The Brexit Thread

[Tubby Isaacs]

Who's criticizing Labour MPs? Well, apart from the Kippers that'll vote with the government, of course.

The point I'm making is the likelihood of the government falling before Brexit's a done deal.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Not particularly likely, as I see it.

[Snake Plissken]

Nah, it was a comment that some Labour MPs would rather cause trouble for Corbyn than for the Government.

Anyway, in the absence of us putting anything forward.

https://twitter.com/adampayne26/status/968556166149177345

There was also a comment from an FT journalist that said David Davies had yet to travel to Brussels this year. That I find both easy and hard to believe.

[Lang Spoon]

Eight Tories are supposedly confirmed to be voting in favour of the (a, I guess) customs union amendment. Which might be fewer than the Labour MPs who would vote against it.

The Ruth Davidson for First Minister and No Second Independence Referendum Party have been all very quiet about this, even if Labour are pretty much offering what fucking Davidson wanted till she didn’t. Standing up for Scotland indeed. 3 or 4 of her crack Westminster team have of course backed that letter and revealed themselves to be Hard Right Bastards. She can’t even control those fannies, but is of course a strategic genius to awe struck Sensibles everywhere. I hope the NE of Scotland is happy they kicked Salmond and Robertson and co out now.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

That EU proposal has been obviously coming for quite a while. The UK govt is not going to like this, but as far as the EU is concerned, the UK has already agreed to this.

[Nefertiti2]

And the job losses continue

https://twitter.com/remain_central/status/968558866073030657

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

that's as likely to be about Ryanair and the Scottish Govt having a row over landing charges as much as anything else.

[Ginger Yellow]

That EU proposal has been obviously coming for quite a while. The UK govt is not going to like this, but as far as the EU is concerned, the UK has already agreed to this.

I mean, unless you're the DUP, it's better (from a Brexiter perspective) than the only other alternative, which is a common regulatory area for the the whole of the UK and Ireland.

[Lang Spoon]

That’s why they are either illiterate or bluffing bastards considering what they signed up to in December. Doubtless the Johnson/Gove/Mogg cabal are whispering No Deal into Theresa’s ear. It’s the only way their ideology can come through this.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Hmm, what will be the impact of breaking an international agreement (effectively with the EU) on their efforts to strike international trade deals? What would the word of the UK govt be worth then?

[Lang Spoon]

that's as likely to be about Ryanair and the Scottish Govt having a row over landing charges as much as anything else.

Yeah, they have another dig about APD when justifying killing the hub. Edinburgh is booming and getting boomier, now the only true international (maybe barring transatlantic) airport in Scotland. Chief beneficiary of Ryanair GLA rerouting. With a half arsed rail/tram link like a real city and everything. Glasgow just about at 10 mil, EDI at getting on 14 and looking all set for twenty in a decade. But was the ugly sister to Glasgow a decade back. Don’t think it would matter as such if there was a link to Tram/train interchanges direct from Glasgow Queen St to Edinburgh Gateway. Also Embra airport has too small a growth footprint. If Glasgow went it couldn’t take the slack without resembling Hell.

[Lang Spoon]

Now the Holyrood Presiding Officer (speaker, SLab of course) has ruled the Brexit Continuity bill as outwith the Statelet’s powers. Despite much the same bill being presented to the far less powerful Welsh Assembly without issue. And the Lord Advocate approving it. Bring on the constitutional bondoogle. And hopefully the resignation of MacIntosh the sub Jim Murphy bam.

[Ginger Yellow]

EC publishes its withdrawal treaty proposal. May rejects it, unsurprisingly. The DUP must love this:

1. The provisions of Union law on goods listed in Annex 2.1 to this Protocol shall apply to and in the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland.
2. Customs legislation as defined in point (2) of Article 5 of Regulation (EU) No 952/2013 of the European Parliament and of the Council138 as well as other provisions of Union law providing for customs controls of specific goods or for specific purposes listed in Annex 3 to this Protocol shall apply to and in the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland. The territory of Northern Ireland, excluding the territorial waters of the United Kingdom (the "territory of Northern Ireland"), shall be considered to be part of the customs territory of the Union.
3. Customs duties on imports and exports, and any charges having equivalent effect, shall be prohibited between the Union and the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland. This prohibition shall also apply to customs duties of a fiscal nature.
4. Quantitative restrictions on imports and exports and all measures having equivalent effect shall be prohibited between the Union and the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland.
138 Regulation (EU) No 952/2013 of the European Parliament and of the Council of 9 October 2013 laying down the Union Customs Code (OJ L 269, 10.10.2013, p. 1).
5. The Union and the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland shall not impose, directly or indirectly, on the products of the other party any internal taxation of any kind in excess of that imposed directly or indirectly on similar domestic products. Furthermore, the Union and the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland shall not impose on the products of the other party any internal taxation of such a nature as to afford indirect protection to other products.
6. Paragraph 4 shall be without prejudice to the possibility for the United Kingdom, a Member State or the Union to take measures to prohibit or restrict the making available on its market of a good, or a category of goods, where and to the extent permitted by Union law. Such prohibitions or restrictions shall not, however, constitute a means of arbitrary discrimination or a disguised restriction on trade between the Union and Northern Ireland.
7. For the purposes of the customs legislation and the provisions of Union law listed in Annex 2.2 to this Protocol, the United Kingdom customs authorities competent for the territory of Northern Ireland shall be considered as customs authorities within the meaning of point (1) of Article 5 of Regulation (EU) No 952/2013. By way of derogation from Section 7 of Chapter 2 of Title I of Regulation (EU) No 952/2013, customs controls as defined in point (3) of Article 5 of that Regulation shall be carried out jointly by the Union and the United Kingdom customs authorities competent for the territory of Northern Ireland. The Union and the United Kingdom shall determine the practical arrangements for carrying out such controls in accordance with paragraph 10.
8. The provisions of Union law on value added tax listed in Annex 2.3 to this Protocol concerning goods shall apply to and in the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland.
9. The provisions of Union law on excise duties listed in Annex 2.4 to this Protocol shall apply to and in the United Kingdom in respect of Northern Ireland.
10. Specific arrangements for the proper implementation of this Article shall be determined by the Joint Committee, upon proposal from the Specialised Committee. Those specific arrangements may, as appropriate, include a mechanism for revenue collection and distribution.

...

1. As regards Chapter III, the institutions, bodies, offices, and agencies of the Union shall in relation to the United Kingdom, and natural and legal persons residing or established in the territory of the United Kingdom, have the powers conferred upon them by Union law. In particular, the Court of Justice of the European Union shall have jurisdiction as provided for in the Treaties in this respect. 2. Acts of the institutions, bodies, offices, and agencies adopted in accordance with paragraph 1 shall produce in respect of and in the United Kingdom the same legal effects as those which they produce within the Union and its Member States.

Full text here.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Does that last bit in the quote mean that the ECJ will have jurisdiction over northern Ireland? There is no way they can accept this. But if they don't it's not going to go well.

[Snake Plissken]

Thornberry had an Urgent Question for Johnson after his comments yesterday. He chickened out.

Also, wonder what the gammons on the Costa Del Sol think of this one?

https://twitter.com/StevePeers/status/968819130991370245

[ad hoc]

Well presumably they are happy in Spain and have no great desire to move to any other EU state. It's people who might want to move around a bit in the EU who are fucked. Me, for example.

[Ginger Yellow]

I mean, of course it won't. This is the withdrawal agreement. EU citizens won't have free movement to the UK either under it. Any intra-EU free movement of UK citizens will only come with the trade agreement.

[Etienne]

I can't imagine anyone is going to be persuaded, but John Major's done a good speech and Q&A here. Odd to remember how ineffective he was as a PM when he now seems a political titan to the current crop of Tories.

[E10 Rifle]

wonder what the gammons on the Costa Del Sol think of this one?

What does "gammon" mean in modern political parlance? I've come across it a fair bit but not being one of those Energised Politicised Young People, that they have now, have no idea what it means.

[Furtho]

It was written at the start of February so apologies if it’s already made an appearance on this thread, but the LSE’s Brexit blog features this interesting piece, We Don’t Exist To Them, Do We?: Why Working Class People Voted For Brexit.

[Flynnie]

What does "gammon" mean in modern political parlance? I've come across it a fair bit but not being one of those Energised Politicised Young People, that they have now, have no idea what it means.

It's a beaut, means the old, red, face like a slapped arse because of the booze white fellas who yells in the pub about how Brexit is taking back control innit.

https://twitter.com/Errol_Flynn_/sta...20404909789184

edit: send SOS to Tubby, can't embed tweet

[johnr]

It's a beaut, means the old, red, face like a slapped arse because of the booze white fellas who yells in the pub about how Brexit is taking back control innit.

https://twitter.com/Errol_Flynn_/sta...20404909789184

edit: send SOS to Tubby, can't embed tweet

It is very good - often applied to those ranting twats that you get on Question Time - with my only caveat being that all except the last bit also applies to me...

There's a fella on Twitter who uses it a lot, but has started to wonder whether - as it's only used to describe white people - it's racist.

[E10 Rifle]

I can see how it might be seen as a bit snobby and sneery. You're always heading into iffy territory when your piss-take of people is based on what they look like rather than what they say.

[Nefertiti2]

I can't imagine anyone is going to be persuaded, but John Major's done a good speech and Q&A here. Odd to remember how ineffective he was as a PM when he now seems a political titan to the current crop of Tories.

One reason he was so ineffective was the "bastards" as he called them, who were using their opposition to the EU to thwart him at every turn.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Well presumably they are happy in Spain and have no great desire to move to any other EU state. It's people who might want to move around a bit in the EU who are fucked. Me, for example.

Surely you must be eligible for an EU passport by now if push comes to shove? you've got to tick the box for literally every conceivable citizenship requirement by now?