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    Yeah, just them two would be fine but if everybody thinks the same, you end up like last week-end...

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      Saw live coverage of the applause on the 8 O'clock news, and muted the TV to hear the local reaction. Nothing.
      Then Mrs D reminded me that I'd paused the TV earlier while making dinner, and it was now actually 8.35.

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        Did anyone else. Notice the applause videos going around that many neighbors were ignored social distancing when they saw the opportunity to get their faces on TV.

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          Originally posted by Moonlight shadow View Post
          Yeah, just them two would be fine but if everybody thinks the same, you end up like last week-end...
          Why don't they let the dog loose to run around in the garden.

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            I had to explain to my wife what the strange noises from outside were.

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              Sadly, today's high Irish mortality largely occurred in nursing homes:

              https://twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1243286360712241152

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                This is interesting.......
                https://youtu.be/nISQbh8rrv8

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                  https://twitter.com/democrat_nyc/status/1243320130576297985?s=20

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                    https://twitter.com/NutmegRadio/status/1243323500217196544

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                      I think that Andrew Cuomo has been a lousy governor of my home state (mostly for his being beholden to special interests and his insatiable need for publicity and praise), but he is doing very well in this crisis.

                      His office is now offering daily emails for those interested in what New York State is doing. Here is the text of this evening's:

                      The outpouring of support over the last week from the people of New York, and from people across the world, has been inspiring. We are grateful to all the companies and individuals who stand with us in this fight.

                      I know that you are tired of this situation. I am too. But when I feel tired I think of the first responders who are out there every day showing up. I think of the healthcare professionals working 7-day weeks. I think of the grocery store workers who are doing double shifts just to keep food on the shelves, and the pharmacists who have lines going out the door, and so many others. The truth is, this is not a sprint — this is a marathon. And we will get through it.


                      Supplies ready for transport.
                      Photo of the Day: Supplies are loaded up to ship to Staten Island care facilities.


                      Here's what else you need to know tonight:

                      1. We are doing everything possible to slow the spread while adding hospital capacity. The state has identified four new sites for temporary hospitals, which I will tour tomorrow: the CUNY College of Staten Island, Brooklyn Cruise Terminal, Aqueduct Race Track in Queens and the New York Expo Center in the Bronx. These facilities, together with the temporary hospitals that are being built at the Javits Center and other locations, are aimed at building thousands of new beds to bolster existing hospital capacity. The state is also preparing hotels and college dormitories for emergency beds.

                      2. As of this morning, we have lost 385 New Yorkers to Coronavirus-related illnesses. We mourn them and my thoughts are with their loved ones. Tragically, we expect the number to rise as many patients have been on ventilators for weeks. NY will keep fighting to save lives. Help us save lives by staying home.

                      3. More than 52,000 volunteers signed up to work as part of the state's surge healthcare force. Just in the last day, an additional 12,000 healthcare workers, including retirees and students, have signed up to volunteer to join New York's response to the COVID-19 pandemic. More than 8,600 mental health professionals, from New York and other states, have signed up to provide free online mental health services. For free emotional support, consultation and referral to a provider, call 1-844-863-9314.

                      4. New York State's income tax filing deadline is delayed until July 15, 2020. Because New York State requires electronic filing, the date for filing state personal income taxes automatically travels with the federal filing date, which is now July 15. Further guidelines will be released soon.

                      5. If you filed for unemployment during the COVID-19 pandemic, you do not need to prove you are searching for employment to make a claim. Department of Labor Commissioner Reardon has signed a new order that limits all work search activities for all unemployment claimants. No activities are required during the pandemic to receive unemployment benefits.

                      Tonight's "Deep Breath Moment": JetBlue is donating free flights for incoming medical volunteers heading to New York State. I want to thank them for transporting the vital personnel we need. They are just one of dozens of businesses and organizations that have donated supplies and services to the state — for which we are deeply grateful.

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                        Originally posted by ursus arctos View Post
                        Unbelievable even from this lot. Is Cummings on some kind of bender? His lies are generally much accomplished.

                        https://twitter.com/johnestevens/status/1243221091679719427
                        Let's step back and consider what the EU is actually proposing here for a minute. What is being rather glossed over by the bland phrase 'procurement power'. I'm sure the EU would like people to think that their purchasing muscle will encourage Medtronic et al to increase production. Except these companies have already made it clear they would love to have already increase production if they could... but they and their supply chain are already operating at 100% capacity. The number of existing design and prior medically approved ventilators in the world is a limited resource. If the EU are using their 'procurement power' to securing a greater share of those available it means they are effectively taking them from smaller/poorer regions of the planet. European lives saved at the cost of non-European ones.

                        Meanwhile the path the British government have (accidentally!) found themselves on is actually attempting to increase the number ventilators in circulation. And there are rumblings that the design of them will be shared to enable other nations to do likewise (Dyson has said what he will supply his "open-book"). Now I'm absolutely sure that where Bojo and Cumdog have found themselves is not because they have developed an altruistic streak. And the strategy of getting more ventilators built by companies that didn't make the things two weeks ago, is inherently more risky than grabbing what you can for yourselves out of the limited current resources. It might yet blow up in the faces of them and everyone in Britain. But one of these strategies is dog eat dog capitalism... and that isn't the one which the UK Government('s strategic errors) has ended up with.

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                          Have we heard anything further from The Reverend? I'm worried for him.

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                            I had understood that the EU was also offering incentives for new or expanded production.

                            Italy certainly has, and has even detailed members of the military to work in the factories.

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                              I was thinking about the Dyson thing earlier and that makes sense in terms of a factory system producing something reasonably similar to a ventilator and the incentive of a pre-order of 10,000 units in the UK.

                              That's the shit scary bit. They're anticipating we might need 10,000 ventilators.

                              And then it made me think, what will we do with all those ventilators afterwards? I guess they'll get mothballed on an army base somewhere.

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                                Originally posted by Tactical Genius View Post
                                What are you making of this applause for the NHS workers?

                                I have put my phone away and heard all this clapping outside, panicking i came out and asked the neighbours what was going on.
                                If you appreciate what they are doing, give the poor bastards some proper protective equipment and a large freaking bonus.

                                I hope their fine work is remembered in 18 months when they come looking for an above inflation payrise.
                                I exchanged emails with an NHS worker of my acquaintance tonight. I nearly added something along the lines of 'maybe the social capital you guys are getting today will be translated into actual capital when this is over'. But I looked at it before hitting send and changed my mind; she is stressed enough at the moment with everything else she is dealing with. She doesn't need reminding of another issue to be frustrated about.

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                                  Originally posted by Patrick Thistle View Post
                                  I was thinking about the Dyson thing earlier and that makes sense in terms of a factory system producing something reasonably similar to a ventilator and the incentive of a pre-order of 10,000 units in the UK.

                                  That's the shit scary bit. They're anticipating we might need 10,000 ventilators.

                                  And then it made me think, what will we do with all those ventilators afterwards? I guess they'll get mothballed on an army base somewhere.
                                  Hopefully they will be.

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                                    Originally posted by Patrick Thistle View Post
                                    I was thinking about the Dyson thing earlier and that makes sense in terms of a factory system producing something reasonably similar to a ventilator and the incentive of a pre-order of 10,000 units in the UK.

                                    That's the shit scary bit. They're anticipating we might need 10,000 ventilators.

                                    And then it made me think, what will we do with all those ventilators afterwards? I guess they'll get mothballed on an army base somewhere.
                                    10,000? More like 30,000.

                                    What will happen to these ventilators after use on COVID-19 patients? Well, they will be at risk of being contaminated. So incineration, I would have thought.
                                    N.B. that is not insider knowledge, I've genuinely heard nothing either way about this issue and no know nothing of the details of how these things are planned to stay clean when in use*. But it's a piece of speculation I'm quite comfortable with.

                                    * - and if I did know, I wouldn't be allowed to tell you all!
                                    Last edited by Janik; 26-03-2020, 23:10.

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                                      They'll just be sterilised. The virus dies after 9 hours, doesn't it?

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                                        Depends on the surface. Up to three days on stainless steel. But yes, you are right, they can be cleaned down and re-used. So maybe we won't have to burn the lot. It's been a long day...

                                        Taiwan learned from the H1N1 outbreak of a decade ago. They have kept all their extra ventilators and are about the only country in the world who are not forecasting a shortage during this outbreak.

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                                          Originally posted by Janik View Post
                                          Let's step back and consider what the EU is actually proposing here for a minute. What is being rather glossed over by the bland phrase 'procurement power'. I'm sure the EU would like people to think that their purchasing muscle will encourage Medtronic et al to increase production. Except these companies have already made it clear they would love to have already increase production if they could... but they and their supply chain are already operating at 100% capacity. The number of existing design and prior medically approved ventilators in the world is a limited resource. If the EU are using their 'procurement power' to securing a greater share of those available it means they are effectively taking them from smaller/poorer regions of the planet. European lives saved at the cost of non-European ones.

                                          Meanwhile the path the British government have (accidentally!) found themselves on is actually attempting to increase the number ventilators in circulation. And there are rumblings that the design of them will be shared to enable other nations to do likewise (Dyson has said what he will supply his "open-book"). Now I'm absolutely sure that where Bojo and Cumdog have found themselves is not because they have developed an altruistic streak. And the strategy of getting more ventilators built by companies that didn't make the things two weeks ago, is inherently more risky than grabbing what you can for yourselves out of the limited current resources. It might yet blow up in the faces of them and everyone in Britain. But one of these strategies is dog eat dog capitalism... and that isn't the one which the UK Government('s strategic errors) has ended up with.
                                          Ford and GM plan to start making them too, but Trump could do more to compel companies to start making them but the Chamber of Commerce got in his ear about that.

                                          We’ll see how that goes. Ventilators are relatively simple, but not that simple. The FDA is making it easier to get them out there without too much of the usual oversight, but there needs to be some oversight to make sure they work the way they should.

                                          Comment


                                            Originally posted by Janik View Post
                                            10,000? More like 30,000.

                                            What will happen to these ventilators after use on COVID-19 patients? Well, they will be at risk of being contaminated. So incineration, I would have thought.
                                            N.B. that is not insider knowledge, I've genuinely heard nothing either way about this issue and no know nothing of the details of how these things are planned to stay clean when in use*. But it's a piece of speculation I'm quite comfortable with.

                                            * - and if I did know, I wouldn't be allowed to tell you all!

                                            I’ll ask, but I really doubt that.
                                            https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK214361/

                                            Devices designed by companies to be used once *inside the body* get cleaned and reused again and it works better than you might imagine, so I suspect ventilators, or at least most of their parts, can last a long time. After all, the most complicated part is the electronics. No need to junk that.

                                            As it is, doctors are finding ways to hook up multiple people to one ventilator. If they’ve all got the virus, cross contamination doesn’t matter so much. It’s a lot better than nothing.
                                            Last edited by Hot Pepsi; 26-03-2020, 23:27.

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                                              Originally posted by Hot Pepsi View Post
                                              I don’t know if it makes sense to compare confirmed cases, either over time or between countries, because the testing is so erratic. Number of people hospitalized or number of people who have died, sadly, are “harder” endpoints.
                                              Yes I agree.

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                                                Originally posted by San Bernardhinault View Post

                                                I do this as much for my records rather than because I think others care: big rise today: 55 new cases bringing us to 297. It makes the last couple of days look like outliers. The jump is probably mostly increased testing, but we also see a spike in hospitalization. 59 in hospital and 29 in ICU.
                                                San Diego update: 44 new cases (better than yesterday). 69 in hospital, 31 of whom are in ICU. We had our third death reported today.

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                                                  That is upsetting, but in the early days, our curve was better. Not sure why we’d be catching up now. Are there deaths in the early days that weren’t properly categorized because there was no proper diagnosis?


                                                  I just hope our genius leadership doesn’t take this as evidence that the distancing we’re doing now is failing and gives up.

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                                                    We should have prepared with more ventilators and masks. Those could have been stuck in a warehouse. Some were, but not enough.

                                                    But there was never going to be a way to have a ton of excess staff or actual hospital real estate. Nobody is going to train to be a paramedic, let alone a nurse or a doctor, just to be ready in case they’re needed someday and then go do a different career and wait for the call.

                                                    So in the future, we need to build machines and systems that can be at least partly run by amateur volunteers. My nurse friend says there are some important tasks that he could teach volunteers to do, but it would help if there were more that untrained or minimally trained people could do to help. I’m not really sure what that would be, exactly, and there’s a lot of regulatory issues to get through.

                                                    And since we’re probably always going to need to create field hospitals, we should build high school gyms and convention centers etc with that in mind. Make sure they can handle the power requirements and have doors that gurneys can wheel through, etc.

                                                    All of that assumes that the next plague will also be primarily respiratory. But these flu things often are and the other options I can think of wouldn’t be so labor/machine intensive to treat and a virus that isn't transmitted in the air wouldn’t be so contagious.

                                                    So this is probably the main kind of thing that needs to be prepared for, but the other possibilities will have also have to be considered and prepared for.

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