CDU leadership election

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

There are German electric suv's. What are they at?

my sister and her partner have an electric golf, or an id3 if you prefer. They're pretty slick, and I've been watching sandy munro tear apart the id4 suv and it apparently compares well to tesla in most respects. Being caught in that emissions scandal seems to have been a blessing for vw as part of their penance was to throw embarrassment money at electric vehicles, and now they miles ahead of other traditional carmakers

[treibeis]

There are German electric suv's. What are they at?

my sister and her partner have an electric golf, or an id3 if you prefer. They're pretty slick, and I've been watching sandy munro tear apart the id4 suv and it apparently compares well to tesla in most respects

You sound like an urban German Green.

[Discordant Resonance]

Irish politics have always bemused me, but how can any Left be virulently anti tax?

They're the only left-wing parties in Europe to oppose property and water taxes, even though in the case of the former, the rates rise progressively in line with house valuation bands, and the latter had been planned to be calculated according to usage, until they were scrapped.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

I'm just amused that if they want to have a fancy German car, that they don't have a fancy german electric car.

[ursus arctos]

They're the only left-wing parties in Europe to oppose property and water taxes, even though in the case of the former, the rates rise progressively in line with house valuation bands, and the latter had been planned to be calculated according to usage, until they were scrapped.

Can you please identify what parties you are talking about?

It is really weird that you and Berba haven't done so.

[Lang Spoon]

Sinn Fein and PBP I'm guessing.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

They're the only left-wing parties in Europe to oppose property and water taxes, even though in the case of the former, the rates rise progressively in line with house valuation bands, and the latter had been planned to be calculated according to usage, until they were scrapped.

Yeah, they're also opposed to any income tax rises. Sinn fein went into the last election offering tax cuts for everyone up to €100k, but they're just an astonishingly dishonest populist party who are only telling us what we desperately want to hear, and the AAA PBP basically are trying to bring about the revolution by precipitating the collapse of capitalism by making the next economic collapse worse than the last. They've also got their fair share of narcissists who want to sound virtuous by making impossible promises that they'll never have to keep.

They should really teach more about clientelist theory (if it exists) in universities. We are doing so much experimental work here and no-one is paying any attention. All we want is to pay no tax, and feel righteous while doing it, so we say that parties that want to slash the govts share of the economy are "left wing".

But opposition to taxation is a hallmark of the anti-austerity left across europe. I don't think anyone should have been surprised when john mcDonnell promised not to raise tax on anyone earning less than £80k, which is 95% of the uk population. MMT really is the bullshit rocket fuel that allows you to sound virtuous by offering spending rises, without the necessary rises in taxation. I'd love to know if it originated in a Koch funded think tank, or in the GRU, or if there's any differenct because it's a fatal virus for social democracy.

[DCI Harry Batt]

I thought Sinn Fein were definitely not of the left? I lose track.

[Lang Spoon]

McDonnell wasn't MMT though was he? He was just as shit scared as any other Brit party of fucking affluent pensioners, buy to let landlords and anyone else self defining as working class/squeezed middle while making a whack of money.

[DCI Harry Batt]

(I do find the idea that a left party should support water charges a bit odd, tbh)

[Lang Spoon]

I don't see why water charges shouldn't be folded into property tax or any other way of taxing for local services.

[Discordant Resonance]

(I do find the idea that a left party should support water charges a bit odd, tbh)

Not so odd if on the basis of the "polluter pays" principle delivering environmental efficiency, and the utility remaining in State ownership.

[DCI Harry Batt]

It's an interesting way of saying "economic rationing of water". Again, I don't see why anyone would expect a left party to be in favour.

[Hot Pepsi]

The aspirational politicians I went to school with were reliably among the worst people there

And those who actually went on to political careers were reliably among the more disagreeable of that group

That was what I suspected but hoped wasn't quite as true as the stereotype.

That was why I didn't like Bill Clinton from the start. He just reminded me so much of all the people who ran for student government just because it would help them get into law school. (I can speak for all US institutions, but in every one I'm familiar with, the student government exists almost entirely to have meetings and has a negligible impact on anything of substance. At least in high school, they get to plan the prom.)

It always feels like the best leaders are the ones that don't want to be leaders until they have no choice but to step up. Like Joan of Arc. Or Aragorn. But real.

In the real world, the people who want to be in charge are usually the exact people who should not be allowed to be in charge.

Maybe that's not as true in a multiparty parliamentary system like modern Germany, but my impression of Merkel was largely created by Kate McKinnon's impression of her, so I don't know.

[Hot Pepsi]

I don't see why water charges shouldn't be folded into property tax or any other way of taxing for local services.

Because one's water consumption doesn't track directly with the value of one's real estate?

[Lang Spoon]

Rich people should subside the poor, even if they use less of a resource.

[treibeis]

They're the only left-wing parties in Europe to oppose property and water taxes

What, in all of Europe? Do you really know that?

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

Rich people should subside the poor, even if they use less of a resource.

Yeah, well we've conducted a 26 year experiment in paying for the water system out of general taxation and wound up with the worst water system in europe on a wide variety of metrics. It may be time to fall in with every other country in the developed world. If you don't find some way to hypothecate money for water infrastructure it will always lose out to literally any other spending priority. One of the main reasons that we're so into data centres is that they fucking pay for the water they use.

[Hot Pepsi]

Rich people should subside the poor, even if they use less of a resource.

Sure. But there are other ways to do that. Rebates and/or just subsidize the whole water infrastructure with money from income taxes and property taxes.

If single people have to pay as much for water as a whole family, there's not much incentive for them to reduce their water consumption. Sure, we should do so just out of concern for the resource, but pricing it accordingly is a much more efficient and politically viable way to do that.

[G-Man]

I reckon you've been away too long.

The German electorate that they appeal to is the people who drive fucking great big cars - because they can afford to - but who appease their conscience by voting Green.

And they are so fucking sanctimonious. I should know. My younger brother votes Green.

[Hot Pepsi]

The sanctimonious self-regard of so many of the most educated members of our society is one of the main things holding us back. I think.

[Gangster Octopus]

Actually it's the greed of the most educated of our society that's doing that.

[The Awesome Berbaslug!!!]

The latter wouldn't get away with it without the former i'm afraid. Twitter seems to have provided the means to create a whole new cadre of people who believe that no-one has the right to tell them what to do, but that everyone should do exactly what they say, even if it's incoherent nonsense.

[Gangster Octopus]

On a personal level, I can say that that sadly isn't confined to social media.

[ad hoc]

Thread

https://twitter.com/olivernmoody/status/1445472889256378370