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    #51
    Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

    The Empire's predecessor, the Republic, used clones to defeat the droids.

    The clones then massacred the Jedi under Order 66 and became the base for the Imperial Army.

    Although by the time of the Rebellion, c. 20 years later, the suggestion is that they were recruiting non-clones. Certainly the officer ranks were all different.

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      #52
      Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

      It's funny, after hating all of the political machination stuff in the prequels, there were points during this movie where I was wondering exactly what was happening. There's the First Order, who is opposed to the Republic. The Republic has created a Resistance. Do the First Order and the Republic control different territories/systems? Is the Resistance a sort of proxy army the Republic has created within First Order territory?

      I loved the movie overall, but there were some other things I had quibbles with. Like it's been pointed out here, how Rey is able to use the force so quickly. Also, I thought that Finn was able to do surprisingly well in the lightsaber duel with Kylo Ren. Though perhaps Kylo Ren has not learned to use his powers all that well.

      Why have such a crazy long gangway that Kylo Ren and Han were on without handrails or some barrier going across the entire way?

      I want to see it again so I can pay closer attention during Rey's vision/flashback (there was a lot to take in there), and honestly, just to hear Kylo Ren's voice some more. I loved his voice.

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        #53
        Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

        The lack of handrails on the various Death Stars has been a running joke for so long now I reckon Abrams kept that in for a laugh.

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          #54
          Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

          The architects of the Death Stars are clearly Nigel Farage/Jeremy Clarkson-types, who regard any workplace safety as PC-gone-mad.

          Comment


            #55
            Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

            I suppose when you're in charge of a machine whose sole purpose is to kill people by the billions, it does seem a bit redundant to worry about employee safety.

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              #56
              Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

              And you should see the complaints about the coffee in the canteen. This imperial admin stuff is hard work, far easier to just vaporise a few planets.

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                #57
                Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                Rogin the Armchair Fan wrote: I suppose when you're in charge of a machine whose sole purpose is to kill people by the billions, it does seem a bit redundant to worry about employee safety.
                They also like to get value for money from their highly-trained-from-toddler-age-killing-machines by getting them to do menial work, like sanitation, during their time off from slaughtering villagers...

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                  #58
                  Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                  Given their mixed results using this broadbrush approach, maybe they should hire Darth Brailsford and discover the force of the aggregation of marginal gains.

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                    #59
                    Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                    Right, seeing this again tomorrow, but in probably more cynical/spiteful mode, as it's my second time.

                    My repeat reviews from tomorrow afternoon might turn this thread nasty. I hope not.

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                      #60
                      Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                      After reading an article about the questions posed by TFA, I've come up with a, possibly mad, theory about Rey's mysterious heritage.

                      A lot of people are saying she must be Luke's daughter (along with all the other clues, apparently John Williams's "Skywalker theme" plays at various moments when she's on screen) but what if she's the product of an illicit relationship between Luke and Leia?

                      This would explain several things;

                      1) how come she's so adept at using the Force with no training - she's basically a Skywalker squared, the product of TWO force adept offspring of one of the most powerful Jedi/Sith Lords.

                      2) why Luke disappears - an incestuous relationship would not go down well with anyone, least of all Han, this combined with Ben/Kylo going over to the Dark Side might be enough to force Luke into hiding? Perhaps Luke planned to stay hidden until Han died, knowing that the knowledge of Rey's heritage could then no longer hurt him?

                      3) why Rey was hidden away on Jaaku - both protecting her from Ben/Kylo who was killing all the Jedi AND keeping her away from public sight

                      4) why Leia virtually ignores Chewie but comforts Rey when they return with the news of Han's death.

                      I must admit it'd be a ballsy move to feature outright incest in a Star Wars movie but it would certainly explain the slightly dodgy Luke/Leia relationship from ANH and the beginning of ESB.

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                        #61
                        Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                        I'm ... speechless.

                        Comment


                          #62
                          Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                          Okay, some further pondering of my own, after my second viewing.

                          There's lots of fan speculation that Rey will, despite the apparent intention of the ending, turn out to be Han and Leia's daughter after all (and thus Kylo Ren's sister). Whilst I can see that having them as brother and sister - not cousins - would add to the eventual narrative of the rest of the trilogy, it simply doesn't make sense to me that neither Han nor Leia would have acknowledged her as their daughter, having met her in the film, which Han openly does with Ben. Or that Kylo Ren himself doesn't refer to her as his sister and not "the girl", when he calls Han his father the first time Han's name is mentioned. Or that Leia immediately sends Rey off to find Luke by herself at the end, if she's just found her daughter after (twenty?) years. The only way that can happen is if somehow, someone has erased all memory of her from their minds. But why wouldn't that mind-wiper have done that, similarly, about their son?

                          However, I am a bit conflicted about the obvious "Rey is Luke's daughter" theory, too. One of her first lines in the film (to BB-8) is "classified? Yeah, me too", which suggests she knows who she is. And she is waiting on Jakku for someone (from her family) to come and get her. Yet when Luke's name is first mentioned, she reacts by saying she thought "he was just a myth". And at no point (known to us) does she openly ask Han Solo anything much about her Dad, which again seems strange if you've just met someone for the first time in your life who knows your estranged father.

                          My prediction for the backstory? I think she knows she's Obi-Wan's grandaughter, via a daughter of his we haven't met yet (and who is now dead, possibly killed by Kylo Ren himself - part of the flashback scene? - Maz Kanata telling her that in her heart she knows "the person" she's waiting for will never be coming?), so it WILL transpire she is Luke's daughter as well, Leia knows that, but for some reason (to do with the Knights of Ren business?) she (and her mother) were taken to Jakku at an age before she could remember him. In the flashback sequence we see her being abandoned on Jakku, but we don't know how long she'd been there before being abandoned - might have been her whole childhood up to that point. Luke, after all, was similarly abandoned on Tatooine, to keep him from the Empire, he might (in his Jedi wisdom) have made the same sacrifice to protect his daughter.

                          And having had a second look at Snoke, I'm a bit less cynical they've just cut and pasted Gollum into this one. I do continue to pray he doesn't turn out to actually be 60 feet tall, though.

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                            #63
                            Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                            Rogin the Armchair Fan wrote: And having had a second look at Snoke, I'm a bit less cynical they've just cut and pasted Gollum into this one. I do continue to pray he doesn't turn out to actually be 60 feet tall, though.
                            Snoke is more Lord Voldemort (plus nose) than Gollum.

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                              #64
                              Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                              Yes, there is a bit of that, too. I'd have preferred if they'd gone with something much more completely alien, really, like this trilogy's Jabba the Hutt. A disfigured but clearly humanoid character as the new baddie is a bit "Star Trek", really. Unless - for some inconceivable reason - he turns out to be the Sarlacc-spat-out remains of Boba Fett. But then Han would have referred to him as such?

                              Comment


                                #65
                                Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                Saw this at last night, family out voted me and we saw the 3D and not the 2D version.
                                Mix up with our collection of 3D glasses, and was about to watch it with a pair of sunglasses - but managed to grab a 3D pair just before the start.

                                The film itself - I hate do say this, similar feeling leaving as after seeing "Phantom Menace".
                                Maybe I was hoping for too much; but I was getting bored half way through.
                                Of course I admired the brilliant visages, the wonderful effects and the nice references to the other films; but did I really need a tarted up version of the original IV?
                                Liked the newcomers (apart from Captain Perky - the "best pilot in the 'verse" ), and the oldies did their chops.

                                I think I will always struggle, as I originally saw the first two (IV and V) as a double hitter and every Star Wars thing has been such a disappointment since, this just added to it. (Although the Clone one and the Sith one pleasantly surprised me)

                                To me not just miles behind the IV and V; but barely creeping ahead of "Attack of the Clones", and well behind "Revenge of the Sith" to me. (I struggle always to place Jedi as there are parts that are brilliant; but other bits I truly hate.)

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                                  #66
                                  Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                  VTT Boscombe wrote:

                                  did I really need a tarted up version of the original IV?
                                  Yes. Yes, you did. After the CGI dross of the last three, didn't we all?

                                  Comment


                                    #67
                                    Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                    Rogin the Armchair Fan wrote: VTT Boscombe wrote:

                                    did I really need a tarted up version of the original IV?
                                    Yes. Yes, you did. After the CGI dross of the last three, didn't we all?
                                    Sort of, but I really, really, really could've done without Death Star 3.0, that just seemed like really lazy scriptwriting.

                                    Comment


                                      #68
                                      Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                      Stumpy Pepys wrote:
                                      Originally posted by Rogin the Armchair Fan
                                      And having had a second look at Snoke, I'm a bit less cynical they've just cut and pasted Gollum into this one. I do continue to pray he doesn't turn out to actually be 60 feet tall, though.
                                      Snoke is more Lord Voldemort (plus nose) than Gollum.
                                      Andy Serkis and various other members of the crew have said that he's just over 7 feet tall.

                                      Comment


                                        #69
                                        Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                        Well that's okay. So's Chewbacca. Maybe THAT's the final clash of the trilogy, Chewie in a lightsabre battle with Snoke to avenge his old pal.

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                                          #70
                                          Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                          tratorello wrote:

                                          I really, really, really could've done without Death Star 3.0, that just seemed like really lazy scriptwriting.
                                          "Whoooohhh! Let's blow up that oscillator!"

                                          Comment


                                            #71
                                            Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                            Rogin the Armchair Fan wrote: tratorello wrote:

                                            I really, really, really could've done without Death Star 3.0, that just seemed like really lazy scriptwriting.
                                            "Whoooohhh! Let's blow up that oscillator!"
                                            Why not a big space battle without a Death Star?

                                            Wouldn't the First Order fleet against The Resistance Fleet be an exciting prospect?

                                            Or a daring First Order spaceship raid on the Galactic Senate (which would be the opposite of the 3 Death Star raids)?

                                            Alternatively, anything other than another fecking Death Star.

                                            Comment


                                              #72
                                              Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                              Saw it and enjoyed it. Angry General Ginger Fuhrer was fun.

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                                                #73
                                                Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                                Wasn't he? That's four appearances of his in a row where I've really enjoyed his performance (even in a couple of relatively minor roles) playing some very different characters.

                                                He's picked up a lot from his dad.

                                                .

                                                Comment


                                                  #74
                                                  Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                                  Just seen that, as speculated on upthread, General Hux and Captain Phasma must have survived the Starkiller as both are in the next film :

                                                  In December 2015, Hamill,[37] Isaac,[38] Christie,[39] and Boyega were confirmed to reprise their roles as Luke Skywalker, Poe Dameron, Captain Phasma and Finn, respectively.[40] Kennedy announced on December 17, 2015 at the London premiere for The Force Awakens that the entire cast would return for Episode VIII: "There will be a handful of new cast members in Episode VIII but also all the cast members you see here tonight will be in it as well", therefore also confirming Adam Driver, Lupita Nyong'o, Domhnall Gleeson, Carrie Fisher and Daisy Ridley reprising as well.[41]
                                                  A pretty big Solo spoiler there if you read between the lines. Only just discovered that Abrams is only executive directing the next two though, thought he was doing the whole trilogy.

                                                  .

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                                                    #75
                                                    Force Awakens Spoiler Thread.

                                                    Glad that Lupita Nyong'o will be back, I liked Maz.

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