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    Also from your article, Nef:-

    "A diplomat from a central European member state said that if Parliament votes against the agreement, "then there is no deal."

    “There is no chance of a renegotiation. It is not the EU27’s problem to solve UK Parliamentary problems, we all have domestic issues,” the diplomat went on to say. “There is no alternative. But it would be much worse for the UK.”


    It's giving unattributed quotes to support both positions.

    Comment


      Originally posted by Nefertiti2 View Post
      "But should Britain’s MPs and the government provide clear backing for a workable proposal based on a different set of red lines, the EU27 would take stock of the new circumstances and would be open to changing the blueprint of the future relationship, senior officials from two European governments said.'
      The six tests effectively narrow the choice to Norway Plus or Remain - if PM Corbyn goes to Brussels, which way does he go?

      Comment


        Originally posted by The Awesome Berbaslug!!! View Post
        It's important to remember that the EU doesn't really distinguish between political parties within countries as much as you'd think. It doesn't matter who is representing the UK govt, it's still going to be a choice of No Deal, this deal, EEA or not brexiting. There's nothing really to negotiate.
        I'm thinking specifically of a couple of things Starmer and Corbyn mention, environmental and labour standards. Something could be added on these, I expect, not likely to be too controversial with EU27. "This has been our intention all along, happy to make clear etc". The sort of thing you might call "clarification" rather than "renegotiation". Treaties get "clarified" all the time.

        If May were to go for that, what would Labour do?
        Last edited by Tubby Isaacs; 30-11-2018, 16:42.

        Comment


          I still don't see how we get to a General Election from here.

          Comment


            Interesting
            https://twitter.com/opendemocracyuk/status/1068519838190993410?s=21

            Civil Disobedience, Lucy.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Tubby Isaacs View Post
              I'm thinking specifically of a couple of things Starmer and Corbyn mention, environmental and labour standards. Something could be added on these, I expect, not likely to be too controversial with EU27. "This has been our intention all along, happy to make clear etc". The sort of thing you might call "clarification" rather than "renegotiation". Treaties get "clarified" all the time.

              If May were to go for that, what would Labour do?
              She’s not going to, so it’s irrelevant.

              Comment


                Originally posted by Lucy Waterman View Post
                I still don't see how we get to a General Election from here.
                EEG made the important point that you can't do Major-style confidence motions anymore. So it's more likely than I thought for a long time. But still can't see it.

                Comment


                  Originally posted by Nefertiti2 View Post
                  She’s not going to, so it’s irrelevant.
                  Probably not, I agree.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Tubby Isaacs View Post
                    EEG made the important point that you can't do Major-style confidence motions anymore. So it's more likely than I thought for a long time. But still can't see it.
                    Well, she's not going to implode her own administration out of a benevolent desire to help Labour.

                    i mean, not twice.

                    Comment


                      What would be the mechanism of getting the ERG-types to vote for her deal, if not a Major confidence vote?

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                        Even when Major did that, 8 MPs didn't support him. She can't even afford that.

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                          Actually 9 MPs who didn't support him.

                          I'm amazed to see Liam Fox wasn't a hardcore anti-Maastricht rebel. Just signed an EDM, then voted with Major.

                          Comment


                            Sky’s Lewis Goodall had a Route to a Corbyn government and is predicting a January election

                            https://twitter.com/redhistorian/status/1068073056621551616?s=21

                            Comment


                              OK, that's interesting. So the key thing is the DUP voting with Labour.

                              I'm struggling to work out how such a minority government could function for even the shortest period of time, mind.
                              Last edited by Lucy Waterman; 30-11-2018, 17:25.

                              Comment


                                How does Labour solve cross border services without some sort of special status for Northern Ireland, if the whole of the UK isn't staying in the Single Market?

                                Comment


                                  They'll be negotiating a whole new deal so it'll be fine.

                                  Comment


                                    "Some Remain option" is a crap formulation. It's not like the EU is going to let the UK equivocate on the terms that it stays in.

                                    Comment


                                      I think he's just euphemizing.

                                      Comment


                                        The DUP may hate the Backstop more than they hate Corbyn, but they can vote against the backstop and simply carry on supporting the tories.

                                        Comment


                                          Could the DUP force a Hard Brexit?

                                          Comment


                                            i) is that a giant poppy in the middle of the GCHQ building? and
                                            II) isn't this basically just a reprise of the end of Edward VIII? Von Ribbentrop said a number of things to Halifax that made it abundantly clear that the King was taking the contents of his conversations with Chamberlain about what was happening at cabinet, and sending Wallis around to the German Embassy to report to their superiors?

                                            Comment


                                              Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View Post
                                              Could the DUP force a Hard Brexit?
                                              The only requirement for a hard brexit is that people don't vote for Theresa May's agreement.

                                              Comment


                                                That poppy is bizarre AF

                                                Comment


                                                  Originally posted by Tubby Isaacs View Post
                                                  "This has been our intention all along, happy to make clear etc". The sort of thing you might call "clarification" rather than "renegotiation". Treaties get "clarified" all the time.

                                                  If May were to go for that, what would Labour do?
                                                  May wouldn't go for that. This is a woman who says "I have been very clear" as often as Blair used to say "Let me tell you this".

                                                  Comment


                                                    Originally posted by The Awesome Berbaslug!!! View Post
                                                    The only requirement for a hard brexit is that people don't vote for Theresa May's agreement.
                                                    This - the Commons literally has to vote for ANY alternative before March 29th if no deal is to be avoided - unless May asks the EU for an Article 50 extension.

                                                    Comment

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