The Refereeing Thread

[Ray de Galles]

Sad to hear your packing it in (particularly as I enjoy the blog) but good for your quality of life, I’m sure.

[San Bernardhinault]

What everyone else said. I've always enjoyed reading your intelligent analysis of the rules and terrifying descriptions of German thugs. I hope your local leagues/FA are wise enough to take advantage of your knowledge and insight in some form, whether as a widely reviled ref supervisor criticising from the sidelines, or coaching young refs, or something else.

[ad hoc]

Yes, supporting everything that's been said here.

[imp]

The thing about refereeing is that although nearly everyone agrees about leaving the ref only, most people will also find a reason why this time their screaming at the ref was justified. I found it embassaring in the past when parents of my youth teams players started shouting at nervous 15-only refs. I'm glad I'm no longer involved.

And then afterwards they say, "Sorry, I get emotional." Then go watch a fucking rom-com.

[jason voorhees]

Missed this at the time, but the second I saw this, I had to inform thine imp.

After 4 decades of watching games, of watching game after game of refs having to go through the ridiculous rigmarole of checking and inspecting nets as part of their tasks....it finally showed to be a valuable task.

Cerro Porteño v Big Phil's Palmerias. Asuncion Paraguay. Copa Libertadores.

Hole in the bottom of the side net. Probably a weed wacker or lawn mower. 10 minutes of close-up repair jobs.

Finally, a ziptie was called in after the multiple hand-sewn knots did not pass muster.

Sorry about Frankfurt, but yes, the kids need good coaches.

[Hot Pepsi]

Sorry you couldn’t end such an illustrious and, no doubt, very lucrative career on your own terms but it’s not worth crippling yourself over it. I’m sure you’ll have more fun coaching.

[imp]

At the end of the World Cup, kicker wrote an editorial proposing some discussion-worthy law changes to try and put the stoppers on excessive time-wasting, dissent and unsporting conduct. Two months later, and I've finally got around to translating them.

[ingoldale]

At the end of the World Cup, kicker wrote an editorial proposing some discussion-worthy law changes to try and put the stoppers on excessive time-wasting, dissent and unsporting conduct. Two months later, and I've finally got around to translating them.

Surely an independent time keeper would be an easier, more manageable way of solving most of the issues/solutions proposed?

[Patrick Thistle]

I think there's some good ideas in the Kicker article. An independent time keeper would be a good idea. I like ice hockey where they literally stop the clock for breaks in play while the referees sort things out. i also like the klaxon when there's one minute left.

I would like to see orange cards which mean the player has to be substituted. The player has to leave the pitch immediately and the sub comes on at the next break in play. It would also be a way to get more gain time for the young English players who are getting splinters in their bottoms.

[JVL]

A referee controversially reverses his decision to give a goal-kick and awards a goal instead - in the B-Klasse Kaiserslautern-Donnersberg Süd. Now there are claims and counter-claims being made about whether the ref came to the sidelines to look at the video of the match on someone's mobile phone. One club says the ref changed his mind due to the watching phone footage, the other one denies it, and the ref allegedly admitted to the first club that he had, and it goes on and on... presumably the match will be declared void and replayed at some point...

[imp]

Kreisliga B games would be much more fun if they abolished refs and just let spectators with cell phones make all the decisions. It's about the level of officiating that it deserves.

[Patrick Thistle]

Question for Imp and the other refs, how was Iheanacho not offside in the Leicester v Huddersfield game when Vardy played the ball to him? He was clearly goalside of the defenders.

[Janik]

I've not seen the incident, but there is another element to the offside law than the position of the defenders and that is the position of the ball. A player is not offside if they are behind the ball and it is played forwards for them to move on to and collect.

[Patrick Thistle]

Oh that might be it then. He was overtaking Vardy but I'm not sure where he was when the ball was played

[Bermuda Iron]

To clarify, Law 11 states that a player is in an offside position if they are nearer to the opponents' goal line than both the ball and the second-last opponent. I have not see the incident either but he was behind the ball when last played by a teammate that could explain it?

[Janik]

Question for the refereeing fraternity in relation to today's long distance own goal by Man City Women. It went in partly because the goalie opted not to handle the back-pass but tried to head it away instead. She was abiding by the rules, etc. I assume, however, if she had just said to herself 'bad plan' and caught the ball, the only punishment her team would have suffered was an indirect free-kick (she was inside her area when it went over her, in case you can't get the video working). Is that correct? If yes, how come DOGSO wouldn't apply, seeing as by not going with her hands it bounced over her head and went in? And if DOGSO does apply, are there any examples of 'keepers being sent-off for making a cynical calculation to foul (i.e. handle a back-pass) to prevent an otherwise certain goal?

[seand]

The rules are pretty clear that a keeper can't be sent off for handball inside her box.

"A player, substitute or substituted player who commits any of the following offences is sent off:
denying the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity by deliberately handling the ball (except a goalkeeper within their penalty area)"

and

"an indirect free kick is awarded if a goalkeeper, inside their penalty area, commits any of the following offences:
touches the ball with the hands after:
it has been deliberately kicked to the goalkeeper by a team-mate"

It does seem to me to be a bit of an anomaly though, surely deliberately handling an overhit backpass is the same as a defendre deliberately handling a shot?

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

I suppose it's a get out for situations where a goalkeeper, while deliberately handling the ball, might not realise it's come them from a defender's foot as opposed to a head, or torso, or indeed an opponent. Any defender handling the ball in any of those situations is committing an offence no matter what.

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

Bbc has a clip of Stuttgart's keeper scoring an own goal after failing to trap a throw-in from a team mate. Focuses on the ball rolling over the top of his foot - I remember a similar one from a Brum derby, and the crux of it was that if the keeper hadn't touched it it wouldn't have been a goal, is that correct?

[treibeis]

According to the papers, it would have been a corner for Werder.

[Janik]

Peter Encklemann in the Brum derby. And yes, you can't score direct from a throw-in, in either net.

[danielmak]

I'm just now getting to PSG-Red Star from the mid-week CL. During the coin toss the Red Star player won and said they wanted to kick-off. The ref said that the Red Star player had to choose a side and couldn't opt to kick-off. I have not played organized football since I was a kid and I can't really remember paying close attention to the coin toss other than to post in another thread at some point about being surprised that the captain will win a coin toss and then look to the bench for info. about what to do (odd since one would think there is a plan). Anyway, is this Red Star situation accurate? The winner of the toss can't elect to kick-off. It certainly wasn't that way when I was playing in the super high level AYSO in Southern California.

[imp]

This video of an amateur referee officiating a Kreisliga A game in Duisburg is in German, but you‘ll soon get the gist once the game starts - it is exactly what I experienced every week.

[Bermuda Iron]

I'm just now getting to PSG-Red Star from the mid-week CL. During the coin toss the Red Star player won and said they wanted to kick-off. The ref said that the Red Star player had to choose a side and couldn't opt to kick-off.

The team that wins the toss decides which goal it will attack in the first half, their opponents then take the kick-off.

[Rogin the Armchair fan]

Is there just a gentlemans' agreement at some clubs about applying this? I'm thinking about Liverpool in particular, who attack the Kop end in the second half in way more than 75% of games (as they would if even half of opponents chose that option having won the toss).