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  1. #51

    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Fussbudget wrote: The Esk Valley line (Boro to Whitby) is one, you'd need to change at Middlesbrough then Darlo or York.
    That was one of my original answers, but there are through trains to both Bishop Auckland and Newcastle

  2. #52
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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Big Boobs and FIRE! wrote: In terms of subsidising Open Access services to rural areas being a social necessity, this isn't really the case.

    The lines that the OA operators operate on already have services. These run to the major conurbations, which is where the most needy would be heading.

    Direct services to London are a luxury and are used by the wealthy or socially mobile, and it is those that are being subsidised.
    Yes that is fair enough. I was conflating the OA issue with the fact that busier portions of lines will always subsidise quieter ones, e.g. I'm sure First TPE would be more than happy to only retain the Manchester/Liverpool to York (possibly Newcastle) portion of the North TransPennine line and do away with the rest of it if they were given the choice, but I guess that is required of them in the terms of the franchise so that is actually an example of where the system is 'working' I guess.

    (Although beyond providing a direct connection to London, the OA operators also connect non-London urban centres together which makes them commutable (e.g. Sunderland/Hartlepool to York), though I appreciate that's completely inadvertent on their part, won't be of interest to that many people, and would be a lot more useful with more frequent services.)

  3. #53
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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Big Boobs and FIRE! wrote:
    Quote Originally Posted by Fussbudget
    The Esk Valley line (Boro to Whitby) is one, you'd need to change at Middlesbrough then Darlo or York.
    That was one of my original answers, but there are through trains to both Bishop Auckland and Newcastle
    Wow, I never knew about those! It would appear there is only one direct service a week to each destination, but fair enough.

  4. #54

    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    TPE is basically the money making bits of the Northern Franchise, so, with the exception of Barrow, there aren't too may complete basket cases in their portfolio. Interestingly, in 18 months time, the Newcastle services get extended to Edinburgh and Glasgow, and a new Edinburgh/Glasgow to Liverpool service is introduced.

    But what TPE brings in, subsidises the Northen franchise, which as you say, is exactly how it should be.

    The non London parts of the route that OA operators open up, in my mind, are never fully realised enough.

  5. #55
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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    That line in west Wales that goes up to Portmadog (from Shrewsbury? Or possibly just Aberystwyth)

  6. #56

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    I don't think there are any direct trains to London from Liverpool South Parkway, so that would make the Northern Line of Merseyrail one of the answers.

  7. #57
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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Barton on Humber?

  8. #58

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Big Boobs and FIRE! wrote: A quiz question related to the Open Access operators.

    There are only three railway lines (National Rail) in Great Britain, from which more than one change of train is required to get to London. Which are they?
    Stourbridge?

    (Unless there are direct services from Stourbridge Junction?)

  9. #59

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Isle of Wight line
    Stranraer

  10. #60
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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Stranraer can be done in one change at Glasgow?

  11. #61

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Paul S wrote: Isle of Wight line
    Stranraer
    If you're doing IOW, then Vale of Rheidol counts as well, as an ex-BR line.

  12. #62

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Guy Profumo wrote:
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S
    Isle of Wight line
    Stranraer
    If you're doing IOW, then Vale of Rheidol counts as well, as an ex-BR line.
    The Vale of Rheidol is a private steam railway, whereas the Isle of Wight line is still part of the national network.

  13. #63

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Paul S wrote:
    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Profumo
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S
    Isle of Wight line
    Stranraer
    If you're doing IOW, then Vale of Rheidol counts as well, as an ex-BR line.
    The Vale of Rheidol is a private steam railway, whereas the Isle of Wight line is still part of the national network.
    But it is EX-BR. Which is why I clutched at that straw.

  14. #64

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Have we got any answers to this yet?

    The fact our (i.e. my) ignorance is being exposed is starting to irritate.

  15. #65

    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Sorry for being tardy with the answers. What started as an easy shift with one eye on the cricket, all changed with having to manage a train crash. Anyway, an update on the answers.

    Firstly the incorrect ones
    - Portmadog – The Cambrian Coast services run through from Birmingham International.
    - Stourbridge – Chiltern run a direct service to London from Stourbridge Junction.
    - Stranraer – These run through to Glasgow or Carlisle/Newcastle.

    So the correct ones were
    - Barton on Humber - Yes, change at Grimsby and Doncaster/Lincoln
    - Merseyrail Northern Line (Southport – Hunts Cross)
    - The Island line is also correct.

    However, I’d mis-quoted the original question which had the word ‘mainland’ in it. So if you include the Isle of Wight, there are actually four.

    So one more to get.

  16. #66
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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Is it one of the Ardrossan lines?

  17. #67

    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    No, they both go to Glasgow Central.

  18. #68

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Cardiff Bay

  19. #69
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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Oban? Unless there's a direct Queen Street to London service.

  20. #70
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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Stranraer ruled out by the Glasgow connection anyway, but has the direct train to Carlisle/Newcastle not been discontinued?

    It was always dubbed the 'boat train' because ultimately it connected with the ferry (when it still went from Stranraer obviously), but that made for an epic journey from Newcastle to Belfast for those who attempted it (and plenty of students seemed to, on the late Friday afternoon service).

  21. #71

    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    The Fort William sleeper stops at various stations on the West Highland line which connect with Oban.

    So yes, the final answer is Cardiff Bay.

  22. #72

    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Paul S wrote:
    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Profumo
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S
    Isle of Wight line
    Stranraer
    If you're doing IOW, then Vale of Rheidol counts as well, as an ex-BR line.
    The Vale of Rheidol is a private steam railway, whereas the Isle of Wight line is still part of the national network.
    Albeit with an uncertain future.

    I know it's easy to "crayon" in fantasy services, and I've never even been to the Isle of Wight, but could light rail work there? It's more densely populated than one might think, even without holiday makers.

  23. #73

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Tubby Isaacs wrote:
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S
    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Profumo
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul S
    Isle of Wight line
    Stranraer
    If you're doing IOW, then Vale of Rheidol counts as well, as an ex-BR line.
    The Vale of Rheidol is a private steam railway, whereas the Isle of Wight line is still part of the national network.
    Albeit with an uncertain future.

    I know it's easy to "crayon" in fantasy services, and I've never even been to the Isle of Wight, but could light rail work there? It's more densely populated than one might think, even without holiday makers.
    Isn't it anyway, given it uses ex-LT Underground rolling stock due to the low tunnel south of Ryde?

    And isn't this one of the "uncertain futures" pencilled in for it?

  24. #74

    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Is ex-LU stuff light rail? Think it needs replacing soon, and it's uncertain what'll replace it.

    I think of lightrail as having more stops than the line has at the moment- though I suppose 7 stops in 8.5 miles is quite a lot.

    My rule of thumb with places that need investment is "shouldn't keep electing Tories then", but this might be a bit unfair in this case.

  25. #75

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    Broken & Late Ltd: Britain's Railways

    Yes they are thinking of light rail for the Isle of Wight line, or even ultra light rail might be an option. The whole line needs relaying, there are problems with the height in the tunnel at Ryde - as Tubby quite rightly pointed out - and it uses the oldest trains in Britain. It also requires about a million pounds a year in subsidy. But the road congestion on the Isle of Wight is pretty bad and the railway is still needed.

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