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    Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

    Oh, ok, sorry GY.

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      Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

      Why on Earth... wrote:
      Folks, I only have admin rights on my own machines; not over the network as a whole.
      Doesn't matter, whether it's on your own machine or on the network. Developers always think they know best, and it takes just one developer to be spoofed by a site downloading something with a virus on their own machine to cause grief across the whole network.

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        Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

        I'll leave this in your capable hands Pheobe, hopefully you will have more success than me.

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          Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

          It's a possibility, certainly; Phoebe generally has a less aggressively alienating approach.

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            Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

            Unless I'm in sysadmin mode. No fucker gets anything then.

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              Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

              I downloaded Internet Explorer 8 the other day, and it's working fine, apart from me getting logged out of wsc regularly, despite ticking the 'remember me' box. This never happened before. Is there any solution to this, to avoid me getting logged out all the time? Security settings somewhere or something?

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                Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                Bumping this up to the top as I'm about to download IE 8 too. Can anyone answer Lodz's question?

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                  Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                  I wouldn't download IE8 yet. It'll be full of errors and shit, and will take a while to stabilise. Considering the problems with IE7 that have forced IE8 to come out, I'd use a different browser for now.

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                    Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                    Steveeeeeee, it seems like your computer came with what we in the trade call “bloatware”. Lots of unnecessary applications that slow down your machine (like Norton). Again, I can go into detail if you wish. It probably has nothing to do with the operating system.
                    This is true. My laptop came with XP and was slow as fuck. After four months I wiped the whole thing and installed XP from scratch, without any of the additional stuff that came pre-installed on the computer. I then permanently disabled as many windows processes as possible that I would never use (like that NetCalling thing, the Remote Desktop assistant, Windows Media Bloat Player, IE7). All this shit was booting at startup. Now it is really fast. So Windows (well, XP at least, that Vista thing I would never go near) can be a very good operating system, plus they've been releasing bug fixes for XP for eight years now so it's become incredibly stable. They should have just kept developing XP.

                    But you have to know how to trim it down... and the average consumer has no idea how to do that.

                    I used Macs up untill the mid/late 90s, when they became really shit for a while and crashed all the time. Then I switched to Windows. I couldn't be bothered switching back now.

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                      Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                      It logs me out every time I click on "Message Board" in the top panel, to be precise.

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                        Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                        Incidentally, I've been racking my brains about how TG came to form a view about our IT support, because I don't think it's ever come up before. I was on a part-time secondment to a small courseware company for a while, and I think something arose while that was the case. He may have mixed the two up, which is easily done.

                        If I wasn't allowed admin rights on my (loosely) networked laptop, by the way, I'd just get it taken entirely off the network. Admin rights are more important to me than being able to use a remote printer, which is almost the only benefit the network gives me on my laptop, especially given that I also have a fully networked desktop computer with just the standard build on it.

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                          Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                          Lodz, i keep getting that problem too, usually when it goes into compatability mode.

                          I guess it depends on how the website was constructed in the first place. I sometimes get this with other suscription websites and internet banking, IE needs to sort this out.

                          Why on Earth.

                          This is the third thread i think where you have laid into microsoft where the setup in your environment and not the software was at fault.
                          I remember you having a go at Microsoft Updates because it would install updates and reboot your machine without prompting you first.

                          BTW, there is no such thing as a "loosely networked" computer. It is either networked or not. And why are Admin rights so important to you, what exacly do you need to do that you can only do with Admin rights?

                          If you worked in an environment I was in charge of, you would be able to do whatever you wanted to do without Admin rights.

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                            Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                            Ok, I'm looking at getting a new PC at the mo, the one I've got is about 8 years old. I'm not a very techy type, but I have mates who could lend a bit of a hand if needed.
                            As most new PCs you see in the shops (and I know I could do better ordering off the internet) seem to be bundled with Vista, just what is it about Vista I need to be so worried about?

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                              Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                              Tactical Genius wrote:
                              I remember you having a go at Microsoft Updates because it would install updates and reboot your machine without prompting you first.
                              No, you've misremembered. The issue (which did indeed arise away from my institution, at the courseware company I spoke of) was that a computer I was using (not my own) was on that setting where it repeatedly prompted you to reboot. The problem with that was that I was using the machine to give a live online class. I thought, and think now, that the repeated prompting was OTT and that, in any case, the dialog ought to have had a "do not prompt again" checkbox, or something along those lines.

                              In the cheery, helpful spirit for which both you and Microsoft have become legendary, you went instantly on the offensive and informed me that "my" machine (which it wasn't) was on what MS insiders call the "idiot" setting. That revelation has done a lot to inform this current thread. There's an idiot setting? Charming.

                              You're probably right that the IT boys at the company ought to have anticipated the problem and changed the settings on those machines that were used to drive online instruction. But it's a problem that as far as I know doesn't arise in the first place in, say, Unix. And the existence of an "idiot setting" tells one a lot about why, I suspect.

                              I can remember other complaints about Microsoft products (mostly having to do with what IE doesn't do), but I can't remember anything else touching on the issue of settings. So I make that two, not three.

                              I value admin rights, or the functional equivalent, because over half the software I need isn't part of the standard build at my college, and it's useful to me to be able to install such software straight away without going round the houses. By contrast, I don't value the network at all, really, on the laptop; it's mostly irrelevant to my work. My source code repository is external, for example.

                              Comment


                                Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                                By "loosely networked", incidentally, I mean I can see certain remote peripherals, but don't have anything like a shared drive, as I did at the courseware company.

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                                  Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                                  "No, you've misremembered."

                                  Fair enough.

                                  "The issue (which did indeed arise away from my institution, at the courseware company I spoke of) was that a computer I was using (not my own) was on that setting where it repeatedly prompted you to reboot. The problem with that was that I was using the machine to give a live online class. I thought, and think now, that the repeated prompting was OTT and that, in any case, the dialog ought to have had a "do not prompt again" checkbox, or something along those lines."

                                  You didn't at the time state that you were at a third-party institution.
                                  Anyway,that's by the by. Your issue was to do with the configuration of the machine and not a fault or an indictment of how shite the operating system is.

                                  Maybe you should have rebooted the machine before you did the online class.

                                  Also it is difficult for me to debate this with you when you are mis-using IT terminology.
                                  You computer is networked not partly-networked, having shared drives mapped is immeterial, you only have to connect to the network for a second to transmit and receive viruses etc.

                                  A network is only as strong as its weakest link.

                                  Anyway, going to the beach, will tackle this later.

                                  Comment


                                    Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                                    You didn't at the time state that you were at a third-party institution.
                                    Possibly, but I did upthread.

                                    Anyway,that's by the by. Your issue was to do with the configuration of the machine and not a fault or an indictment of how shite the operating system is.
                                    I'm afraid I disagree. I think the fact that the dialog didn't allow a "no reminders please" response was high-handed, in the way that MS software often is.

                                    Maybe you should have rebooted the machine before you did the online class.
                                    That's exactly the problem; the dialog doesn't appear immediately you boot, but only several minutes afterwards, by which time, in this case, the class was under way. It's a slightly ropey piece of design.

                                    I didn't say "partly networked", by the way. I said "loosely", to make the point, in case there was any ambiguity, that (a) I don't have admin rights on any other machine and (b) I don't really need the network, because it offers me very little. I'm aware it's not a technical term.

                                    I do think you might be less aggressive, and make fewer attempts to belittle. It makes it hard not to respond in kind, which would defeat my ends at the moment.

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                                      Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                                      "I'm afraid I disagree. I think the fact that the dialog didn't allow a "no reminders please" response was high-handed, in the way that MS software often is"

                                      It is not high-handed. You have just installed critical updates that require a reboot, until you machine is rebooted, the settings have not been fully implemented and your system is unstable.
                                      Its not high-handed, it is merely reminding you of that fact.

                                      "That's exactly the problem; the dialog doesn't appear immediately you boot, but only several minutes afterwards, by which time, in this case, the class was under way. It's a slightly ropey piece of design"

                                      I suspect that the setting on the machine is configured to check for latest updates either via a login script, local policy or group policy. Depending on the environment it would go to the microsoft update site or the local WSUS server (or a non-miccrosoft solution).

                                      It probably downloaded and installed them hence the delay after login for a few minutes before prompting for a reboot.
                                      With Vista, it will give you the option to delay the reboot and not prompt you for up to 4 hours, I guess you were using XP and i cannot remeber off the top of my head how long you can delay the prompt if you can at all.
                                      But again, that is to do with your environment and not MS.
                                      I believe people should be prompted to reboot their machine if it requires a reboot and it is not smart for people to ignore those prompts indefinitly as they would be the first to moan when the system crashes due to instability.

                                      "I didn't say "partly networked", by the way. I said "loosely"

                                      Ok my mistake.

                                      "to make the point, in case there was any ambiguity, that (a) I don't have admin rights on any other machine and (b) I don't really need the network, because it offers me very little. I'm aware it's not a technical term"

                                      But using the term created ambiguity.
                                      Anyway you don't need Admin rights on other machines to compromise the network.
                                      You say you don't need the network, but you use the machine to download software and to deposit your finished application. I would like to know how you manage that?

                                      "I do think you might be less aggressive, and make fewer attempts to belittle."

                                      I don't think i am being aggressive or belittleing, I am actually trying my best not to come across as that.

                                      The bottom line is that your rant has no basis in fact and in trying to explain yourself, you have little appreciation of network computer systems are, of IT security or best practices with regards to configurationchangerelease management.

                                      Now you could argue the toss if you wish, but you will be wrong and i will be right.
                                      I am not saying this because i am aggressive or trying to belittle you, but because this area of IT is where is make my living.

                                      None of the other IT bods on OTF have come on and agreed with you or disagreed with a word of what I have said and that should tell you all you need to know.

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                                        Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                                        "It probably downloaded and installed them hence the delay after login for a few minutes before prompting for a reboot.
                                        With Vista, it will give you the option to delay the reboot and not prompt you for up to 4 hours, I guess you were using XP and i cannot remeber off the top of my head how long you can delay the prompt if you can at all."

                                        Five minutes. It's a fairly aggressive way of getting you to reboot, but it only does this when someone exploits a weakness than can cause immens problems to your machine, network or both.

                                        "But again, that is to do with your environment and not MS."

                                        Quite. It will either check for updates at a specific time, or at logon. I personally don't like logon scripts that can potentially do a few minutes work, then demand a reboot, but knowing what some users are like, it is the most effective way of getting vital updates onto the machine.

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                                          Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                                          Tactical Genius wrote:
                                          You say you don't need the network, but you use the machine to download software and to deposit your finished application. I would like to know how you manage that?
                                          For both of those, I only need an internet connection (with secure file transfer).

                                          Tactical Genius wrote:
                                          I don't think i am being aggressive or belittleing, I am actually trying my best not to come across as that.
                                          Well, I don't want to get into a war of quotes, but I don't think that self-description is sustainable and I would ask you to try harder. For example, I don't think the word "rant" is at all accurate or helpful, when describing a moment's frustration.

                                          And I don't think belabouring the point, which I freely conceded very early on, that this isn't the level of computing at which I'm expert (any more than high-level programming is yours) gets us very far either. It looks like insecurity, frankly.

                                          Tactical Genius wrote:
                                          None of the other IT bods on OTF have come on and agreed with you or disagreed with a word of what I have said and that should tell you all you need to know.
                                          On the other hand, the way we work at my College seems to work pretty well. The policy isn't of my devising, of course.

                                          Be that as it may, I would have very few complaints if your approach had resembled theirs.

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                                            Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                                            Pheobe.

                                            "Quite. It will either check for updates at a specific time, or at logon. I personally don't like logon scripts that can potentially do a few minutes work, then demand a reboot"

                                            With the advent of Active Directory and Group policies (especially with server 2003 onwards) alot of what is contained in logon scripts is unnecessary.
                                            But they remain because;

                                            1. many systems Admins are not clued up enough on AD to make the change.

                                            2. The want to prove how clever they are by having elaborate logon scripts.

                                            "but knowing what some users are like, it is the most effective way of getting vital updates onto the machine."

                                            Some users would like to put these off indefinitly.

                                            Wyatt.

                                            Sometimes it is good to occasionally realise when you are wrong and just accept it without responding with snide comments.

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                                              Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! Windows!

                                              OK, let's leave this there.

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