that fits into the long term and, indeed, compare it to the UK:

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        That misses out the rises to 2014 to 2016.

        I recognize the longer trends (those are my point on manufacturing) but the Democrats only had Presidency and Congress for 4 of those years in that graph.

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          We'll have to wait before we know if the small rises between 2014 and 2016 are significant on the long term. Similar to how you can't make inferences about climate change from one our two years of data.

          As for the Democrats not having had an ability to affect real, structural change in the past 30 years... it might say something about them needing to change tack (assuming they want to).

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            Yeah, they might have had different platforms and they might well have done better. But that's not really the point. The point is you can't hold them responsible for 30 years worth of underwhelming wages if they weren't in power. Their platform now (partly due to Sanders, I give him that) was much better than their opponent.

            And sure, we don't know if the improved incomes recently were down to Obama. But it just seems that the Right don't get asked to jump those hurdles.

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              Originally posted by Tubby Isaacs View Post
              Wow. One of Roy Moore's "election experts" is a Holocaust denier.
              Roy's views on Jews are likely to attract that kind of Nutzi

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                Indeed.

                Trump's apparently doing very well out of the New Year Party at his resort.

                Business experience.

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                  I've got Meet the Press on, and they're discussing the 2018 House Elections.

                  Nobody has thought it worth mentioning gerrymandering.

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                    FiveThirtyEight have a really interesting podcast series on gerrymandering at the moment. Really fascinating to hear about exactly how both sides have (unsurprisingly) used it as an opportunity to posture and use it to their advantage...

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                      On that subject

                      Indeed, North Carolina does so poorly on the measures of legal framework and voter registration, that on those indicators we rank alongside Iran and Venezuela. When it comes to the integrity of the voting district boundaries no country has ever received as low a score as the 7/100 North Carolina received. North Carolina is not only the worst state in the USA for unfair districting but the worst entity in the world ever analyzed by the Electoral Integrity Project.

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                        Orrin Hatch will not run for re-election.

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                          Oooh! Senator Mittens is on his way!

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                            Which will not please 45 at all, if it happens. And may not please Mitch McConnell much, either.

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                              Would 45 put up a primary challenger against him?

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                                Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View Post
                                Would 45 put up a primary challenger against him?
                                I doubt it. And a challenger probably wouldn't win. Mitt is pretty popular in Utah. And Trump is actually very unpopular. The idea of a separate power-center from Utah in the Senate that's conservative but standing up to Trump would - I think - be very popular there.

                                Utah's conservative but not at all Trumpish. Mormons, being a religious minority, are pretty big on the idea of defending religious minorities (despite the historical racism of the church). So the anti-muslim animus and the anti-semitic stuff from the Bannon wing of Trumpism is deeply unpopular in Utah.

                                Utah seems to have a very distinct strain of Republicanism that puts it apart from the broadly Libertarian, very, very white, gun-toting, leave us alone in our cabins as proud fontiersmen, no government taxation and no government stewardship of land, strain that exists in much of the mountain west, in places like Idaho and Montana and Wyoming (and, I think, the Dakotas, and even inland Washington, Oregon and California). Utah's Republicanism has connections with that Mountain West strain, but has its own independent characteristics.

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                                  Nigel Farage‏Verified account
                                  @Nigel_Farage
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                                  RT if you think @SadiqKhan should spend less time grandstanding about @realDonaldTrump and more time tackling epidemic levels of knife crime in London.
                                  Asian man repeatedly attacked by mate of Farage's. And it's the Asian bloke who is at fault for responding, with far more dignity.

                                  Note how the Twitter brainstrust has taken Farage's hint.

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                                    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/948355557022420992

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                                      Trump definitely can't find his dick anymore

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                                        How difficult can it be get both these two guys in a room with a tape measure and someone to hold it (so to speak.)

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                                          Hmm, a Lobotomy for each would be more appropriate IMO.

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                                            This kind of brinkmanship does not always end well.

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                                              Won't somebody take a hammer to Trump's fingers?

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                                                Why stop there?

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                                                  So, yesterday on Twitter, he waved his nuclear willy at North Korea, claimed personal credit for the seventh straight year of no commercial aviation fatalities in the US, openly sided with Israel against Palestine, quoted Lou Dobbs praising him, claimed that Hispanics will fall in love with him because he ended DACA, and announced some weird Fake News Awards thing. And this is how he behaves after taking a holiday. God help us.

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                                                    I posted it upthread. There's a few here that disagree with it, but I think it's pretty sound.

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