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    Holy shit. I didn't dare think it would actually happen. There's still a tiny bit of hope left, even in Alabama. My dad'll be pleased, as he's going back to Montgomery for a reunion next year. Should make things a bit less awkward/morose.

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      Before I was so rudely interrupted, yeah, ALABAMA, woohoo. Now there is offence in Nevada, Minnesota, the Cordyen guy, and apparently some woman who never touched a man in her life.

      However, WOOFUCKINGHOO.

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        I didn't believe it would happen either. I was sure that Moore would get help from the voter suppression efforts and possibly from the Kremlin too. I'm happy to be wrong.

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          If Americans vote, and they get counted honestly, Democrats win. Mostly.

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              Nope, I'm fine with that.

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                Oh, and it's not over yet.

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                  The lesson for the Democrats is COMPETE IN EVERY STATE.

                  The other lesson is to not take black voters for granted. Democrats need to earn their votes, and black voters should feel entitled to be listed to by Jones, because they're the only reason he is there. Black voters voted for Jones 92 to 8.

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                    Originally posted by Gerontophile View Post
                    If Americans vote, and they get counted honestly, Democrats win. Mostly.
                    Well, yeah, that's why Republicans cheat.

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                      But, more to the point, EVERY WHITE WOMAN IS RACIST!!! (of the 58% who voted for that c*nt.)

                      Fucking hell Inca. I've just danced around the room, without looking at Twitter, and I saw the same results (nice that they managed to get the actual votes as they came in, eh? Mike Farb is a fucking star.)

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                        http://electionlawblog.org/?p=96376

                        ^

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                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66zVGG2uPG0

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                            Fucking hell! I never thought it would happen. I thought it might be close-ish, like 5-10% for Moore. But despite some evidence otherwise, I just never thought Alabama would do this. Well done, all those Republicans who stayed home.

                            This should mean that (a) Democrats should compete everywhere; and (b) Republicans really can't nominate anyone at all - the horse-with-a-rosette didn't win in fucking Alabama. There is literally nowhere that a Republican is safe just because he has (R) by his name. So stop nominating these fucking arseholes.

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                              I've 'lived' here for two years.

                              That one counts.

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                                Yeah, pleasing election results lately. But just watch it, in the mid-terms the Dems are going to get fucked again, and we'll wonder what good all the hope did us.

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                                  Originally posted by Incandenza View Post
                                  The lesson for the Democrats is COMPETE IN EVERY STATE.
                                  Yep. Something that I read online: Clinton spent a shit ton of money in "swing stage" Ohio and lost by 8.1%. She spent not a single penny in "Republican state" Texas and lost by a similar margin: 8.9%. That tells you that things are more fluid than they would seem. Trump demonstrated as much when he broke through the "blue wall".

                                  Texas has been ignored for a long time, but what people forget is that in 1980, 1984, 1988, 1992, 2000 and 2004 there was a former governor of Texas on the Republican ticket. And in 1996 Ross Perot was running. So any electoral models that incorporate those elections when predicting where to spend advertising money may be biased against Democrats: that's probably why Obama didn't bother competing there either. The last time the Democrats really competed on the ground in Texas was 1976, when it was a much, much less diverse state than it is now. And Carter won it.

                                  edit: Texans love people from their own state. I would even go so far as to say that if the Democrats ran a Texan Democrat against Trump in 2020 that they'd take the state easily.
                                  Last edited by anton pulisov; 13-12-2017, 12:44.

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                                    Another Carter would be very handy with rural whites. Is John Tester of Montana any kind of vice presidential prospect?

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                                      I hope Mr Trump will remember
                                      A Southern Woman don't need him around anyway

                                      No Sirree

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                                        Tubbs, it is insanely early to talk about vice presidential possibilities, especially as there is no clarity at all as to who the presidential candidates will be.

                                        Tester also has virtually no national profile and comes from a state with three electoral votes where HRC got barely a third of the vote and which may actually be turning more right wing via internal immigration.

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                                          Howard Dean's 50-state strategy is so obviously the correct way to go that the people in the DNC who killed it should really be vetted to see whether they're Republican moles. Alabama had the Democratic trifecta (Governor, state House of Representatives and state Senate) as late as 2002 and had Senate and House control until 2010, even in 'Bama it's not a fait accompli that the GOP will run everything there.

                                          Obama really deserves a lot of criticism for letting this happen. This can't be chalked up to John Boehner or Mitch McConnell or Paul Ryan. The Dems had 32 Governorships in 2008, they have 16 now. They had complete control of 27 state legislatures in 2008, 14 now. There was split control in 9 states in 2008, just 4 now. From 2008 to 2016 the Dems lost 968 seats in the state legislature, more than under any president in either party since World War II.

                                          It's a fucking joke.

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                                            George HW Bush wasn't a former governor; he was a two-term Representative from the 7th District a deacde earlier. I think the broader point holds. The Clinton campaign was fucking abysmal, made up of all sorts of two-decades old stale mantras and strategies that had stopped working in practice but they weren't going to let any contact with reality shake them from implemeting.

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                                              He just intrigued me as a farmer Democrat.

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                                                If there is a single lesson to be taken from last night (and I would never take a single lesson from such a sui generis contest), it is that bending over backwards to appeal to white working class/rural voters is a complete waste of time and money.

                                                Just look at Exit Polls. The most toxic GOP candidate in recent history still won 79% of non-college educated white men and 73% of non-college educated white women.

                                                Democrats need to focus on energizing and turning out their base and at least casting doubt in the minds of educated suburban Republicans, particularly women. Jones won because Black turnout was exceptionally high and because enough suburban white women either stayed home or cast a write in vote.

                                                Last night's results are also a perfect illustration of why voter suppression targeting people of colour in general and black people in particular has become such a key element of GOP strategy nationwide.

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                                                  Tax cuts might be harder to get through?
                                                  There's going to be an interesting fight as to whether the Senate seats Jones before they vote on the bill that comes out of conference.

                                                  The most relevant precedent is the Republicans insisting that Scott Brown be seated before the final vote on Obamacare following his special election defeat of Martha Coakley.

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                                                    ... "and go back to your constituencies, and prepare for absolutely nothing to change. Unless you do."

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