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    Originally posted by Janik View Post
    That sort of thing is worth sorting ahead of the start. Race organisers can get a bit lairy if you don't.
    I'm never going to trouble the podium, so won't face that particular problem but I'd rather keep everything right. This particular namesake was 9 years older, and in the end he didn't take part, and I did go back and get the correct number so all was fine. There is another namesake more local to me that I know about, who is a few years younger and a lot better than me - and in a local 10K they mixed us up in the results and I was credited with a much better time than I'd achieved, and vice versa - so I contacted the organisers and got it corrected. My name isn't even particularly commonplace by the way.

    I wasn't around for the prize giving on Sunday, as I was still plodding round at that point, but I believe there was some chaos involved in giving out prizes for either the women's marathon or half (they run parallel) - it turned out that the first two female finishers were in fact men running with 'borrowed' numbers, who like the guy in the Cambridge story had to own up straight away.

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      Read something the other day about a women who finished second in the recent Boston marathon despite not being a professional runner, she's from Arizona or somewhere, runs 5 km after work some days, came up to Boston with her boyfriend went biking in Maine before the race and then competed. Started overtaking runners after a while, but had literally no idea that she was second (and when they told her at the end, she assumed she was second in some category or division, not actually second)

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        Originally posted by ad hoc View Post
        Read something the other day about a women who finished second in the recent Boston marathon despite not being a professional runner, she's from Arizona or somewhere, runs 5 km after work some days, came up to Boston with her boyfriend went biking in Maine before the race and then competed. Started overtaking runners after a while, but had literally no idea that she was second (and when they told her at the end, she assumed she was second in some category or division, not actually second)
        It was a remarkable achievement but there is a bit more to it than that - it was only her second marathon but she won her first (in Utah, where she's from) to qualify for Boston. She was doing more than just 5k's in training, but it's true she was doing all her training around a full time job - before her early shifts as a nurse apparently.

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          More on the Blackpool story.

          The results of the women’s marathon were thrown into disarray when two of the first three were revealed to be male athletes, using the numbers of female friends/partners. More than a dozen were disqualified and the prize presentation was scrapped.

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            The morale is that marathon organisers need to make entries transferable if someone gets injured or ill and needs to drop out late. Clearly this happens often enough, with people not willing to see their entry fee disappear down a black hole due to bad luck.

            The Boston marathon story is very reminiscent of Tracey Morris, full-time Optician and one-time British Olympic Marathon runner. That was even more left field than the recent one if anything, given that Morris hadn't been close to winning her only previous marathon and had been refused entry to London for being too slow.

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              Apologies for the thread hike but appears to me to be fairly in line with this. My running days (3 1/2 marathons all just under 2 hours and a fair few 10k's) are long behind me as the knees began to play up and to be honest, I found running a real chore. However, I've been asked to walk the Yorkshire 3 Peaks at the end of June to support our local animal sanctuary. Any tips and advice on training for it - its 24 miles with around 5,000 feet of ascent in total - and has anyone else on here done it?

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                Often wanted to - at least the few times I've been up there in reasonable weather. Much less so the times I have in bad weather. Ingleborough on one of those days when the wind brings the rain in cold and horizontal is not an experience I need to have a second time.

                Moonlight Shadow is likely to be the poster who's most likely to have done it, I'd guess.

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                  Originally posted by Janik View Post
                  The morale is that marathon organisers need to make entries transferable if someone gets injured or ill and needs to drop out late. Clearly this happens often enough, with people not willing to see their entry fee disappear down a black hole due to bad luck.
                  The issues at Blackpool were followed by a bit of a row on social media about the organisers being ambiguous about the transfer deadline - entries were transferable up to a few days before* although the exact cut off seemed to move around a bit. However, as far as I know you could still enter on the day so there were places available but as you suggest these cases are likely to be people recovering their entry fee rather than plotting some conspiracy to 'win' a prize they can't collect.

                  The pre-race drop-out rate for these things is high - 20% on Sunday, but I've seen it be more like 33% for say a 10K with a low entry fee. Many will be down to injury and bad luck of course, but many are because of the weather and/or people just not fancying it / lack of confidence.

                  *one of the reasons for cutting off transfers a few days before in this case is that the race numbers are personalised so they have to print them at some point - which, unless there were a lot of Lesleys and Lindsays involved, makes it even more dumb for men to be running with borrowed female numbers.

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                    Originally posted by ad hoc View Post
                    Often wanted to - at least the few times I've been up there in reasonable weather. Much less so the times I have in bad weather. Ingleborough on one of those days when the wind brings the rain in cold and horizontal is not an experience I need to have a second time.

                    Moonlight Shadow is likely to be the poster who's most likely to have done it, I'd guess.
                    Correct, done it twice. It is a demanding challenge, the terrain can be sometimes difficult (steep ascents and descents on rocks but the bog nightmare is no more, the route has been changed to avoid the worse affected area) and weather conditions will affect you in a variety of way. The route is easy to follow, if you do it in summer chances are you'll have company, sometimes lots of it, the whole way.

                    Training wise, would suggest you start walking around where you live and not just a couple of miles. Then at week-ends, head up the Peak District and go up and down a few hills there. The Y3P has you climbing Ingleborough from its steepest side about 19 miles in the challenge, you'll need mental fortitude and stamina at that point...

                    If serious, happy to provide more specific pointers via PM

                    The first time it took me 10h45 to complete it and I was knackered, the second time it took me 9h01 and I felt great at the end of it (ran the last few miles after clearing Ingleborough)....
                    Last edited by Moonlight Shadow; 24-04-2018, 11:20.

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                      I've done it and agree with everything MS says. For training, yeah, you need to go into the Peak District and do some decent walks. Lose Hill from Hope or Mam Tor from Edale are not bad for an attempt to replicate the kind of challenges you face. Make sure you break all your equipment in during training, not just boots, you don't want to be faffing around trying to get the straps right on a new rucksack on the day itself.

                      As for the walk, Pen-y-Ghent is a horrible climb and it always seems to be grey and miserable on the summit. Then there's a big long fairly level trek which is well marked and has been substantially resurfaced in recent years - as MS alludes, it takes the route away from the horrible boggy sections. That takes you all the way up the valley and past Ribblehead viaduct. Whernside is definitely the easiest climb, a straightforward path around the edge of the hill. The descent is much steeper and can be hard on the legs. Then there's not much flat before you're straight on to the steep bit up Ingleborough and from the top of this it's a flowing descent back to the finish. (Make sure you go the correct way off the top mind - a friend doing it a few years ago had someone in their group getting confused and they ended up in Ingleton)

                      If you're doing it at the end of June there's usually an "official" 3 peaks day which I think tends to fall on the Saturday closest to the solstice and there will be an absolute load of people around.

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                        Originally posted by Moonlight shadow View Post
                        Correct, done it twice. It is a demanding challenge, the terrain can be sometimes difficult (steep ascents and descents on rocks but the bog nightmare is no more, the route has been changed to avoid the worse affected area) and weather conditions will affect you in a variety of way. The route is easy to follow, if you do it in summer chances are you'll have company, sometimes lots of it, the whole way.

                        Training wise, would suggest you start walking around where you live and not just a couple of miles. Then at week-ends, head up the Peak District and go up and down a few hills there. The Y3P has you climbing Ingleborough from its steepest side about 19 miles in the challenge, you'll need mental fortitude and stamina at that point...

                        If serious, happy to provide more specific pointers via PM

                        The first time it took me 10h45 to complete it and I was knackered, the second time it took me 9h01 and I felt great at the end of it (ran the last few miles after clearing Ingleborough)....
                        Brilliant; thanks a lot Moonlight Shadow. Whenever you get a chance, please PM me when you can. Am already doing a fair bit of walking and am off to get some new footwear later today so these can be worn in before the day. No shortage of hills around here either and only 5 minutes away from my house is Kestrel Hill, which isn't very high, but has a demanding gradient, so am doing this a few times each evening after I've walked the dogs (they hate it).

                        Just seen your post to longeared; thanks for the tips, much appreciated.

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                          I decided not to go on a lunchtime run today because it's raining,I feel very inadequate after reading this page

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                            Footwear wise, get something you feel good in it, with grippy soles. There is no obligation to buy big brown leather boots, a light pair of fabric/suede mids will do the trick. Entirely personnal choice, i like to hike in mesh trail running shoes in summer meself.

                            I'll actually post the stuff here, can be useful to other people.

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                              The Boston marathon stories are wonderful. Apparently when the women who finished second was told "You finished second" she asked "in what category?" completely unaware that it was for the full thing.

                              Meanwhile, the Japanese bloke who won the men's race refuses to take sponsorship, also has a proper day job, runs about 5 times as many marathons as the pros do, and his last training run before Boston was a half marathon in a Panda suit.

                              -

                              My recollection of Pen-Y-Ghent (I only ever did them separately) is starting off not on the normal route and almost losing my walking boots in a peat bog.

                              -

                              I ran just over 11 miles this morning. It was slow and on the flat, but the distance is basically there now for the half.

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                                I've had knee problems over the last 15 months which have been getting progressively worse. I've seen a physio and he said he wasn't age-related as I still have an excellent range of movement. He gave me lots of loosening exercises that haven't worked and yet the knee pain only comes on when I run.

                                Yesterday I bought a new pair of trainers and had them fitted properly. They recorded me running, looked at the arch on my feet and brought out trainers which would suit my gait. Today I went for a lunchtime run and the difference was extraordinary. The knee pain that has dogged me for 15 months didn't re-occur but instead has been replaced by the odd sensation of using muscles and bits of the joint which obviously haven't been used for ages. My old trainers were worn down, the tread disappearing and not much support whilst the new ones have supported my foot in a way I had forgotten existed.

                                All it took was a new pair of trainers and worn every damn penny.

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                                  Route

                                  Starting in Horton, at the PYG cafe where you punch your card in an antique device, you also do so to leave your details with the cafe, useful if you do it solo on a quiet day as they will wait for your to clock your arrival time and also a cool memento, if you can read it…After a short stroll through the hamlet, it’s up all the way, first on easy grass then up the “nose” of PYG where a bit of light scrambling on sound rock is required, a bit of light exposure too. Biggest problem will be people stuck and blocking the way, they aren’t many alternative ways up. After the trig is reached, it’s all the way down on a good track before heading across moors and field on easy terrain on your way to Ribblehead. This section is the one where you need to push, it’s relatively flat, the terrain is easy and the navigation without any problems. Fast hike or light jog will build a time reserve for later when things do get demanding.

                                  The ascent onto Whernside is steady and at an easy angle, it allows a good rhythm and there are no difficulties terrain wise. Summit reached, it’s time to head down. At first, an easy descent alongside the spine of Whernisde then a sharp turn left and a steep descent onto eroded paths. Caution is advised on that bit, tiredness will start to affect you and the natural difficulties will add to it. Once that is cleared, it’s another relatively benign stretch onto Ingleborough, a chance to catch up on time if needed.

                                  After a meander across limestone and grass then wood planks (careful, they can be slippery), you ask yourself how the hell you are supposed to go up Ingleborough because in front of you there seems to be just a near vertical mountainside, however the closer you get, the less vertical it looks and you can see a path snaking up, hairpins style. On tired legs, this is a short but brutal ascent and once you reach the col, there is more climbing to be done to reach Ingleborough trig but it is rather less demanding.

                                  When you done touching the trig on the summit, take a minute to enjoy the view if there is one, people built a fort up there millennia ago and tell yourself that unless you suffer a catastrophic collapse or sustain an injury, it’s in the bag because what lies ahead is a steady, uncomplicated 5 miles descent into Horton. Tiredness will play tricks so concentration and a good dose of sugary stuff will keep the mind sharp and when you have cleared the last of the limestone pavement, why not run the remaining couple of miles on grassy terrain if you can, the adrenaline will help…What is left then is to walk the whole length of Horton to reach the café and decide how many pints you want to drink after….

                                  Clothing/Kit

                                  Lighten up…if possible weather wise, if it is a horrible day, exercise caution but on a good day, a light windproof jacket and a light fleece will do the trick for a situation. Plenty of people around, the MRT people know what to expect, there will be first aiders from all the organise walks, if shit happens, you won’t be stuck for hours on a deserted mountain so no need to carry a ton of insulation and emergency supplies. If sunny or just a light cover of clouds, sun cream as you will be exposed for a long time and take a sun hat/cap. I always carry a water filter, a straw one, there a few sources of water you can tap onto but best filter what you drink. There is a reliable one just after you finish the initial climb on Ingleborough. First aid kit, include painkillers, blister plasters, dextrose tablets if you need a quick boost. A pair of hiking poles will help, going up and going down especially if your knees are not all that anymore.

                                  Food/Food points

                                  Do take snacky stuff, do not have a big lunch, do not stop for more than 10 minutes, keep the rhythm. If you sit down for 30 min and eat butties, cakes, etc….you will find it hard to restart. Taking regular short break to snack on a banana, babybel, oatcakes, chicken piece, apples, jelly babies etc is the way to go. Steady supply of fuel throughout the day, I kept my food stuff in a bum bag for ease of access and I had a water bladder in backpack with a tube. Take 3 litres of water as a minimum, try to avoid sugary drinks as your base liquid but if you have time to grab a coke or Ribena, go for it… There are possibilities to procure refreshment at Ribble head, pub and snack van and at a farm in between Whernside and Ingleborough, there is also a pub there. If you have friends/partners that want to help, they can meet you twice by a road with spare socks, drinks, etc….the two meeting points are on the same road a few miles apart and each case next to a pub.

                                  Conclusions

                                  It’s a hard challenge, particularly with the 12 hours time limit on it but it’s entirely feasible. I had a terrible time when I did it first, mistakes with my eating, carried to much silly stuff and lack of sleep yet I still finished it in 10h45. Tweaking stuff the second time, better fitness and sleep and I felt genuinely great after 9h00 when I strolled into Horton, disgracefully, a fag in hand….I ran the last two miles not because I was trying to post a good time, that too but also because I could, felt liberating…

                                  I need to do it again in fact…..

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                                    Ye Gods.

                                    Yesterday I completed a Spartan Ultra. 30 miles, 60 obstacles - and part of their mountain series as you are constantly working your way around a ski slope. I doubt I will ever go through such an enduring event of having to fight on by sheer will power. It took me a bit over 12 hours, though time kind of vanished as a concept as we got stuck hiding under a ski-lift base at the top of the mountain while a lightning storm came through. The last two miles were dealing with slippy terrain exhausted and soaked through with no obstacles (they are mostly metal so they didn't really want to open them, plus they took pity on the fact everyone had suffered such a beatdown).

                                    I have a feeling I am going to lose every toenail (need better fitting shoes for all the pounding on downhills). Probably going to walk funny for at least a week.

                                    It will be a while before I work out if I am going to do something like that again. The Beast length (13 miles) is fun and tiring. The Ultra is just outright savage. I am trying to get my mind around the people starting a Hurricane Heat that night in the rain who were doing crawls under each other as I left.

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                                      Very well done, and beyond my horizon.

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                                        Did the Liverpool Spring 10k today - started by the Catholic cathedral then down Hope Street and out to Sefton Park. Very pleasant surroundings throughout but rather warm. Unfortunately only the one water station along the way; all the other events I've done (mostly in much cooler conditions) have had a couple. Finished in 45:44, which was okay, but feel like I need to get a bit more training in before the Southport Half Marathon on July 1st.

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                                          Apart from the warmth, that sounds lovely. I was out for Parkrun on Saturday at 9am and it was too hot for me already. Had some friends do the London Marathon and that was even hotter than Saturday. I have no idea how they ran the distance anyway let alone in that heat. Must do a 10k this year, probably do the Glastonbury one. Basically it’s a circuit around the Tor in the surrounding countryside

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                                            One of my joyful moments of running news came from my nephew. You may remember that I forced myself out of self-imposed half-marathon retirement last March to collect money for Great Ormond Street Hospital where he had been treated for a rare form of debilitating epilepsy. What I didn't explain fully was that part of the treatment was a hemispherectomy where they disconnected half of his brain (although it remained in his head). Of course, after this treatment, he was paralysed on the right hand side of his body. He quickly regained his memory and speech but his arm and leg have remained somewhat weak. He, of course, has just carried on relentlessly. My brother and sister-in-law took him to America to get therapeutic supports that, despite my initial scepticism, seems to have worked well. They recently uploaded a video of him running around kicking a football (which was a bit like the piano joke as he never played football before the operation) and he also got a medal for swimming 30 feet. Forgive my self-indulgence but the point of this is that he also took part in the 2K junior Hertford Parkrun yesterday and, although he understandably came way back in the field, they used a picture of his happy smiling face as a cover photo for their Facebook page. Of course, I am hoping that he carries this on - mainly because my investment of running to collect funds for him may mean he will do the same for me when I am in my dotage.

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                                              Great story Bored, and your pride shines through.

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                                                Thanks, Walt, and I have to say, in checking through the thread to see if I had mentioned my nephew's condition previously, I once again reviewed and was astonished by your own journey throughout this thread. I would also love to hear how Baldersha got on. Anyone in contact outside of OTF?

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                                                  Great stuff, Bored. (A friend of mine had three of her kids run the Hertford Parkrun Jr yesterday)

                                                  Interesting reading the comments about heat and hydration here. I really hate stopping to hydrate on a run - it absolutely messes with my rhythm and also often screws with my insides as the water wobbles around on its way down. I basically only drink if I'm running well over 10k, and if it's also hot, like above 20C hot. How do the rest of you cope? Do you stop to drink? Do you try and drink and run at the same time, the way elite athletes do?

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                                                    Originally posted by Bordeaux Education View Post
                                                    Thanks, Walt, and I have to say, in checking through the thread to see if I had mentioned my nephew's condition previously, I once again reviewed and was astonished by your own journey throughout this thread. I would also love to hear how Baldersha got on. Anyone in contact outside of OTF?
                                                    Thanks Bored, I go through the thread occasionally too and you shouldn't underestimate how valuable encouragement from you and others has been along the way, and continues to be. My daughter pointed out the other day that it must be four years since I 'started walking' (the original pedometer challenge I did at work) as it was around the time of the last World Cup. I'm doing my fifth marathon on Sunday, and closing in on 100 park runs - though I'll time it so I'll do my 100th with my sister on our Xmas shopping weekend, which is where it all started, running wise, 2.5 years ago. I'm already planning next year's schedule, and I'm not bothered about getting fitter or faster now, I just want to do things that interest me and luckily between walking and running there's no end of interesting stuff. The local scene round Carlisle is taking off, there are four new events kicking off in the next 12 months or so that I can think of off the top of my head, and probably more I've forgotten.

                                                    So I'll be bumping this thread for some time yet, but in the meantime thanks again.

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