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    #26
    He'd roll over in his grave...

    WOM wrote: I really wish one of you would break down and explain what's disrespectful about any of it. I mean, Frank Underwood pissing on his father's headstone...that was meant as a sign of disrespect. And a pointed one at that. But making out or playing frisbee golf or otherwise enjoy life?
    There's a cemetery in Los Angeles that does outdoor movie screenings and concerts. People aren't actually sitting on the graves, it's on a lawn that will someday presumably be filled with plots, but isn't now.

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      #27
      He'd roll over in his grave...

      WOM wrote: I really wish one of you would break down and explain what's disrespectful about any of it. I mean, Frank Underwood pissing on his father's headstone...that was meant as a sign of disrespect. And a pointed one at that. But making out or playing frisbee golf or otherwise enjoy life?
      I'm going to stipulate that my grave has an iPod/phone charging dock, a marble mirrored surface, a little shelf for poppers and a "stretching bar".

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        #28
        He'd roll over in his grave...

        Actually, I'd like a verse carved in a tiny text, so if you step forward to read it, you get squirted with water.

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          #29
          He'd roll over in his grave...

          Toronto's Mount Pleasant Cemetery is also a horticultural ...uh...preserve, I guess. It has at least one example of everything that can be grown in our climatic zones (5 and 6).

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            #30
            He'd roll over in his grave...

            Haha, cute MsD. I rather like the idea of mine being booby-trapped too, perhaps with a tilting slab to give the unwary the horrifying sense of being tipped inside. I rather more seriousness, I like the idea of it being a mini horticultural preserve too; I'd feel disrespected only if no-one grew something beautiful on me. Would be nice to know all those nutrients were being recycled into something like that.

            Thanks for clearing my previous confusion up WOM. I am as lacking in clued-upness about exercise as I am about other recreational pursuits, it would seem.

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              #31
              He'd roll over in his grave...

              WOM wrote: I really wish one of you would break down and explain what's disrespectful about any of it. I mean, Frank Underwood pissing on his father's headstone...that was meant as a sign of disrespect. And a pointed one at that. But making out or playing frisbee golf or otherwise enjoy life?
              Well for the families of those interred the cemetery's a memorial. One the provides a connection to deceased relatives, including parents and, sometimes, children.

              I wouldn't ask, or expect, my children to bury my remains in such a fashion. But, as a member of a community, I'm willing to honour the wishes of others that do. I show that by behaving in a restrained and modest manner when I'm present. Just as, if I'm in a church, I'm not about to start bawling Born to be Wild at the top of my lungs, or do push-ups in front of the altar.

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                #32
                He'd roll over in his grave...

                I totally hear what you're saying, Amor. And it's not like I don't get the idea on the face of it, of course. But, to me, it falls apart pretty easily when you ask 'how are you disrespecting people?'

                Are you insulting any of these people's spirit? Or their memory? Is there intent or purpose? Is it symbolic in any way, like the tipping over of Jewish headstones? I don't see how you could be.

                Church is a communal activity with living people, gathering under a shared set of beliefs, standards and expectations. I don't know if the comparison works.

                It feels more like an artificial 'manners' sort of thing, and I don't have a lot of time for that at the best of times.

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                  #33
                  He'd roll over in his grave...

                  Church is a communal activity with living people, gathering under a shared set of beliefs, standards and expectations. I don't know if the comparison works.

                  The cemetery is also about living people, the relatives of those buried there. The dead are always with us, as the cliché goes and, like most clichés, it's true.

                  Memorial and ritual around death are a huge part of every human society that's ever existed. They may vary by culture and individual but they evidently matter and have meaning. Next Thursday my sister and I will be scattering our parents ashes beside a lake in Cumbria. It's a private ritual. Neither of us has been there, but they described the place pretty exactly. I hope some guy in spandex isn't doing warm-downs when we get there. If he is we'll have to wait until he's finished. If they'd been buried I'd like to think we wouldn't have to worry about that.

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                    #34
                    He'd roll over in his grave...

                    Would it be fair to say respect, in this case, simply means decorum?

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                      #35
                      He'd roll over in his grave...

                      That seems unduly reductive. One can, of course, be disrespectfully decorous.

                      (observe OTF's sometime favourite novel, The Good Soldier Švejk)

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                        #36
                        He'd roll over in his grave...

                        Yeah, it'll do though.

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                          #37
                          He'd roll over in his grave...

                          When you live next door to a cemetery when you're a child, you tend to view it as an extension of the garden; i.e. somewhere to play.

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                            #38
                            He'd roll over in his grave...

                            One of the most popular parks in the bit of town I live in is a redesignated cemetery, in which the last person was buried about 100 years ago. It was officially declared so about 20 years ago and nobody complained.

                            I wouldn't go there because it's full of slackliners, bongo players and other sorts I'm not all that fond of, but not because it used to be a cemetery.

                            In the biggest active cemetery in town, you're allowed to cycle (it's the biggest cemetery in Europe, and it would take you all day to walk from one end to the other), but they draw the line at skaters, skateboarders or windskaters

                            You're not allowed to unpack your hard-boiled eggs and sausage rolls (crikey!) wherever you like, but there ARE designated picnic areas.

                            I know it's not the same thing, but I once saw the Angelic Upstarts in what used to be a church. Nobody said a dicky bird about punk rockers besmirching Our Lord's front room (well, at least nobody who was at the 'gig' did).

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                              #39
                              He'd roll over in his grave...

                              You'd think there'd be enough open spaces in this fair isle without folk feeling the necessity to fit in their push-ups between the headstones.

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                                #40
                                He'd roll over in his grave...

                                treibeis wrote:
                                I know it's not the same thing, but I once saw the Angelic Upstarts in what used to be a church. Nobody said a dicky bird about punk rockers besmirching Our Lord's front room (well, at least nobody who was at the 'gig' did).
                                Speaking of the Angelic Upstarts - you'll like this - I am currently mediating between their singer and an acquaintance of mine who insulted him at the weekend (in absentia) and pushed their merchandising guy in the back.

                                I have to tell the acquaintance that Mensi is going to take his hat off him and give it back to Yogi Bear.

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                                  #41
                                  He'd roll over in his grave...

                                  Fucking hell, I'm glad I got out of England when I did. There's obviously a raw wind a-blowin' nowadays that simply didn't exist when I lived there.

                                  I heard that Mensi picks his nose and eats it, but I think that's just silly talk.

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                                    #42
                                    He'd roll over in his grave...

                                    Steady.

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                                      #43
                                      He'd roll over in his grave...

                                      How does he manage to eat his nose?

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                                        #44
                                        He'd roll over in his grave...

                                        As I said, things have obviously changed a lot in the last 25 years. In my day, Geordie punk rockers never ate their own appendages. It simply wouldn't have occurred to them.

                                        By the way, Stinky Turner eats his peas off his knife.

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                                          #45
                                          He'd roll over in his grave...

                                          *Unpleasantness alert*

                                          I seem to remember an interview with Garbage's Shirley Manson in which she described former Exploited guitarist Big John Duncan eating his own faeces while they were both on tour with Goodbye Mr Mackenzie. Yer man described how he couldn't 'get anywhere' with said waste as, obviously, it had already been broken down to its optimum level. Or something.

                                          Apologies. Enjoy your lunch.

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