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Grenfell flats fire

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    Thanks for that link Hindle.

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      From the BBC website:


      The Grenfell Tower fire in London started in a faulty fridge freezer, and outside cladding failed safety tests, police say.

      Insulation on the building also failed tests and the Metropolitan Police will consider manslaughter charges.

      Seventy-nine people are missing or presumed dead after the blaze destroyed 150 homes in the Kensington tower block.
      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40380584

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        The police also said that they expect the death toll to rise, that some of the bodies may never be recovered and that recovery work could last rest of the year. In addition the Home Office have said that if anyone worried about their immigration status comes forward they won't be deported.

        There's quite a lot of talk that flats have been illegally sub let which could be why so many residents have said the death toll is much higher.

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          Five London tower blocks to be evacuated over safety fears after Grenfell fire

          https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...y_to_clipboard

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            I think that there are going to be more evacuations as 14 tower blocks have been confirmed as having the same cladding with investigations ongoing.

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              This is going to get chaotic, according to the Guardian story they are evacuating up to 800 households, telling people to stay with friends or family if they can, and otherwise to go to the local library for information.

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                Correction the 800 households figure came from the BBC, the rest from The Guardian.

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                  Cladding on 27 high-rise blocks of flats in 15 council areas fails fire safety tests. This is going to be a huge, and very expensive, issue for councils, particularly if they follow Camden's lead.

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                    Originally posted by Crusoe View Post
                    Cladding on 27 high-rise blocks of flats in 15 council areas fails fire safety tests. This is going to be a huge, and very expensive, issue for councils, particularly if they follow Camden's lead.
                    I'm guessing that they won't be paying in the long term for this. Rydon and the other companies who put this cladding on surely must pay. Unfortunately for them to be prosecuted for this the burden of proof is extremely high.

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                      Those companies probably couldn't afford to pay, even if court judgements were issued against them. They would simply go bankrupt. The firm that originally supplied the panels has already done precisely that two years ago over a debt of just 1m, showing the scale of at least some of these companies. Which would leave councils/government having to pay in the end.

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                        Won't some of these companies have liability insurance? Rydon are a decent size so must have it, if it is them who are liable.

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                          Liability insurance will only pay out if the company has been negligent at law, Tubbs.

                          That's not to say that the company directors may have been personally negligent, however.

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                            All of this again shows why organisations such as the health and safety executive are critical in protecting us against the interests of capitalists. Sadly successive governments have sought to make them impotent.

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                              Isn't the HSE about workplaces?

                              I see Abbott's casually remarked that "hundreds" died in Grenfell. Good Lord.

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                                Yep, can't remember the name of the organisation that regulates buildings. Abbot should know better.

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                                  This is my borough and I feel sick. Where the fuck are they supposed to go?

                                  Some people refusing to evacuate Camden tower blocks.

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                                    Have they had different legal advice to other councils? Are the others evacuating?

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                                      The others were evacuated last night, I believe. Appeals for people with any space to get in touch and put folk up. It's upheaving.

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                                        Originally posted by Toby Gymshorts View Post
                                        Liability insurance will only pay out if the company has been negligent at law, Tubbs.

                                        That's not to say that the company directors may have been personally negligent, however.
                                        If they have been, the comeback is likely to be criminal rather than financial though, isn't it? The separation of directors and shareholders personal wealth from corporate debts is the point of limited liability companies as I understand them.

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                                          Criminal and financial. If they're prosecuted personally by the HSE, then fines are unlimited.

                                          I rather imagine some assets are in the process of being hastily transferred.

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                                            I thought we had established the HSE weren't involved in, as these tower blocks aren't work places? Though weren't there some council offices in Grenfell below where the fire started...

                                            And obviously yes, criminal sanctions can be fines. However those would be set according to the scale of the crime rather than the cost of the remedial work to put things right, no? And those fines (if paid!) wouldn't go to the local councils having to deal with the costs of all this, anyway.

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                                              Is there no private right of action in play here?

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                                                60 buildings in 25 areas have now failed safety tests.

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                                                  http://www.sciencemediacentre.org/ex...er-block-fire/

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                                                    Originally posted by Antepli Ejderha View Post
                                                    60 buildings in 25 areas have now failed safety tests.
                                                    A failure rate of 100% apparently.

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