Germany has just suspended AZ too
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The COVID-19 Vaccination Progress Thread
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Originally posted by Gangster Octopus View PostCongratulations!
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Originally posted by Balderdasha View PostChile has started storming up the vaccination charts, and has now delivered 34.48 doses per 100 population, the 4th highest rate in the world behind Israel, UAE and UK.
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I don't understand the cost/benefit logic, or risk analysis, behind the decisions to suspend vaccinations. You have on the one hand, a set of certain deaths resulting from non-vaccination, and, on the other, a set of symptoms that seem no higher than would occur normally so cannot be shown to result from the vaccine.
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Originally posted by Duncan Gardner View PostThey took the whole Chickasaw Nation
Offered all a vaccination
Now Dublin's suspended OAZ
The day after a jab for me
Chickasaw would see me right
No obvious symptoms for me thankfully
Except my arm that throbbed all night.
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Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View PostI don't understand the cost/benefit logic, or risk analysis, behind the decisions to suspend vaccinations. You have on the one hand, a set of certain deaths resulting from non-vaccination, and, on the other, a set of symptoms that seem no higher than would occur normally so cannot be shown to result from the vaccine.
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Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View PostI don't understand the cost/benefit logic, or risk analysis, behind the decisions to suspend vaccinations. You have on the one hand, a set of certain deaths resulting from non-vaccination, and, on the other, a set of symptoms that seem no higher than would occur normally so cannot be shown to result from the vaccine.
Originally posted by The GuardianOne [factor] is that nobody can rule out very rare side-effects on the basis of trials involving tens of thousands of people. There was such an issue during the swine flu pandemic of 2009. It was afterwards found that one in 55,000 jabs with a vaccine called Pandemrix caused the sleeping disorder narcolepsy in children. About 100 people in the UK are thought to suffer from the condition, which causes them to fall asleep without warning during the day.
Originally posted by The GuardianAnd governments, unlike scientific bodies, have to weigh up other things besides evidence. They will worry about public confidence – in the vaccine and also in ministers’ handling of any concerns. France for instance has struggled over vaccination. There is a long history of public suspicion of drug companies, which contributed to a debacle over the swine flu vaccine. France bought millions of doses, which people turned down. It has low vaccination rates for measles, mumps and rubella jabs in children too.
Originally posted by The GuardianBut the other factor in deciding on suspension could even be supply. In the UK, there are plentiful stocks. In Europe, there are not. AstraZeneca has just cut its proposed deliveries again, down to 30m doses in the first quarter, which is about a third of what was originally promised. Suspending the vaccine is easier in Europe if it is not available in great quantities anyway.
On top of that, since deals were closed between vaccine companies and governments, AZ has twice already severely rowed back on the agreed-on number of vaccins that they would deliver. In January AZ pledged to uphold supply to the UK but reduced EU Q1 supply from 80 to 31 million. And in March, AZ further rowed back on their promises for Q2. They have been an utterly unreliable partner for the EU. So EU countries might as well investigate the possible health risks associated with those few doses that AZ did deliver.Last edited by Wouter D; 16-03-2021, 10:38.
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Strange goings on around here, my wife (below 40, triathlete, only ever been in hospital to have children and even then discharged the same day 2/4 times) has had her letter - the actual letter, not the “we’ve got a slot today and stuck a pin in the list” job - for her first dose this week.
Suspiciously a couple of other teachers we know who wouldn’t have appeared on any priority lists have also been called up, so fevered speculation that there is an unofficial teacher programme going on. The other explanation is that the last time the GP took her weight she was 8 months pregnant and so might appear to an algorithm to be a lot heavier than is the case. I’m leaning toward the latter reason rather than the conspiracy theory developing in the staff rooms
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As alluded above AZ has not done itself any favours...
There is also de fact that such incidents are taken much more seriously because of the very high percentage of vaccine sceptics in some of those countries. When a large segment of the population has no trust in either government and pharma companies, erring on the side of likely exaggerated caution is unavoidable.
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At some point, we're going to have to start vaccinating children as well. Worldwide, under 18s make up 29.3% of the population (for the UK it's less than 25%) so it's completely impossible to reach herd immunity without vaccinating children. I think there are some studies going ahead at the moment on the safety of Covid-19 vaccinations in children, but I don't know how long it will take for any to be approved for widespread use.
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Originally posted by ad hoc View PostThanks Wouter, for that link and that post.
Not sure what will happen to those who have had a single AZ jab at this point when/if it is suspended. (My wife for example, would be in this situation)
Again, every country may draw their own line here, and I cannot speak for others, but in the Netherlands the stated policy is to pause AZ deployment for two weeks (starting the day before yesterday). Within that timeframe, the European Medicines Agency is scheduled to deliver several statements on the AZ vaccine risk. I expect these statements to be of the form "nothing to see here", after which the Dutch government has the munition to resume AZ vaccination while placating the vaccine-skeptics. If Romania follows a similar line, the disruption should be benign.
In other news, Pfizer/BioNTech just announced that they will supply 10 million vaccine doses more than initially promised in Q2. According to Ursula von der Leyen, "this enables member states to fill the supply holes left by others" [translation mine]. The Pfizer/AZ contrast is rather jarring.
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Originally posted by Wouter D View PostThe Pfizer/AZ contrast is rather jarring.
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- Mar 2008
- 18786
- Revelling In The Hole
- England, Chelsea and Tooting and Mitcham. And Surrey CCC. And Wimbledon Dons Speedway (RIP)
- Nairn's Cheese Oatcake
Originally posted by ad hoc View PostDepressingly, Serbia, which has the highest vaccination rate in Europe (I believe) is in the middle of a massive spike of cases, and they've just gone in for a new massive shutdown
What's been the story on the restrictions there for the last few months?
Obviously, if restrictions are relaxed, other than very gradually, before a vaccination programme is near or at completion, or if people become complacent, it's quite likely that cases will take off again.Last edited by Nocturnal Submission; 16-03-2021, 15:57.
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When our loathsome Tanaiste and the useless Taioseach keep flagging domestic tourism reopening in the summer/easing restrictions in May despite our AZ dependent vaccine programme already behind schedule I fear the worst here also. "the people need a summer" will be the new "the people need a Christmas/schools are safe".
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