The White Supremacy thread

[Nefertiti2]

Both Ali and Clinton were womanisers. Both Ali and Clinton avoided going to Vietnam.

Ali made his opposition to the draft explicitly politicalm was sentenced to five years in jail and stripped of his livelihood.

Clinton used various connections to avoid the draft.

Ali is worth 100 Clintons.

[Tactical Genius]

I think that Ali was a misogynist and that civil rights include human rights and specifically in this case women's rights. I'm also very skeptical about the whole Nation of Islam movement, as I am about any religious movement.

In what respects do you believe Ali was a misogynist, is it based on this article or have you read or heard other stuff I am not privvy to (and yes, i saw the interview linked to in the article)?

[Sporting]

Based on various quotes and interviews over the years. But are you suggesting that his opinion re women were acceptable?

[Sporting]

[Tactical Genius]

Based on various quotes and interviews over the years. But are you suggesting that his opinion re women were acceptable?

Well I need to know what all these opinions are, hence my questions?

The interview linked to where he articulated his expectations on how he expected his wife to dress and conduct herself, whether you agree with his views or not, would that constitute "Hate Speech"
Ali had been a member (or follower) of the NOI since he was a teenager and had been pretty open about this since the Sonny Liston fight in 1964. So any woman who got with him knew what they were getting themselves into.
I have watched many interviews with Ali's ex-wives and girlfriends and apart from his womanising, have barely a cross word to say about him, and they cannot complain about that as he was married when they met him.

But this,
"Those who choose to blithely dismiss such hate speech as a “performance” should perhaps first speak to his four wives, innumerable “mistresses,” and the countless other females he exploited.

When someone writes stuff like that, then you know this is not objective but a mean hit piece. The man talks about him like he's Epstein FFS.

[Sporting]

I like Ali, by the way, despite all my above posts. But as a spokesman for civil rights, I'd look elsewhere, though my opinion is probably irrelevant!

[Tactical Genius]

I like Ali, by the way, despite all my above posts. But as a spokesman for civil rights, I'd look elsewhere, though my opinion is probably irrelevant!

You know Ali did not advocate forcing women to dress conservatively (unless you have material to hand I have not seen) The NOI do not attempt to force non members to adopt their dress code.

I could agree with you if he pretended to be one thing and then on their wedding night opened her wardrobe with bin liner in hand and started going through her outfits.

I am just making the point to counter the bullshit in the article you posted and stand by.

I don't see how you can like Ali after posting such an article and writing what you have said.
That article is the kind of guff written by the intellectual right-wingers of the 1960's

But you know my mantra when evaluating the effectiveness of black leaders.............

[Sporting]

I don't see how you can like Ali after posting such an article and writing what you have said.

I already said I didn't agree with everything in the article but (much more importantly) can't we still like people despite thinking them to be flawed in various ways?

[Tactical Genius]

I already said I didn't agree with everything in the article but (much more importantly) can't we still like people despite thinking them to be flawed in various ways?

I have re-read you posts and i do not see where you have distanced yourself from the views of the author, besides the appraisal of some aspects of Ali's boxing career. See below.

This is an interesting article which seeks to debunk his myth. I don't agree particularly with the boxing sections but the rest does give pause for thought. Maybe the author of the piece has an agenda, I don't know:

Dude, You knew the author had an agenda so please don't play dumb. The article was a load of spiteful anti-black drivel. Very little he has written stands up to any serious scrutiny.

Feel free to tell us exactly what in the article you agreed with and didn't agree with.

[Sporting]

Eating now but will get back to you

[Sporting]

I have re-read you posts and i do not see where you have distanced yourself from the views of the author, besides the appraisal of some aspects of Ali's boxing career. See below.



Dude, You knew the author had an agenda so please don't play dumb. The article was a load of spiteful anti-black drivel. Very little he has written stands up to any serious scrutiny.

Feel free to tell us exactly what in the article you agreed with and didn't agree with.

But very quickly, the writer defends Frazier...who was black. So not entirely anti black vitriol.

[Sporting]

I agree with this section:

"Beyond that, he relentlessly mocked Frazier’s manner of speech and regularly called him a “gorilla” and the white man’s champion. The hard-working Frazier became seen as a foil, a dupe of the establishment. With progressing cruelty, Ali controlled the narrative and few questioned how such an anti-authority rebel could publicly declare that Frazier was “so ugly his face should be donated to the bureau of wildlife.” But Ali’s fans took it seriously enough to send regular death threats to Frazier and his family.

All this despite that fact that Frazier publicly supported Ali’s conscientious objector status and -- get this -- helped his rival financially during the exile. How many of his eulogizers talked at length about the betrayal of Ali using the ridiculing language of white supremacy against his Black “brothers” in order to further his career? (While rarely if ever calling out white fighters like Rocky Marciano for calling him “Clay.”)"

This part seems to expect a greater knowledge on Ali's behalf than he could reasonably have expected to have been aware of, given that he was preparing for a big fight:

"Ali willingly bought into Mobutu and his fa?ade of African-ness: "I wanted to establish a relationship between American blacks and Africans,” The Greatest [sic] said. “All the time I was there, I'd travel to the jungles, places where there was no radio or television, and people would come up to me, and I could touch them.”

Ali apparently had no comment about touching those housed in the secret detention cells under the stadium where the fight took place or the criminals who were rounded up and shot before the foreign press arrived."

Dude, You knew the author had an agenda so please don't play dumb

Fair enough.

[Sporting]

can't we still like people despite thinking them to be flawed in various ways

You didn't answer this.

[Satchmo Distel]

In 100 years, people will be still talking about Stokely Carmichael, Malcolm X, MLK, Muhammed Ali...

You might try spelling Muhammad Ali's name correctly.

John Lewis, the establishments favourites Negro, A man Satchmo Distel respects.

I've already stated above that I would encourage my students to think critically about Lewis and his strategies, not eulogize him uncritically. See:

https://www.onetouchfootball.com/for...53#post2325153

Bill Clinton is definitely a racist and probably a rapist and I'm not happy about him speaking at funerals such as this one.

[Tactical Genius]

But very quickly, the writer defends Frazier...who was black. So not entirely anti black vitriol.

Please re-read his descriptions of Frazier, Ali's insults towards Frazier were in the main to hype the fight (both Ali and Frazier have admitted this in the past numerous times). What is this guys excuse?

This part seems to expect a greater knowledge on Ali's behalf than he could reasonably have expected to have been aware of, given that he was preparing for a big fight:

You know that Mobuto was a western plant and all the names of those people he murdered was given to him by the CIA as well as the French, British and Belgian equivalents. Actually, fighting in Zaire at the time was no more morally objectionable than fighting in the USA. If you disagree, I am more than happy to have that debate (rustles receipts)

can't we still like people despite thinking them to be flawed in various ways

You are free to like or dislike whoever you want. Much in the same way people have a right to question your judgement.

[Tactical Genius]

You might try spelling Muhammad Ali's name correctly.

My Bad, You can give me a D- for spelling and i will give you and F+ for course content

I've already stated above that I would encourage my students to think critically about Lewis and his strategies, not eulogize him uncritically. See:

Yep, I saw that at the time.

To be classed as a Civil Rights Icon, you have to demonstrate tangible improvements for black people, especially in the face for systematic white Supremacy.
You should ask your students to write an essay signalling John Lewis' wins against systematic White Supremacy. Maybe an interesting conversation would be for them to count the number of Sit-ins the CBC have held in the last 7 years since the death of Trayvon Martin and how many of them were against police brutality. You can then discuss the sit-ins and discuss how they helped black people.

Finally this:

Bill Clinton is definitely a racist and probably a rapist and I'm not happy about him speaking at funerals such as this one.

I think Clinton speaking at his funeral was appropriate, at Aretha Franklin on the other hand.

[Tactical Genius]

There was an excellent episode (or at least by the standards of mainstream TV) on last week tonight by Jon Oliver. It seems like the producers of the show have been reading my posts.
I recommend you all go and watch that.

[Tactical Genius]

Whilst i am on recommendations, the Danny Rose interview on Second Captains and "The Talk" on Channel 4 are well worth a listen/Watch.

[Nefertiti2]

armed gunmen setting roadblocks during Oregon fires

Widespread (baseless) rumours on the right the fires are being set by antifa

https://twitter.com/R3volutionDaddy/status/1304148135288221696?s=20

[ursus arctos]

Gun-toting vigilantes interfering with the evacuation of half a million people

What a country

[Nefertiti2]

saw someone describe QAnon as America’s ISIS.

[Nefertiti2]

https://twitter.com/lincolngraves/status/1303903643150610433?s=21

[Nefertiti2]

Militias in Louisville

[Tactical Genius]

I would be very careful of Grandmaster Jay and the NFAC. He has been exposed as a charlatan and a plant.

[diggedy derek]

Curtis Flowers is free