Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Brexit Thread

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    That's paywalled by the bullshit paper of record so I can't see past the first para. But the Question of rejoining the UK was asked to Bertie by the Nat MP Peter Grant, so I'm assuming he asked it fully aware of its absurdity, unlike that pure gammon bastard John Humphreys.

    Comment


      ‘I’m exhausted explaining to British people the geography of their own country’

      Many people in Britain are unaware that Ireland is a separate country at all

      When former taoiseach Bertie Ahern was asked by a House of Commons committee how Irish people feel about the suggestion that they leave the EU and “re-join” the United Kingdom, many in Ireland were amazed this could be considered a serious solution to border backstop problem.

      But as an Irish person living in Britain, the story was just another reminder of how little the average British person knows or cares about their country’s relationship with their nearest neighbour.

      For many who voted in favour, Brexit was very much a case of “Take control of our borders now, figure out where our borders are later”. The result has been the grindingly absurd fiasco that is the UK’s withdrawal from the European Union.

      Living in London, I’m sometimes asked if I’ve felt any hostility towards Irish immigrants here as the negotiations between our governments grow ever more strained. But I think the desire by some for Ireland to ditch its Republic and “come home” to the union actually comes from a place of well-intentioned ignorance, or a kind of dumb inclusivity.

      When the subject of the Irish border recently came up in a bar, a pro-Brexit person in my group leaned in and said to me “I think Ireland should be part of the UK anyway, like Scotland or Wales”, then nodded magnanimously like he was a builder of bridges.

      Herein lies the difficulty for Irish people in my position - how to educate someone on their own history, without sounding like an overly sensitive, confrontational IRA sympathiser? Is it possible to let go of the past, when one of the parties involved is unaware that the past even took place? Separation

      As obsessed as the Irish national psyche is with Britain and our independence from it, many people in Britain are unaware that Ireland is a separate country at all. While they may be vaguely aware of a separation between the North of Ireland and the Republic, there’s often a presumption that Irish sovereignty is a kind of nominal independence.

      Twice in the last few months I’ve had to request that my nationality be changed from British to Irish on a form - once when registering to vote, and again when booking a holiday with a travel agent. On each occasion the administrators - who had pre-filled my information incorrectly - greeted my requests as though I were being pedantic, adhering to some trivial, obscure technicality.

      As an immigrant here, the regular task of having to explain the geography of their own country to British people while simultaneously trying to sound like a grateful, “good” immigrant is getting exhausting. But perhaps my stepping into the void and filling the gaps left by British education system is the free market doing its job, like the Conservatives always told us it would?

      Asserting one’s identity shouldn’t be about nationalism - Irish independence from Britain is a simple geo-political fact. Likewise, opting for continued membership of the EU over a return to a union with Britain isn’t about sectarianism, it ultimately boils down to bare economics. Poverty

      As part of the United Kingdom, Ireland experienced centuries of brutal poverty, ultimately culminating in famine, mass emigration and the reduction of Dublin to one of the worst slums in Europe. While the rest of the UK went through its industrial revolution, Ireland actually de-industrialised, condemning generations of Irish workers to the surreal misery of subsistence farming, providing food to England’s exploding urban population with any surplus pocketed by an absentee landlord class.

      As a member of the EU, Ireland has attracted billions of Euros in foreign direct investment, while being part of the single market has allowed Irish businesses to trade easily with Europe and beyond. Ireland’s net gain from EU budgets has been €44.6 billion since 1976, and the impact on our infrastructure has been transformative.

      Last year the Irish economy created nearly 1,300 new jobs per week, while the British government is actively encouraging employers to leave its shores as it presses ahead with its bullish, directionless approach to Brexit. Everyone from banks to car manufacturers are on the way out, and the Bank of England said last week that Brexit has cost the economy £80 billion so far.

      Eventually, this is something that even the most hardline unionist in Northern Ireland will have to consider; who will offer them and their children a better deal - membership of the UK, or the EU?

      Nevertheless, the Irish border backstop has caused consternation in the Conservative party, and the reunification of Ireland and Britain is something that has seriously been suggested by those grasping for a solution to the Brexit mess.

      Let’s call it what it is; desperate. It is the political equivalent of getting a drunk text from an ex at 1am, suggesting that you get back together. Ireland knows that Britain has had too much to drink, has kebab on its shirt and is probably crying.

      Unfortunately for Britain, Ireland would prefer to just stay friends.

      Comment


        Cheers Berba. I was once asked by some Rotherham call centre lass when deferring my student loan if Dublin was in Northern Ireland. That such levels of ignorance are matched by fuckin Davis, Humphreys etc is pretty terrifying. Let alone the downright hostile to anything but Orangeism attitudes displayed by the fish lipped Gove through the years.

        by all accounts the sonorous Geoffrey Cox was quite amazed at how the GFA requires some kind of backstop in place should talks fall apart when he met with Irish and EU officials the past few weeks. The fucking UK Attorney General.

        A fuckin failed state.
        Last edited by Lang Spoon; 21-02-2019, 01:03.

        Comment


          I've only ever encountered this sort of thing directly when trying to pay for something with a Northern Irish Bank note, and being told that having the Bank of Ireland written on it meant that it was Irish money.

          Comment


            The Danske bank notes must make their fuckin heads explode.

            Comment


              Hahaha. It's a hilarious way to issue currency

              Comment


                I can't wait till the Clydesdale Banknotes become Virgin Money poonds in 2021.

                Comment


                  The was people say 'Southern Ireland' and the genuine puzzlement that to go back under British rule is not an option. At all. There is an awful lot of people who think it was a good thing.

                  Comment


                    The same attitude exists toward the rest of our former empire. People have been taught to believe that we civilised half the planet, rather than pillage and oppress it.

                    Comment


                      An English person with a PhD once referred to me as British. I politely pointed out that I'm Irish and she said, "oh right, I should have said 'from the UK', right?"

                      Honestly. These people don't even know where their country ends. How are they supposed to make a success of Brexit negotiations?

                      Comment


                        Cheers all, good knockabout stuff

                        The issuing your own banknotes thing is obviously absurd. Still, When I return to England from Scotland or Northern Ireland with a handful of local notes, I just put them in the machine in the bank and withdraw some Bank of England notes. It's so simple, even people in Rotherham can do it.

                        Amazing that anyone could mistake M. Pulisov (who I believe lives in Paris after a long spell in Stockholm following his childhood and early adult years in Amsterdam) for anything but a horny-handed son of Cobh.

                        It's a bit rich for people in/ from/ sympathetic to the South* [of Ireland] to gurn about English call centre workers/ PhD students/ whoever being a bit hazy about international borders. You are familiar with the Constitution which codified similar batshit craziness for 60 years?

                        * what pretty much everyone in Northern Ireland calls it, although obviously there's little reason for someone from Genf to know that

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Duncan Gardner View Post
                          It's so simple, even people in Rotherham can do it.
                          I wouldn't go that far...

                          Comment


                            Says the man who trekked to the North Pole to watch mud wrestling...

                            I like Shetland, actually (never been, but following it through the TV crime drama currently).

                            Comment


                              Very enjoyable series as it happens....

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Paul S View Post

                                I wouldn't go that far...
                                Gangster Octopus to thread.

                                Comment


                                  I've got Paul on my ignore list. Or I would've done if I'd ever bothered to have an ignore list...

                                  Comment


                                    To be fair, it was the Sage of Auchtermuchty who first had a dig at the pride of South Yorkshire

                                    Comment


                                      Oi! Wiz just observing that someone at the student loans company (which was Rotherham based) didn't know which country Dublin was part of.

                                      Comment


                                        Having lived in both Dublin and Rotherham, I'd've known. But I now live in Harrow. And don't work in a call-centre...

                                        Comment


                                          Is the right answer...

                                          Comment


                                            Last word on this tangent goes to Rich Hall. "It's a one horse Yorkshire town, but they put the one horse down. Lord, take me back to the 'Ham"

                                            Comment


                                              It's a time-loop that never ends!

                                              http://twitter.com/JenniferMerode/status/1098491440232128512

                                              Comment


                                                Is there anyone over there in the Westminister bubble who has a functioning brain? This man is supposed to be the fucking attorney general.

                                                Comment


                                                  They are all acting in bad faith. It really is very simple.

                                                  Comment

                                                  Working...
                                                  X