Neil Young, a scared twit

[Come along, Min]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Put me down as a Neil Young supporter who has little issue with what he's done.

I was wondering how much demand there is for a performance from him in Palestinian quarters?

[Amor de Cosmos]

Neil Young, a scared twit

G-Man wrote: I didn't quite realise that Whiny Neil had such fervent fans 'round here.

It shouldn't be surprising. His music has been relevant to members of two or three generations.

As for his politics, well, he’s of the common garden “hippie libertarian” variety,

That.

He's also inclined to verbal combativeness when questioned — unlike Dylan who either deflects questions, or lies. NY often writes spontaneously too — Ohio, Let's Roll — channeling the anger of the moment extremely well. For sure it occasionally raises inconsistencies, which he acknowledges. His vintage car collection and anti-oil sands drilling stand in Alberta is a prime example. But overall, his anti-corporate/pro-environment beliefs are long-standing and backed up by action.

[Jah Womble]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Put me down as a Neil Young supporter who has little issue with what he's done.

Ditto. He was one of the most important artists of his generation - and in the intervening decades has continued to come up with decent stuff once in a while.

As for being some kind of 'self-appointed spokesman', well I must've missed that memo. Young has for some good while conducted his career on a take-it-or-leave-it basis - and consequently owes no explanation (or whatever) to anybody on this issue.

[G-Man]

Neil Young, a scared twit

OK, not a social issues guy and an important musician with a voice some people like.

He's still an asshole for wanting to play in Tel Aviv, and for issuing press statements that basically blames the threat of Hamas for cancelling the gig.

I don't now of those who say they have "no problem with what e has done" mean they don;t object to his music, or do they support artists playing concerts in Israel?

[Fussbudget]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Weird, the way this thread has gone.

Whether Neil Young's music is any good or not is irrelevant, as is whether he is a "self-appointed spokesman".

He is happy to play gigs in Israel, and can therefore fuck off. That also applies to Justin Timberlake, Rihanna and anyone else famous or not who sees fit to do business with Israel in its current state.

[wingco]

Neil Young, a scared twit

I like big patches of Neil Young's career but if he admired Reagan for the reasons he states he admires him for, he's an absolute dupe. All that stuff about people learning about self-help, setting up their own day centres, etc, is a precursor of the Big Society - sounds folksy and community-based and altruistic on the surface but is simply a cynical way of getting people used to the idea that public services aren't going to provide that stuff any more, still less after we're letting the rich get away with not paying their taxes, which is the real reason we're in power.

[Evariste Euler Gauss]

Neil Young, a scared twit

What Fussbudget said. All artists currently travelling to give concerts in Israel can fuck off.

But Bob Dylan is several shades worse than any others. That guy is the worst case study in how having great musical talent plus having been in the right place at the right time can blind almost everyone to what utter fucking incoherent and frequently obnoxious gibberish you spout. I mean, it's not even as if he keeps the shit to his interviews and sticks to decent stuff in his song lyrics. Ever since his "Slow Train Coming" album of born again right wing religious shite in 1980 or thereabouts (e.g. a rant about "foreign oil ruling American soil") it's been obvious he is, in political terms, a total fucking moron following whatever idiotic ideas have currently grabbed his inconstant fancy.

[Calvert]

Neil Young, a scared twit

You'd imagine Young lived through the Civil Rights and anti-Vietnam war protest movements and fully supported both as they were at the core of 1960's American* counter-culture, so it makes it even more baffling as to why he'd even want to perform in a country whose government has actively pursued a policy of murder and naked oppression against a pretty much defenceless people.
I mean, here's the guy who can rage about product fucking placement in music but can't see how him playing Israel is giving tacit support to the regime? He's either very fucking arrogant or very foolish.

Remember not wanting to play Sun City?
What's the difference? Palestinian groups are telling people not to do it. Can it be any easier? Even though Young may think he's going there on some wrong-headed notion of uniting the Palestinian and Israeli kids through, like, music, man, the people on the ground are fucking shouting DON'T DO IT!!.
I dunno, I'd take their advice over my bank manager's or some dippy notion of uniting the kids.

No problem with what he's doing, FFS.

[Calvert]

Neil Young, a scared twit

*i'maware he's Canadian.

[Vulgarian Visigoth]

Neil Young, a scared twit

G-Man wrote: I didn't quite realise that Whiny Neil had such fervent fans 'round here.

Are you throwing a hissy fit because we like a singer you don't like? Go take your football back home or invade a neighbouring country.

Any person over 18 who expects political nous from a pop singer sould have his head checked.

[G-Man]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Yes, that's what a hissy fit looks like. Moron.

And I don't buy that argument that musicians should not be held accountable for their politics, especially if they have made political statements.

I agree that one is foolish to take one's political guidance from pop singers, and yet many people also rely on pop singers to articulate their political views, or to mobilise opinion.

Many pop singers (using the term broadly) were broadly consistent in their politics. Woody Guthrie, Curtis Mayfield, Billy Bragg, Gil Scott-Heron, Pete Seeger, Johnny Cash...

[MsD]

Neil Young, a scared twit

His official reasons for cancelling may not be the real reasons.  Independent Jewish Voices Canada have thanked him for cancelling and note that many other acts have cancelled in the past, and recently, giving vague reasons or no reason at all.

Alicia Keys played last week "to promote peace". (correction: er, last year).

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/09/alicia-keys-israel-peace_n_3569129.html

If we support a cultural boycott, then we really should be boycotting products too. List here:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/List-of-Israeli-Products-to-Boycott/343892822376809

[Borracho]

Neil Young, a scared twit

I'm open to correction, but that list of Israeli products to boycott seems to be conflating Israeli-made products with Jewish-made products. Unless the people behind those companies are all massive donors to the state of Israel on the quiet, which I suppose is possible.

[MsD]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Yeh, I'd check it, but that was the most up-to-date list I could find.

I'm wrong about Alicia Keys, btw, that was last year. Wondered why she wasn't mentioned here.

[Janik]

Neil Young, a scared twit

G-Man wrote: Many pop singers (using the term broadly) were broadly consistent in their politics. Woody Guthrie, Curtis Mayfield, Billy Bragg, Gil Scott-Heron, Pete Seeger, Johnny Cash...

And some right-wingers as well. Alice Cooper, Johnny Ramone, Phil Collins, Ted Nugent, countless Country artists...

[Pietro Paolo Virdis]

Neil Young, a scared twit

I'm with G-Man on the voice thing, and the booking in Israel to begin with.

I'm curious how Young was important as mentioned upthread. Probably because I find it hard to see any musician as important unless they invented a cure for Alzheimer or were part in liberating some country, but then it's not as musicians they were primarily important.

[Borracho]

Neil Young, a scared twit

We used to hear a lot of stuff in the mid-to-late 1990s about how the Manic Street Preachers were "the most important band in the world". I could genuinely never work that one out.

[Cesar Rodriguez]

Neil Young, a scared twit

G-Man wrote:

This whole thread is flawed.

The concert was not cancelled because Neil Young is a coward it was cancelled due to police advice.

Why single Neil Young out for criticism when plenty of other artists have played in Israel in the last few months? Why not take issue with Rihanna and Justin Timberlake?

It seems to be a Neil Young bashing thread more than anything else.

The thread was prompted by a press release which I received, and with whose content I had problems with.

There is a difference between Rihanna and her corporate pop cohorts playing Tel Aviv, and a man who has promoted ideas of social justice doing so. The latter must be held to a higher set of expectations than those who don't occupy ethical positions.

If it's Neil-Young-bashing, then it is so because Neil Young deserves to be bashed for booking a gig in Israel. Even by people who like his music.

Fair enough, the thread just read like an opportunity to take a shot at NY, what with the "whiny wanker/shit music" jibes which seem kind of irrelevant to the actual point you are making.

Anyway, re. other artists to have played there, Paul McCartney played a concert in Tel Aviv to celebrate the 60th anniversary of Israel in 2008. If anyone deserves to be shit on for playing Israel its him, 60th anniversary concert, I ask you!

[Cesar Rodriguez]

Neil Young, a scared twit

[Calvert]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Selected Ambient Works 85-92 wrote: We used to hear a lot of stuff in the mid-to-late 1990s about how the Manic Street Preachers were "the most important band in the world". I could genuinely never work that one out.

You left out the crucial self in that quote.

They were a tiresomely dull bunch, weren't they?
I was bewildered too as to why people rated them

[Reginald Lorenzo]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Now *this* thread is more like the response I envisaged when I mentioned Rush.

[Lucia Lanigan]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Selected Ambient Works 85-92 wrote: We used to hear a lot of stuff in the mid-to-late 1990s about how the Manic Street Preachers were "the most important band in the world". I could genuinely never work that one out.

We heard a lot of that from the band themselves in the early 1990s, but I don't remember hearing much of it from other people thereafter. Mind you, someone probably thought Mansun were the most important band in the world for a week in 1996 or something; there was so much money slopping around in the music business that everyone involved went mental (and music itself went wrong).

[EIM]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Twit. Nicely understated word. "You scared twit". Wonderful.

[Toro Toro]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Evariste Euler Gauss wrote:
Ever since his "Slow Train Coming" album of born again right wing religious shite in 1980 or thereabouts (e.g. a rant about "foreign oil ruling American soil") it's been obvious he is, in political terms, a total fucking moron following whatever idiotic ideas have currently grabbed his inconstant fancy.

Bob Dylan wrote:
There's an evenin' haze settlin' over town
Starlight by the edge of the creek
The buyin' power of the proletariat's gone down
Money's gettin' shallow and weak

Well, the place I love best is a sweet memory
It's a new path that we trod
They say low wages are a reality
If we want to compete abroad

My cruel weapons have been put on the shelf
Come sit down on my knee
You are dearer to me than myself
As you yourself can see

While I'm listening to the steel rails hum
Got both eyes tight shut
Just sitting here trying to keep the hunger from
Creeping it's way into my gut

Meet me at the bottom, don't lag behind
Bring me my boots and shoes
You can hang back or fight your best on the front line
Sing a little bit of these workingman's blues

Well, I'm sailin' on back, ready for the long haul
Tossed by the winds and the seas
I'll drag 'em all down to hell and I'll stand 'em at the wall
I'll sell 'em to their enemies

I'm tryin' to feed my soul with thought
Gonna sleep off the rest of the day
Sometimes no one wants what we got
Sometimes you can't give it away

Now the place is ringed with countless foes
Some of them may be deaf and dumb
No man, no woman knows
The hour that sorrow will come

In the dark I hear the night birds call
I can feel a lover's breath
I sleep in the kitchen with my feet in the hall
Sleep is like a temporary death

Meet me at the bottom, don't lag behind
Bring me my boots and shoes
You can hang back or fight your best on the front line
Sing a little bit of these workingman's blues

Well, they burned my barn and they stole my horse
I can't save a dime
I got to be careful, I don't want to be forced
Into a life of continual crime

I can see for myself that the sun is sinking
How I wish you were here to see
Tell me now, am I wrong in thinking
That you have forgotten me?

Now they worry and they hurry and they fuss and they fret
They waste your nights and days
Them I will forget
But you I'll remember always

Old memories of you to me have clung
You've wounded me with your words
Gonna have to straighten out your tongue
It's all true, everything you've heard

Meet me at the bottom, don't lag behind
Bring me my boots and shoes
You can hang back or fight your best on the front line
Sing a little bit of these workingman's blues

In you, my friend, I find no blame
Wanna look in my eyes, please do
No one can ever claim
That I took up arms against you

All across the peaceful sacred fields
They will lay you low
They'll break your horns and slash you with steel
I say it so it must be so

Now I'm down on my luck and I'm black and blue
Gonna give you another chance
I'm all alone and I'm expecting you
To lead me off in a cheerful dance

I got a brand new suit and a brand new wife
I can live on rice and beans
Some people never worked a day in their life
Don't know what work even means

Meet me at the bottom, don't lag behind
Bring me my boots and shoes
You can hang back or fight your best on the front line
Sing a little bit of these workingman's blues

People never reveal the depth of their ignorance of what they're talking about quite so vividly as when they are at their most sweeping.

[Borracho]

Neil Young, a scared twit

Lucia Lanigan wrote:

We used to hear a lot of stuff in the mid-to-late 1990s about how the Manic Street Preachers were "the most important band in the world". I could genuinely never work that one out.

We heard a lot of that from the band themselves in the early 1990s, but I don't remember hearing much of it from other people thereafter. Mind you, someone probably thought Mansun were the most important band in the world for a week in 1996 or something; there was so much money slopping around in the music business that everyone involved went mental (and music itself went wrong).

The period I'm thinking of is not their glam rock years, but after Everything Must Go and prior to If You Tolerate This Your Children Will Be Next. I knew a fair number of rock hacks at the time and heard a lot of them trotting out this one back then.