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    I'm in Mount Dora today, which has a reputation as quite laidback and gay friendly, yet we have cars whizzing past with large Trump flags on them and the usual death cult quota of Trump signs in front yards.

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      Well, you learn something new every day. I would never have imagined there was a town called Mount Anything in Florida.

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        Zephyrhills is a big deal in Florida bottled water, and it's all of 95 feet above sea level.

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          https://twitter.com/Steve_Rich100/status/1302582184721645574?s=20

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            "Mount Anything in Florida" sounds like a logline for the latest Mar-a-Lago advertisement

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              Originally posted by Snake Plissken View Post
              Stop it.

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                Mount Dora is 184 feet above sea level, which is high by Florida standards.

                We drove home today via Lake County down Highway 27, which has some of Florida's highest points, being situated on the Lake Wales Ridge, but even these max out at 345 feet.

                https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...highest_points

                Mount Dora is a beautiful place but has a shameful history of moving its black population from downtown to the eastern fringe.

                https://www.mountdorabuzz.com/who-kn...f%20the%20land.

                The best church I saw on this weekend's trip was this building from 1906 in Gainesville (Mount Pleasant United Methodist, originally a wooden building for freed slaves, rebuilt after a fire):

                http://www.explorehistoricalachuacou...hodist-church/

                Last November a white Georgia teenager was arrested for planning a knife attack on a historic black church in Gainesville:

                https://www.gainesvilletimes.com/new...el-ame-church/
                Last edited by Satchmo Distel; 06-09-2020, 19:24.

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                  Donald has gone all Gore Vidal...https://twitter.com/rabrowne75/statu...38895806992384

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                    Bit off-message for him. He's starting to lose his touch.

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                      This and his criticism of the Iraq war during the last election are exactly the kind of things that will get him more support, especially against an old Washington insider like Biden. It's entirely in keeping with the Qanon nonsense too. What on earth were the Democrats thinking when they picked Biden?

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                        How on earth will it win him more support? Who is going to switch their vote, or go out to vote for Trump, because of this? The only Trumpy people who are in favour of this sort of thing are the very fringe QAnon types who were already all in for him. Left wing peacenik types who've been screaming this for decades are not suddenly going to believe that a Republican government is going to be anti-war, nor that it will forgive Trump's million other abominations.

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                          It'll be interesting to see if/how Biden responds to this.

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                            Originally posted by San Bernardhinault View Post
                            How on earth will it win him more support? Who is going to switch their vote, or go out to vote for Trump, because of this? The only Trumpy people who are in favour of this sort of thing are the very fringe QAnon types who were already all in for him. Left wing peacenik types who've been screaming this for decades are not suddenly going to believe that a Republican government is going to be anti-war, nor that it will forgive Trump's million other abominations.
                            There's more to the electorate than lefty peaceniks and Qanon nutters. Plenty of libertarian types that came out for him last time but weren't looking like voting this time.

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                              Originally posted by San Bernardhinault View Post
                              How on earth will it win him more support? Who is going to switch their vote, or go out to vote for Trump, because of this? The only Trumpy people who are in favour of this sort of thing are the very fringe QAnon types who were already all in for him. Left wing peacenik types who've been screaming this for decades are not suddenly going to believe that a Republican government is going to be anti-war, nor that it will forgive Trump's million other abominations.
                              In 2016 Libertarian candidate Gary Johnson received 4,489,233 total votes and 3.27% of the national vote,

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                                Originally posted by Nefertiti2 View Post

                                In 2016 Libertarian candidate Gary Johnson received 4,489,233 total votes and 3.27% of the national vote,
                                In 2012 Johnson polled 1,275,971 votes, just under 1%. In 2008, the libertarians won about half a million votes and half of a percentage; it seems that the Libertarian Party serves as a RW protest vote sink. When the Republicans run a tolerable candidate, the Libertarians are fairly irrelevant. When the Republicans select a horrorshow candidate, the votes go to the Libertarians.

                                So it seems Trump 2016 turned off a significant portion of right wing libertarians. If he hadn't been so horrible he might have won the popular vote as well as the college vote.

                                The crucial question is, has he done anything over the last four years to make them warm to him?

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                                  Stirring up racial tensions is always a popular choice with college libertarians

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                                    Originally posted by Lurgee View Post

                                    The crucial question is, has he done anything over the last four years to make them warm to him?
                                    I was positing that was why he might have railed against the generals starting wars "to boost the profits of defense contractors"

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                                      I seem to recall Greens hurting HRC in key states was a bigger factor than Libertarians taking Trump votes in 2016. Trump is surely more likely to focus on getting his rabid base out, which might conflict with attracting Libertarians.

                                      Trump is simply venting at Generals whom he perceives to be against him. I don't think he has a coherent policy regarding the military-industrial complex.
                                      Last edited by Satchmo Distel; 08-09-2020, 09:50.

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                                        Out of curiosity, I looked up a few swing state results from 2016:

                                        Florida
                                        Gary Johnson 2.20%, Jill Stein 0.68%

                                        Michigan
                                        Gary Johnson 3.59%, Jill Stein 1.07%

                                        Ohio
                                        Gary Johnson 3.17%, Jill Stein 0.84%

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                                          Woodward's new book might be another nail in the Trump coffin, and he has the recordings to prove it when Trump starts denying it. Clips here.

                                          (CNN...cuz it's not paywalled...)

                                          https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/09/polit...rus/index.html

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                                            You are funny

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                                              I can already see the scales falling from eyes all across white middle America. Mark my words....

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                                                Originally posted by WOM View Post
                                                Woodward's new book might be another nail in the Trump coffin, and he has the recordings to prove it when Trump starts denying it. Clips here.

                                                (CNN...cuz it's not paywalled...)

                                                https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/09/polit...rus/index.html
                                                So for 7 months Woodward had this interview but decided not to mention it because book sales.

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                                                  Or rather, timing it for maximum effect. I'm sure it could be debated all day.

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                                                    Let's be honest....of all the people who 'have known' and not spoken up, Woodward isn't really the culprit. He's written two books in two years on Trump's incompetency.

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