The White Supremacy thread

[Tactical Genius]

Did any of it help answer your question, though?

Also you said you had some theories - I'd be interested in hearing them.

It did help immensely, and covered alot I have read heard from the writings black scholars as well as things that have been rattling around in my head based on what has been said to me by a couple of white people in my youth and my experiences.

I am probably no use in analysing where the hatred (in my opinion) comes from as I am not white, nor have I grown up in a white household where these attitudes are first taught. I can only speak on the many ways this form of hatred is experienced when black and white people interact.

[Patrick Thistle]

It's a difficult question to answer because as I said previously, it automatically raises a defensiveness in people. I think most white people would answer the question with "We don't!" without asking the further question "But why do black people feel like we do?"

[Tactical Genius]

Ok, I’ll have a go at commenting on the posts.
Note: I am not judging or having a go, just giving my observations on the points raised.
@sporting

As for the basic question I would say ignorance and lack of education in the best of cases..

This I struggle to understand, bigotry and racism is something that is taught and understood and requires verbal and non-verbal cues to really get the point across. From my experience children aren’t born racist, it goes against the fundamentals of child behaviour. Children tend not to fear or hate things until they are instructed to by adults repeatedly until they get the message.
For all the parents out there, how many times did you have to drag your child away from an open flame before they got the message fire is dangerous.
@Nefertiti2

some simply hanker for the days when white men could be cruel to people they considered of lesser worth than themselves

Those days have never ended or have I missed some landmark event.
@Balderdasha.
Interesting points your raise regarding the attitudes of your sister, mother and father. There is a theory the main objective of White Supremacy Doctrine is to prevent the genetic annihilation of the white race. Additionally, the thought process is the anti-black indoctrination is pushed harder on the white women than the men as the main objective is to keep the black penis away from the white vagina. For example, White people can only eliminate black people through acts of murder, Black people can fuck white people out of existence hence the use of scare tactics to keep white women away from black men. Stuff like, “they will rob you, they will get you hooked on drugs, they will rape you, they will give you Aids, they will impregnate you and run away”. This is done from an early age so by the time you reach sexual maturity, you are frightened enough to keep away.
White Supremacy sees interracial sex as an act of war hence why it was seen as a lynchable offence. Any action considered as a sexual overture was treated in the same way as an enemy amassing tanks at the border and any white woman reciprocating is considered a traitor. Ask any white women who has dated interracially if this has caused issues with dating white men down the line.
@Patrick

I didn't flame the person in my (all-white) former office who used the word "darkies", although that was technically a sacking offence. In that moment I tolerated racism, because to challenge it would have been the hard thing to do and I took the easy way out.”

I wouldn’t advise a white person to flame their work colleague in that situation, especially if you don’t think your other work colleagues to back you. Best to listen, say nothing and nod sheepishly. Then when you leave the room, find a black person you trust and game them up on who all the racists are and what their plans are and advise the best way they can circumnavigate. Your best job is to be the spook who sat by the door.
@delicatemouth

This is such a good and important question and - I don't know. Some combination of resentment (at the continued survival and often thriving of people subjected to systematic discrimination); guilt (at our own participation in and complicity with discriminatory structures) and fear (that given the opportunity They will treat Us like We treat Them) is the best I can do.

I understand all of this, but this would concerns white people would have of all non White people on the planet. However, there level of racism towards black people is (in my opinion) much more vicious than it is against the Chinese, Indian subcontinent and Japan who don’t seem to have had the same levels of vitriol against them in the media and who are in the position to exact revenge for past misdeeds as the have the West by the balls financially.
@Gman

Racial and ethnic hatred is hardwired in humanity, in a game of domination and survival. Alexander the Great conquered Persia, much of the Middle East and Egypt on the understanding that Greeks were superior in every way to the ":savages" he subjugated. But when he tried to integrate these "savages", he met with resistance. Not because his army was worried that the "savages": might assert themselves, but because they were seen as inferior and unworthy of Greek superiority.
Greek culture is the foundation of Western culture, and here we find bigotry right at its roots.

This is historically inaccurate, I am more than happy to debate with this with you some time in the future when the current conversation has run it’s course.

[Tactical Genius]

It's a difficult question to answer because as I said previously, it automatically raises a defensiveness in people. I think most white people would answer the question with "We don't!" without asking the further question "But why do black people feel like we do?"

Wouldn't you think people who answer in the manner are being disingenuous, as the answer "we don't" is clearly false unless you grew up in some kind of Utopian commune that was completely insulated from white society?

[Nefertiti2]

For all the parents out there, how many times did you have to drag your child away from an open flame before they got the message fire is dangerous.
Nefertiti2
some simply hanker for the days when white men could be cruel to people they considered of lesser worth than themselves


Those days have never ended or have I missed some landmark event.

That's fair enough. Apologies, and thanks for making me aware of my own racism.

[Tactical Genius]

That's fair enough. Apologies, and thanks for making me aware of my own racism.

Sorry, I don't understand your point here, I did not realise I was accusing you here?

[Antepli Ejderha]

TG I took this as an acknowledgement of the analogy used.

[Tactical Genius]

TG I took this as an acknowledgement of the analogy used.

Ahh, ok. It's the quotes directed to another poster and to him that threw me.

[Patrick Thistle]

Wouldn't you think people who answer in the manner are being disingenuous, as the answer "we don't" is clearly false unless you grew up in some kind of Utopian commune that was completely insulated from white society?

I don't think they put enough thought into it to even be disingenuous. It's a worse level of ignorance.

I'm working on my own feelings here. My first reaction to your question was to feel a bit angry about the inflammatory language used. To say white people like me hate black people is totally unfair. I don't hate black people etc etc. Then I realised I was doing a #NotAllWhitePeople and I thought 'why does Tactical Genius think white people hate black people?' And that got me thinking. Maybe there is something in white people en masse. Maybe even in me, that I don't realise is there. It takes a lot to break free of indoctrination. I've managed it with religion and it still has me in lockstep sometimes. So what else don't I know? About me?

So honestly when I said people's first reaction would be to say "We don't", that was analysing my own first reaction.

You may laugh about this but I'd say the majority of white people would genuinely say they feel they aren't racist. That's perhaps the greatest danger when discussing racism. We don't see our own complicity.

[Patrick Thistle]

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@Patrick

I wouldn’t advise a white person to flame their work colleague in that situation, especially if you don’t think your other work colleagues to back you. Best to listen, say nothing and nod sheepishly. Then when you leave the room, find a black person you trust and game them up on who all the racists are and what their plans are and advise the best way they can circumnavigate. Your best job is to be the spook who sat by the door.

I think you're kinder to me there than I deserve. I feel ashamed I didn't do more.

[Antepli Ejderha]

https://www.bustle.com/p/10-books-ab...to-you-8548796

TG and others, what's your take on these books?

[Tactical Genius]

https://www.bustle.com/p/10-books-ab...to-you-8548796

TG and others, what's your take on these books?

Never heard of the books or writers. And if I am honest looking at the titles and front covers doesn't really interest me.

[Antepli Ejderha]

Never heard of the books or writers. And if I am honest looking at the titles and front covers doesn't really interest me.

Fair enough TG.

What would you recommend?

[Tactical Genius]

Fair enough TG.

What would you recommend?

This will sound like a cop out answer, it depends what you want to know or understand.
If it is about black empowerment and revolutionary thought, then a good place to start would be Malcolm X, Dr John Henrik Clarke.
Pre-colonial African history, Chancellor Williams, William Leo Hansberry, Dr Cheikh Anta Diop
From a UK perspective Robin Walker, Akala and Dr Kehinde Andrews are good.

On Youtube Dr Claude Anderson is excellent despite being in his mid 80's
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fW39KOf_f04

[Tactical Genius]

Has this got much traction in the US media?

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/u...i-prisons.html

It was news when such facilities were exposed in the US migrant camps, but in a prison, it seems to be less an issue and appears to be spun as gang violence..
I wonder what the demographics of the prisoners are.

[ursus arctos]

Not anywhere near as much as it should have.

Pro Publica has been reporting on this for over a year

[ad hoc]

https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/1224657174720282625

[Tactical Genius]

https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/1224657174720282625

If truth be told, this happens so often it's not worth getting angry about when there are far more insidious things going on.

[ursus arctos]

For example

https://twitter.com/TheEconomist/status/1225041588264587265

Smoking-gun evidence emerges for racial bias in American courts

Black defendants are suspiciously likely to be charged with carrying precise amounts of crackGraphic detailJan 18th 2020 edition

---

JAN 18TH 2020
You don’t need a degree in statistics to believe that racial disparities plague American law enforcement. Of every 100,000 black adults, 2,300 are incarcerated—five times the rate for whites. This gap is not proof of discrimination: blacks could be five times as likely to break the law. Yet critics say that courts treat blacks more harshly than whites who face similar charges. A recent working paper, by Cody Tuttle of the University of Maryland, bolsters this view by revealing striking evidence of bias.

When suspects are charged with drug possession, the quantities in their indictments only loosely reflect what they were carrying when arrested. Prosecutors can boost amounts using testimony about previous activity, or by charging people for drugs held by co-conspirators. Some convictions cite 100 times as much crack as the defendant had in hand. Such leeway makes these figures as much a measure of prosecutorial discretion as of suspects’ crimes.
In 1986 Congress passed a law requiring anyone possessing 50g or more of crack to serve at least ten years in prison. Legislators raised this cut-off to 280g in 2010, making the minimum sentence for possession of 279g half as long as for 280g. By creating a cliff, the law encouraged offenders to carry less than 280g. It also enabled prosecutors who sought extra-long sentences to secure them, by filing charges just above the limit.

Before 2010, convictions for 270-280g or 290-300g were just as common as for 280-290g. After that year, the share of sentences for 280-290g surged, from 0.5% to 4%; the rates for adjacent amounts barely changed. Moreover, the burden of these strategically sized charges fell disproportionately on minorities. In 2011-15, 4% of convictions of black and Hispanics for possession were for 280-290g, compared with 1.5% of sentences for whites. The shares for both races were similar at 270-280g and 290-300g.
Mr Tuttle finds that only a minority of prosecutors (around 20-30%) display this bias. These officials tend to work in states with above-median rates of searches on Google for racial slurs, suggesting racism is more common in their regions. In other states, “bunching” at 280-290g did occur, but affected blacks and whites equally.

On its own, ending this gap would barely dent the racial imbalance in American jails. But if prosecutors are biased against black suspects in these cases, they may carry that animus to other crimes as well. ■

Sources: US Bureau of Justice; World Prison Brief; World Bank; “Racial Disparities in Federal Sentencing: Evidence from Drug Mandatory Minimums”, by Cody Tuttle, University of Maryland; FBI; The Economist

[Tactical Genius]

Thanks for that excellent post Ursus, it is a shame stuff like this is still considered News

Wasn't Joe Biden involved in that 1986 act with the mandatory minimum for crack cocaine?
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...-incarceration

I was drawn to the second paragraph and it re-enforces my view that more legislation is not needed it is the equal application of existing legislation.

Being this is Black History month in the US, I am duty bound to go for deeper topics. I apologise to certain posters in advance.

[ursus arctos]

He most certainly was

There are so many ways in which the criminal justice system here is stacked against black people. Every rock one picks up reveals a teeming mass of injustice.

[Tactical Genius]

I'll start with this.

Dr Kehinde Andrews has now become my favourite UK personality.

See here his latest spat with Morgan on whether empire should be removed from the MBE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxAcAnBZ1jo

He raises some interesting points which I (of course) agree with 100%.

[Tactical Genius]

He most certainly was

There are so many ways in which the criminal justice system here is stacked against black people. Every rock one picks up reveals a teeming mass of injustice.

Shame on you for besmirching the character of the colossus of Civil Rights. Like Sanders, Uncle Joe marched with DR King?

https://twitter.com/banditelli/statu...-dementia.html

[San Bernardhinault]

I can't tell if this belongs here or in the WTF thread:

[ad hoc]

I like that Kehinde Andrews guy

Did you know that Britain actually did pay reparations after ending the slave trade? Sort of. In fact they only stopped paying them in 2015

http://www.bbc.com/culture/story/202...lavery-history

I don;t really have words