The Brexit Thread

[Kevin S]

She hasn't forgotten them; in fact she mentioned and rejected them - except for (4).

[Tubby Isaacs]

Yeah, but "WE VOTED LEAVE". It just shows how "UNDEMOCRATIC" the EU are. We're the new Greece.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Hmm, Leaving the EU and getting a Canada style FTA would be largely indistinguishable from Sanctions. Leaving the EU without sorting out the Backstop, the money and the Citizens is going to lead to a pretty nasty, but short economic war. How does the UK propose to feed itself?

[Kevin S]

Dig for Victory.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Dig for Victory.

There's not enough Britain.

[Ginger Yellow]

How does the UK propose to feed itself?

[Ginger Yellow]

Tusk responds:

The European Union and its leaders fully respect the UK’s decision expressed in the referendum on leaving the EU. From the very beginning of the negotiations we have been focused on finding a deal that will minimise the damage resulting from Brexit. Also important to us is to create the best possible relations between the EU and the UK in the future. We studied the Chequers proposals in all seriousness. The results of our analysis have been known to the British side in every detail for many weeks. After intensive consultations with Member States, we decided that for the good of the negotiations, and out of respect for the efforts of PM May, we will treat the Chequers plan as a step in the right direction. In Salzburg, right before our meeting I said in a public statement: “I would like to stress that some of Prime Minister May's proposals from Chequers indicate a positive evolution in the UK's approach as well as a will to minimise the negative effects of Brexit. By this I mean, among other things, the readiness to cooperate closely in the area of security and foreign policy. On other issues, such as the Irish question, or the rules of economic cooperation, the UK's proposals will need to be reworked and further negotiated.” The UK stance presented just before and during the Salzburg meeting was surprisingly tough and in fact uncompromising. The response of the EU27 leaders was to reiterate our trust in chief negotiator Michel Barnier and to reiterate our position on the integrity of the Single Market and the Irish backstop. While understanding the logic of the negotiations, I remain convinced that a compromise, good for all, is still possible. I say these words as a close friend of the UK and a true admirer of PM May.

Basically, "Look, we pretended it wasn't a stupid idea to help you out and then you went and ruined it."

[Tubby Isaacs]

https://twitter.com/JamesCleverly/status/1043127107948355587

[San Bernardhinault]

"The ball is now in their court"?

Even I could beat Mr Cleverly at tennis if that's what he thinks.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Have you read the article that I linked to? It makes the argument for why I think that, better than I can. In short, they are opposing the Government in the currently only meaningful way they can - by mocking/disagreeing with May's Chequers approach, then voting against it in the Commons. I can't see what else they can do.

'Brexit' isn't a 'policy' in the same way that any other issue is, which is why it was fucking stupid to have a referendum on it. Saying 'we shouldn't leave the EU' is pointless now - it's been pointless since the day after the Referendum. It's all about how it's done, as far as I can see.

Though, if it wasn't, Starmer's approach is the only viable way (that I can see, and I've asked quite a few folk to, seriously, map out an alternative, to not much response so far) that we can even get to 'Remain' - the Government has to be defeated in the Commons first; the Tories fall, Labour applies for A50 extension (and yes, they should never have 3-line whipped for it in the first place), gets whatever deal it can, and then puts that to the Country, take it or Remain. No Deal not an option.

Right, but it is abundantly clear at this point, that even leaving the Single market and customs union is going to blow a massive fucking hole in the UK economy, crater Govt revenues, and pour several hog lagoons worth of pig shit down on the heads of the millions of economically vulnerable people in the Uk. It would be very easy to simply say that at this point, it is abundantly clear that the promises of the leave side have turned out to be utter nonsense. The Govt are completely incapable of literally anything, let alone negotiating with anyone, and now that we've stared into the nightmarish Economic abyss, we need to have a second referendum. It's time to see what the will of the people is now that everyone is better informed about issues of cake metaphysics.

"The referendum made that decision" makes me think that people who expect labour to change course, and avert disaster are seriously mistaken. He simply doesn't get it. He doesn't realize what is coming. I've been remarkably patient with Corbyn, and cut him a lot of slack given the difficulty of the position of leader of the labour party. But the man is a dangerous idiot. There's a lot of it around. But it's important right now, for the sake of fucking everyone, that the leader of the Labour party isn't a wooly headed fool.

[Patrick Thistle]

I don't know about the Brexit Food Box but I am tempted to buy a gun.

[Toby Gymshorts]

He simply doesn't get it. He doesn't realize what is coming.

Oh, but he does. He must have been told as much.

Fact is, the fucker wants it, which is why he and his Labour Party can fuck right off.

[Nefertiti2]

He’s doing a good job. Starting to talk more about the six tests

https://twitter.com/bbclukewalton/status/1043162187408318466

[San Bernardhinault]

I don't know about the Brexit Food Box but I am tempted to buy a gun.

Are you going to take the UK position literally, and go up to Donald Tusk and say: "I'm about to shoot myself in the nuts! Throw your body in the way to protect me!"

[Benjm]

This is where May's sense of herself as a doughty battler who keeps on going no matter what becomes even more of a liability than it has been so far. Her vanity is colossal.

[Nefertiti2]

Reminder-: the only way Corbyn can make a difference is IF THERE ‘s A LABOUR GOVERNMENT .

Which a number of very powerful wealthy and influential people really don’t want to happen.

Thanks

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Hmm, the only scenario that meets the six tests is full fucking EU membership. It's very late in the day to mention the six tests. We should have been hearing a lot more about this.

[Nefertiti2]

See also

https://twitter.com/dsquareddigest/status/1043189881684611073

[Nefertiti2]

Hmm, the only scenario that meets the six tests is full fucking EU membership. It's very late in the day to mention the six tests. We should have been hearing a lot more about this.

He’s not trying to get your vote though, is he?

[San Bernardhinault]

Hmm, the only scenario that meets the six tests is full fucking EU membership. It's very late in the day to mention the six tests. We should have been hearing a lot more about this.

That's true of 5 of the 6 tests. The 6th one, which is the dog whistle about "fair management of migration" can't really be met by EU membership unless they define "fair" as being free movement of people. Which would be very appealing to me, but would fuck the dog-whistle.

[Toby Gymshorts]

Reminder-: the only way Corbyn can make a difference is IF THERE ‘s A LABOUR GOVERNMENT .

Which a number of very powerful wealthy and influential people really don’t want to happen.

Thanks

First point: true.

Second point: more than likely true.

Counterpoint: Jezza wants us out of the EU anyway and is more than happy to not obstruct, if not enable, that happening.

Thanks

[Nefertiti2]

Hmm, the only scenario that meets the six tests is full fucking EU membership. It's very late in the day to mention the six tests. We should have been hearing a lot more about this.

First point: true.

Second point: more than likely true.

Counterpoint: Jezza wants us out of the EU anyway and is more than happy to not obstruct, if not enable, that happening.

Thanks

You know that how?

[Nefertiti2]

I know people who call him “ Jezza “ like to assert this ( especially if they have FBPE in their twitter handle) but It seems to me the key thing is that Keir Starmer is in post. things are starting to turn. It must be clear to the EU that Starmer is going to be a feasible negotiating partner and that corbyn reforms would being Britain back to the same status as a German Christian Democratic Bundesland.

[Toby Gymshorts]

His opposition to the EU is longstanding, and of record.

His inaction on trying to represent Labour remainers (i.e. erm, me, for example) is longstanding, and of record.

He couldn't give less of a shit, Nef. If he did, he'd be standing across the aisle giving it with both barrels. He's not.

[Toby Gymshorts]

I know people who call him “ Jezza “ like to assert this ( especially if they have FBPE in their twitter handle)

I'm not one of those. Care to expand?

Corbyn reforms would being Britain back to the same status as a German Christian Democratic Bundesland.

I don't know what you mean by that but it really doesn't read well.