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    Watford

    So, not wanting to jinx them or anything, but it looks from their win today over Brighton as if Watford are going up. They just need to win their last match.

    If they do go up, then next season will be their third season in the Premiership (alternatively, for those like me who detest the implication that football became more important in 1992, it'll be their 3rd season in the top flight in the last 27 or so years).

    Their first season back up, they finished bottom, on 24 points.

    Their second season back up, they again finished bottom, but this time on 28 points.

    What odds on them staying heroically on that upward trend, and making it to 32 points next season?

    #2
    Watford

    It rather depends how much 'help' they are given from the other clubs under the same umbrella, doesn't it? If they are suddenly given the pick of the best players in the Udinese squad, as opposed to the spare parts, then they will be fighting a much more winnable battle. And with Udinese no longer pushing towards the CL, they well might become the prime club of that group. A run-of-the-mill Premier League side is so much more profitable than a run-of-the-mill Serie A or Primera Liga one.

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      #3
      Watford

      Wheels slowly turning...
      They could be promoted in just two hours time, couldn't they? All it takes is two of the following three; Bournemouth to lose, Boro to lose and Norwich to draw or lose.

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        #4
        Watford

        In their mid-80s visit to the top flight, they finished second (albeit in a season when Liverpool won the title with eight games to spare). Then they got to that Cup Final where Elton John cried before, during and after the match.

        Disappointingly, though, it turns out Tim Lovejoy was a childhood Watford fan, before Chelsea started winning things in the 90s.

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          #5
          Watford

          Janik wrote: Wheels slowly turning...
          They could be promoted in just two hours time, couldn't they? All it takes is two of the following three; Bournemouth to lose, Boro to lose and Norwich to draw or lose.
          Turn out Bournemouth are not playing until Monday. Details, details...

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            #6
            Watford

            Welcome back Watford

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              #7
              Watford

              ursus arctos wrote: Welcome [strike]back Watford[/strike] to the yellow English arm of a particular pan-national Franchise.
              Corrected it for you.

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                #8
                Watford

                Well, as the enterprise's Spanish branch is likely to make the opposite journey later this spring, there's a certain balance to that.

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                  #9
                  Watford

                  In their mid-80s visit to the top flight, they finished second (albeit in a season when Liverpool won the title with eight games to spare).
                  Watford had a really good side back then, and did briefly top the table around the October/November of that season. My late father - a lifelong supporter - happily admitted that he never thought he'd see the day. Shame they couldn't've gone on to win it for him.

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                    #10
                    Watford

                    Hmm, that gets me wondering. Who are the highest positioned current club and/or the historically most successful one (may be the same answer) to have never lead the top flight? Lets impose an arbitrary bar of at least five games into a season. And the lowest? IIRC, Northampton Town did, didn't they?

                    My guess is Hull might be the answer to both 'highest' questions. And presumably someone defunct for the lowest.

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                      #11
                      Watford

                      Wasn't the Cobblers' time at the top very early in the season? They ended up next to last.

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                        #12
                        Watford

                        It may be Portsmouth, they're six places below Northampton and have been league champions.

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                          #13
                          Watford

                          Grimsby Town would, I suspect, beat Portsmouth as lowest current club.

                          I've made my own feelings clear on Watford (i.e. roughly what Janik has said) which is why I no longer 'support' them. I'm glad for those of my friends who still do, as it's been a good day for them.

                          Hope Bournemouth make it up though.

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                            #14
                            Watford

                            Have Southampton ever led the top-flight? They ran Liverpool close one year (1984) but don't know if they were ever top.

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                              #15
                              Watford

                              Southampton topped the league early in 1982 in the Keegan era. Have Palace ever been top?

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                                #16
                                Watford

                                Palace topped the league briefly in the Autumn of 1979, team of the 1980s and all that.

                                My money is on Stoke, currently 9th. I can't remember them being near the top in recent years, and it seems that in the very few seasons where they were challenging for the title, it did not involve any time at the top.

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                                  #17
                                  Watford

                                  Palace topped the table "briefly"?

                                  For a week...

                                  September 1979

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                                    #18
                                    Watford

                                    And it's not Stoke:

                                    http://www.statto.com/football/stats/england/division-one-old/1905-1906/table/1905-10-07

                                    I looked through Grimsby's 1930s golden period and couldn't see them ever top of a table, they peaked on Hallowe'en 1936 when a 6-4 win saw them leapfrog Brentford into second place but trailing 3 points behind, ironically, Portsmouth who must be the answer to the other part of the question if the 5 game cut-off discounts Carlisle.

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                                      #19
                                      Watford

                                      Could it be Carlisle?

                                      Or Luton?

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                                        #20
                                        Watford

                                        Carlisle topped the table briefly in September 1974 - ending the season in last place.

                                        (Luton seems a good shout...)

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                                          #21
                                          Watford

                                          Now, I could have sworn, as something of a Stoke supporter, that they were top at one stage of the that same season as Carlisle. Maybe it's just because they put themselves in a position where they could have been champions, if they had scored some goals in their last three matches...

                                          As for Luton, they don't seem a nominee for either category. If they have been top, then Portsmouth are currently lower than them. If they haven't, then all sorts of teams are higher up the list.

                                          I'm still thinking Hull. They have never got closer than this, have they?

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                                            #22
                                            Watford

                                            I'm pretty certain that Brighton have never topped the table.

                                            Someone would have written a book about it if we had for a week, or a few hours even.

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                                              #23
                                              Watford

                                              Pretty certain Janik's right about Stoke being top toward the end of season 1974-75. That run-in forty seasons ago was the tightest I can remember (though, obviously, I was concentrating more on the basement battle) - and the lead changed hands several times with just a matter of games left.

                                              IIRC, Ipswich, Liverpool, Everton, Stoke and (eventual winners) Derby all headed the table toward the climax. The latter's total of 53pts (74, in today's money) was also the lowest I can recall in my lifetime.

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                                                #24
                                                Watford

                                                Have Birmingham City ever been top of the league?

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                                                  #25
                                                  Watford

                                                  Stoke were top in November 1974, according to statto.com. And then never more than 3 or four points off the top until the very end. Ipswich, Everton, Liverpool, Ipswich and Everton (again) all juggled the lead until Derby finally went top in April with 3 games to go and went on to win it. And yes, Carlisle started the season with 3 straight wins and were top.

                                                  It sounds like the most amazing season ever.

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