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    Next Labour Leader?

    Benjm wrote:
    Originally posted by Tubby Isaacs
    Like this using questions from the public thing.

    Harder for Cameron to be respond in his usual obnoxious way.
    "Fuck you, Gail. Do the country a favour and die, Marie."

    I think there's mileage in this new fangled mature approach, not just the public sourced questions. Cameron won't be able to resist being shitty for long. It will require Corbyn and the rest of his MPs to lie on the ropes though and let the Tories take some free swings while looking increasingly horrible.
    "No matter how much he hits you you don't do nothin', okay? You don't wanna get drawn into a boxin' match here."

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      Next Labour Leader?

      Central bank "independence" is an awful thing.

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        Next Labour Leader?

        Why?

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          Next Labour Leader?

          It reinforces the notion that the economic is a separate sphere from the political, that 'top men' can be left to do this stuff, and that the creation of the framework in which macroeconomic policy is made (the interest rate, the money supply etc) is a purely technocratic matter. Ask a Greek about that one.

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            Next Labour Leader?

            That. In addition, it's mostly a sham, and I think is widely seen as such.

            Can't imagine that ending central bank independence would be either catnip or poison, electorally. Winding the clock back to the trotskyite militancy of, er, John Major's government.

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              Next Labour Leader?

              Greenspan's Fed may have operated independently of the US administration, but it was certainly not ideologically neutral.

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                Next Labour Leader?

                Is there any direct benefit to having interest rate and quantitative easing decisions directly in the hands of George Osborne rather than one step removed?

                I mean, it may not make much difference - it might be a sham - but is there any actual benefit to revoking independence?

                As an aside: reinforces the notion that the economic is a separate sphere from the political seems to suggest that "fiscal" and "economic" policy are identical. Which is surely falling well into the Thatcherite/Greenspan trap that basically the entire economy can be controlled by, and all that matters in an economy is, interest rates.

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                  Next Labour Leader?

                  Simon Wren-Lewis defends technocrats here, and comes at the issue of Bank independence from the other side-

                  http://mainlymacro.blogspot.co.uk/2015/09/labour-and-central-bank-independence.html

                  In essence all the Bank of England normally does is decide how to change interest rates to hit a target decided by government. Whether it is an inflation target or some other target(s) is for the government to decide. There are plenty of macroeconomists who would favour a higher inflation target, or targeting a different measure, so there is a great deal of scope for change here. But once that target has been chosen, why are politicians better at trying to hit it than a bunch of technocrats some of whom have spent their lives studying this one task?
                  I don't understand exactly how the British system is different to the Eurozone system, but he seems pretty definite that it is.

                  This, lest we forget, is what politicians used to do...

                  Thu, 06 Aug 1987 9.8750
                  Fri, 08 May 1987 8.8750
                  Tue, 28 Apr 1987 9.3750
                  General Election was on 11 June 1987.

                  Putting them at one remove seems to make sense to me, and probably helps keep borrowing costs down (as Ursus suggested).

                  I've always found the idea that "technocrats" are bad a bit odd. Were eg the two Sir Bob Reids (the last 2 chairs of British Rail had the same name) "technocrats"? Would performance of late BR (pretty much agreed to have been very efficient) have been improved with some Thatcherite minister taking a bigger interest?

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                    Next Labour Leader?

                    NHH wrote: Nuclear power's an outlier; not sure it fits into frames of reference very easily. That said, if you're intensely relaxed about private ownership of energy systems, the channelling of enormous sums of money to nuclear generation fits very neatly with neoliberalism (that those private concerns are often other countries state-owned concerns notwithstanding).
                    It just came to mind because you talked about not caring about climate change and the Blairite neoliberals. It might be an outlier. I can't think of much else.

                    When the companies are state-owned, by close allies, I think it does make a difference. Neo-liberal isn't quite the right word, I don't think. There's (some) shared interest in more than just the best price.

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                      Next Labour Leader?

                      E10 Rifle wrote: Though it makes him look more charming than he is. He's got to mix it up a bit, chuck in a few short-pitched deliveries, with the light fading.

                      (I've got a current policy of retweeting all positive, pro-party, on-message tweets from Labour rightwingers. That's a better way of isolating the Tristram Hunts and the "anonymous MP told tedious hack of whispers" types.)
                      A woman reading out questions from ordinary people to Cameron would be like Big Curtly bowling a beamer from twenty yards.

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                        Next Labour Leader?

                        Heck.

                        Curtly bowled 3 beamers in quick succession at Dermot Reeve after having a caught behind turned down. But seems like they were off the full 22 yards.

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                          Next Labour Leader?

                          I'm sure Reeve asked for it.

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                            Next Labour Leader?

                            I never tested Jack Davenport with a beamer, now I think about it.

                            Would have done it. Nice bloke. And a good namedrop in All Bar One in 1997. (when you're work colleagues made you go there).

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                              Next Labour Leader?

                              He was All Bar One royalty.

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                                Next Labour Leader?

                                And pretty handy in the Pitcher and Piano too.

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                                  Next Labour Leader?

                                  What a life you must have led, back then.

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                                    Next Labour Leader?

                                    I would have done if I'd stuck All Bar One longer than about 20 minutes.

                                    One for TonTon and his Campaign for Real Stations- the rebuilt Birmingham New Street will have an All Bar One.

                                    I hope Network Rail get a decent share of their "upmarket" beer prices.

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                                      Next Labour Leader?

                                      They can all learn from the Leeds-Manchester line - a real ale pub on every station platform.

                                      Somehow I feel we're straying away from The Struggle here, and are retreating into our cricket/ale/crap-90s-chat-up attempts comfort zone. This won't play well in Nuneaton.

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                                        Next Labour Leader?

                                        Come over to the new thread.

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                                          Next Labour Leader?

                                          E10 Rifle wrote: They can all learn from the Leeds-Manchester line - a real ale pub on every station platform.

                                          Somehow I feel we're straying away from The Struggle here, and are retreating into our cricket/ale/crap-90s-chat-up attempts comfort zone. This won't play well in Nuneaton.
                                          Shame because you're seeing em like footballs...

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                                            Next Labour Leader?

                                            It's ok...I..I...It's just that I've got something in my eye...sniff, sniff....BOOOHHOOOBOOOHOOOO...uncontrollable sobbing...how can I, how can we all go on now?

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                                              Next Labour Leader?

                                              Come on, Geoff, even I've moved to the new thread.

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                                                Next Labour Leader?

                                                Lucy Waterman wrote: Come over to the new thread.
                                                Splitter

                                                If you are a man, you are condemned in language not heard since the fall of Marxist Leninism
                                                There have been a few laughs today, but surely this is the best.

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                                                  Next Labour Leader?

                                                  'And language you wouldn't hear from a docker'

                                                  'Ah, you would now, Ted. They use terrible language.
                                                  '

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