D-Day, 1971

[ursus arctos]

What with Gronk, sounds like you are on a voyage of discovery tonight

[Various Artist]

Every time there's a joke about weight in American comedies I have to stop and work it out. "No ice cream for me, I'm on a diet" - "You're 83 pounds!" (laughter). Or 73, or 103, I dunno. Same thing on chat shows.

Curiously, as in so many things I have US professional wrestling to thank for enabling me to be able to parse such descriptions mentally. I'm so used to a wrestler of a certain size weighing c.220lbs, or c.300lbs, I can picture it roughly now in another context without having to mentally convert first.

If I do want a better idea though I generally just go straight to 10 stones = 140lbs or 20st = 280lbs first, then add on or subtract the remainder – e.g. 158lbs say is 11st 4lbs (10 stone + 18lb), or 269lbs is 19st 3 (20st - 11).

Overall though I can never quite work out why the USA regards the idea of stones-and-pounds as being so hilariously weird, let alone progressing to the idea of going metric. The comparison that always immediately springs to mind is that if you ask an American their weight and height they'd never dream of telling you "I weigh 160 pounds and I'm 73 inches tall." Since it obviously makes sense to use feet instead of just yards and inches, why is using stones as well as pounds and ounces so iniquitous?

[ursus arctos]

It is because we think that you all have piles of 14lb stones in your bathrooms

[tee rex]

The phrase "seven stone weakling" was used in the Charles Atlas body-building ads (UK version), which were a common sight when I was a kid.

Atlas was American and a quick search suggests that this was a translation from the original "97 pounds". So British weaklings had already gained an extra pound, maybe from jam roly-poly and spotted dicks.

[jwdd27]

The phrase "seven stone weakling" was used in the Charles Atlas body-building ads (UK version), which were a common sight when I was a kid.

Atlas was American and a quick search suggests that this was a translation from the original "97 pounds". So British weaklings had already gained an extra pound, maybe from jam roly-poly and spotted dicks.

I remember learning that Davy Jones dodged the Vietnam draft by slimming down to 99lbs, comfortably under the 104 limit.

[Sporting]

What with Gronk, sounds like you are on a voyage of discovery tonight

Speaking of voyages, why is a nautical mile different from a land-based one?

[ursus arctos]

Because it is defined as the distance needed to cover one minute of latitude, a concept that had yet to be fixed when the statute mile (based in distance along a flat surface) was defined.

[gjw100]

Sorry to digress from the thread subject, but yesterday's post by slackster about spending his sister's commemorative decimal coin in the sweetshop reminded me of a painful incident from my childhood, although this involved the old half-crown. To set the scene, my junior school class had been studying Longfellow's 'Hiawatha' and it happened, quite coincidentally, that I had just been given a picture book version. I took the book in to show my teacher and she liked it so much that she asked if she could buy it to use in lessons. I reported this back to my mum, but to my dismay she said that I shouldn't sell it but give it to the teacher instead. Of course she promised to buy me a replacement, but already wise to the ways of adults and their unkept promises, I figured that might not happen and objected to her suggestion. My tearful protests were overruled and I was sent in the next day with the book and firm instructions to hand it over. Showing a degree of duplicity I'm surprised that I possessed, I decided to tell the teacher that she could have the book for half a crown, which she duly handed over. At this point I realised that if I came home with the money I would be rumbled, so reasoned that I would have to spend it. Not that I would have chosen anywhere else, but the local newsagent was the only shop on my route back from school, so I stopped off there and blew the lot. Arriving home, cheeks bulging with bubble-gum and pockets similarly stuffed with the accompanying cards and bags of sweets, my criminal master plan unravelled with a swiftness that I really ought to have foreseen. Result - half a crown back to the teacher with an apology, no pocket money for weeks after and no replacement book. Seeing my original book used in the lesson that week was an extra twist of the knife.

[Nefertiti2]

Then the noble gjw
had to forego his feasting.
saw no longer Hiawatha
nor the lovely Minnehaha.

[Eggchaser]

Today, I am two separate gorillas.

[Muukalainen]

I'll bet! Kind of like silver three-penny bits, that would turn up once every Preston Guild.

Christmas, that's a saying I haven't heard in a very long time. Quite possibly the last person I did hear say that would have been my grandfather, and he died back in 1987.

Reading through this thread, I realise that I've forgotten more about the event than I can remember about it. I was 11 at the time and can certainly remember the seemingly endless old money to new money conversion maths lessons we did in the run up to decimalisation, but The Scaffold's involvement I do not recall at all, despite Lily the Pink being firmly entrenched in my memory. I do recall the effects of decimalisation on inflation, with pretty much every shop bumping up prices. It spelled the death knell for the eight-a-penny chew, they becoming penny chews seemingly overnight.

There were Crowns (5/-) of course, just not in general circulation.

I vaguely remember my uncle having a crown coin, back in the mid-sixties. It was quite a bit bigger and heavier than the half a crown, and probably no longer legal tender when he had it.

[Muukalainen]

How about the saying -- to describe footballers who can't head the ball properly -- "(s)he's got a head like a thruppeny bit". This has long since survived decimalisation, is it still in common use?

[ad hoc]

Turning on a sixpence outlasted it.

Isn't "thruppenny bits" also rhyming slang for tits?

[treibeis]

How about the saying -- to describe footballers who can't head the ball properly -- "(s)he's got a head like a thruppeny bit". This has long since survived decimalisation, is it still in common use?

I can remember being told I had a "head like a fifty-pence piece" in the early 1980s.

[Capybara]

I vaguely remember my uncle having a crown coin, back in the mid-sixties. It was quite a bit bigger and heavier than the half a crown, and probably no longer legal tender when he had it.

They minted commemorative crowns in 1965 when Churchill pegged it. Loads of kids, including me, were given one for Christmas that year. I remember them as being legal tender but you didn't spend them because 'it might be worth something' in a few years. But there were so many of the things I doubt if they were ever worth more than five bob.

[Gangster Octopus]

It was a Churchill crown that I spent in Woolies.

[Jah Womble]

I remember learning that Davy Jones dodged the Vietnam draft by slimming down to 99lbs, comfortably under the 104 limit.

Would he not have escaped anyway by not being a US citizen?

[Walt Flanagans Dog]

They minted commemorative crowns in 1965 when Churchill pegged it. Loads of kids, including me, were given one for Christmas that year. I remember them as being legal tender but you didn't spend them because 'it might be worth something' in a few years. But there were so many of the things I doubt if they were ever worth more than five bob.

We got a coin given at school in a presentation case for the Silver Jubilee in 1977. Apparently this was a crown, and in looking it up to check I found this further confusion:

To further complicate its history, in 1990 the crown was re-tariffed from 25 pence to five pounds, with versions minted in gold. Today then, Crowns have a legal tender face value of ?5, though their real numismatic and precious metal bullion value will be far higher.

[sw2borshch]

How about the saying -- to describe footballers who can't head the ball properly -- "(s)he's got a head like a thruppeny bit". This has long since survived decimalisation, is it still in common use?

Fifty pence head is still Boro football slang, I believe Scousers refer to ten bob heads, neatly straddling the decimalisation factions.

[sw2borshch]

[sw2borshch]

There must be a better way to link to BBC Sounds, but this is a fantastic hour of radio.

[Various Artist]

Today I've learned something: Muuk is not Finnish. At least, I presume not, after all the above reminiscences on UK decimalisation, Lily The Pink, etc.


"Turn on a sixpence" must be the only pre-decimal slang that I – not born until nearly a decade into the new-money era – have in my own vocabulary. I used to get called a "daft ha'porth" occasionally by my parents when I was little, which puzzled me for years until I found out what a 'darf tapeth' ('Darth Tapeth'?) was, but I don't think I've ever felt need to use that one myself.

I feel like the inherent worth of the half-crown was something I grew to understand perfectly while growing up however, despite obviously never having had cause to use or perhaps even see one. For that I have to primarily thank the William books – for William Brown receiving half a crown was always a rare delight, and its chunkily satisfying weight and how it made the recipient feel rich was something that was always vividly conveyed.

[Various Artist]

There must be a better way to link to BBC Sounds, but this is a fantastic hour of radio.

If you tap the 'More' button there in the app with its '...' symbol, there should be a 'share episode' option that will let you copy and paste the link.

Here's the link to the desktop version of it, anyway:

Decimal Day - What's That in Old Money?
Archive on 4
4 Extra Debut. Peter Day investigates the events surrounding Britain's currency going decimal in 1971, and its everyday impact. From February 2011.

[Nocturnal Submission]

Today I've learned something: Muuk is not Finnish. At least, I presume not, after all the above reminiscences on UK decimalisation, Lily The Pink, etc.


"Turn on a sixpence" must be the only pre-decimal slang that I – not born until nearly a decade into the new-money era – have in my own vocabulary. I used to get called a "daft ha'porth" occasionally by my parents when I was little, which puzzled me for years until I found out what a 'darf tapeth' ('Darth Tapeth'?) was, but I don't think I've ever felt need to use that one myself.

"Spend a penny"? "Bent as a nine-bob note"?

[sw2borshch]

If you tap the 'More' button there in the app with its '...' symbol, there should be a 'share episode' option that will let you copy and paste the link.

Here's the link to the desktop version of it, anyway:

Decimal Day - What's That in Old Money?
Archive on 4
4 Extra Debut. Peter Day investigates the events surrounding Britain's currency going decimal in 1971, and its everyday impact. From February 2011.

I get lots of options to email, tweet, WhatsApp it etc., but not a copy and paste one, sadly.