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    #ExMuslimBecause

    It is very rare that I enter Twitter but this caught my attention and it begs the question: There must be a lot of people out there who abandon Islam, maybe now more than ever?

    I think it's great. In the end, it's another religion no different from the other bullshit ones peddled like miracle oil from the back of a wild west wagon.

    People throwing Islam in the bin might be the one and only good thing coming out of all this venom, vengence and war instigated not least by the west.

    (Try to get past that loon Dawkins being in there)

    #2
    #ExMuslimBecause

    "People throwing Islam in the bin might be the one and only good thing coming out of all this venom, vengence and war instigated not least by the west."

    Why?

    Comment


      #3
      #ExMuslimBecause

      EIM wrote: "People throwing Islam in the bin might be the one and only good thing coming out of all this venom, vengence and war instigated not least by the west."

      Why?
      Because I believe religion is useless crap.

      Comment


        #4
        #ExMuslimBecause

        It depends why they give it up. If they do so because they've developed critical thinking skills, that's a good thing, but if they give it up because they believe "Islam = evil" that's a bad thing, promoting anti-Islamic bigotry.

        "Religion is useless crap" can be disputed, even by an atheist like me. Religion wasn't useless in the Civil Rights Movement or in the hands of Gandhi. The Gospels have some good ideas, such as about tolerance.

        In any case, 1.5 billion people follow Islam. They are not all going to be giving it up anytime soon.

        Comment


          #5
          #ExMuslimBecause

          Ganja, if you are trying "to get past that loon Dawkins being in there", maybe it would help if you didn't sound like an undergrad version of him.

          As Satchmo points out, religion can be very useful socially and politically, just as it can be destructive.

          Take Pope Francis, whose mediation helped Obama change the long-entrenched Cuba boycott. Or his document Laudato Si' on the environment, which is having such an impact in informing consciences that Republican Catholics publicly distanced themselves from the pope.

          Or take Archbishop Desmond Tutu and other South African religious leaders, who provided political leadership when the apartheid regime silenced the political leaders.

          Or look to the role of the Lutheran church in Leipzig, which was central to the events that would lead to the fall of East Germany.

          And so on.

          Obviously, on a personal level, people find many good uses for religion. It is an act of idiotic arrogance to think that all believers are your intellectual inferiors who fall for snakeoil salesmen. Serious atheists dropped that kind of thought a decade ago.

          Comment


            #6
            #ExMuslimBecause

            Yes, I agree with them. Plus I'm also worried if this is being used by people who are dropping their religion for fear of persecution in the current climate of rampant anti Muslim racism.

            Comment


              #7
              #ExMuslimBecause

              Maybe it's an eye of the beholder thing, but am I wrong to read it as a fairly empowered act by people who in many societies would be in fear of persecution as a result of making this decision?

              If it's OK for people to be indoctrinated into their family religions, I think we should be allowed to be less suspicious of people want wanting to make their own decision and opt out.

              Comment


                #8
                #ExMuslimBecause

                ad hoc wrote: Yes, I agree with them. Plus I'm also worried if this is being used by people who are dropping their religion for fear of persecution in the current climate of rampant anti Muslim racism.
                Is there evidence that Muslims are giving up their religion en mass because of [strike]"rampant Muslim racism"[/strike] "rampant anti Muslim racism".

                Comment


                  #9
                  #ExMuslimBecause

                  Why the scare quotes?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    #ExMuslimBecause

                    Just going to leave this here.

                    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/paris-attacks-british-muslims-face-300-spike-in-racial-attacks-in-week-following-terror-a6744376.html

                    Comment


                      #11
                      #ExMuslimBecause

                      Luke R wrote:
                      Originally posted by ad hoc
                      Yes, I agree with them. Plus I'm also worried if this is being used by people who are dropping their religion for fear of persecution in the current climate of rampant anti Muslim racism.
                      Is there evidence that Muslims are giving up their religion en mass because of "rampant Muslim racism".
                      Not that I'm aware of. But the virulent racism is obviously present and in the mainstream discourse, so it wouldn't be a surprise if people were feeling coerced into hiding their identity and in some cases actually shedding it.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        #ExMuslimBecause

                        TonTon wrote: Why the scare quotes?
                        When do quotes become "scare quotes?"

                        Comment


                          #13
                          #ExMuslimBecause

                          Why the quotes?

                          Comment


                            #14
                            #ExMuslimBecause

                            To indicate I was using someone else's words.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              #ExMuslimBecause

                              'cept you actually misquoted me.

                              Comment


                                #16
                                #ExMuslimBecause

                                ad hoc wrote: 'cept you actually misquoted me.
                                I did. I'll go back and re-edit.

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  #ExMuslimBecause

                                  As long as it's not meant to be some kind of indication that you don't appreciate that there is rampant anti-Muslim racism, then.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    #ExMuslimBecause

                                    Anyway, all of this just seems like a new insidious way to attack practising Muslims. It's a load of shite. Rule of thumb: If Dawkins is involved, it'll be bollocks.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      #ExMuslimBecause

                                      Jesus is Ganja?

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        #ExMuslimBecause

                                        Yes

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          #ExMuslimBecause

                                          ad hoc wrote: Yes, I agree with them. Plus I'm also worried if this is being used by people who are dropping their religion for fear of persecution in the current climate of rampant anti Muslim racism.
                                          Turn this round 180 degrees. You should be even more worried about people who want to but don't drop their religion for fear of persecution as an apostate.

                                          Comment


                                            #22
                                            #ExMuslimBecause

                                            In Europe (which is where I live) I think the concern about anti-Muslim racism is far more the clear and present danger.

                                            Obviously what you say is true for people unlucky enough to be living in an area controlled by the Islamist lunatic fringe of Daesh or similar.

                                            Comment


                                              #23
                                              #ExMuslimBecause

                                              Or Bradford

                                              Comment


                                                #24
                                                #ExMuslimBecause

                                                dalliance wrote:
                                                Turn this round 180 degrees. You should be even more worried about people who want to but don't drop their religion for fear of persecution as an apostate.
                                                The #ExMuslimBecause thing is basically a bunch of white-racists exploiting other peoples' oppressions within Muslim communities.

                                                An increase in anti-Muslim bigotry harms ex-Muslims nearly as much as it does practising Muslims.

                                                The lot of marginalised groups within Muslim communities isn't helped by insisting Islam is barbaric and intolerant. Like, it denies the agency of feminist Muslims and LGBT Muslims (by e.g. implying that you can't be Muslim and gay) - in exactly the same way that conservative interpretations of the religion do. And also given victims of Islamophobia are disproportionately women, it puts the people you're supposedly advocating for at greater risk of harm.

                                                The solution isn't the 'Decent Left' position of "liberals must not be afraid to tell the truth about Islam" but actually a recognition of the intersecting nature of oppressions.

                                                And the solutions become less about grandiose things like "condemning Islam" or whatever but low-level stuff like supporting gay asylum seekers facing deportation; promoting support networks and refuges for people escaping violence; etc, etc, etc.

                                                Comment


                                                  #25
                                                  #ExMuslimBecause

                                                  Bizarre Löw Triangle wrote:
                                                  The #ExMuslimBecause thing is basically a bunch of white-racists exploiting other peoples' oppressions within Muslim communities.
                                                  This didn't take long.

                                                  I'm sure there are white-racists making use of this and pointing at it as some sort of evidence in their deranged agenda, but please, "basically a bunch of"?
                                                  That's mental.

                                                  You're saying racists have convinced muslims to drop their religion and go online with it, to prove that the racist are right?
                                                  Or you're saying that the accounts are fake, created by racists?

                                                  Comment

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