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The Dis-United Kingdom Thread - (Indyref 2, United Ireland poll, Welsh independence)

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    If I was a unionist historian the thing that would interest me is the bi-cultural or possibly even binational nature of Wales: Cymru Cymraeg with its own cultural and political institutions and establishment and national conversations - whose residents are pretty firmly set on independence and internationalist-minded; and the much larger Waleshire with its labour voting multicultural urban areas and white tory rural areas, which often resembles a region of England in terms of outlook and attitudes - albeit with its own national sports teams and a vague but growing sense of a distinct national identity - shaped as much by alienation from both Britishness and Welshness (as defined by the Cymry Cymraeg establishment) and by sport than by anything else.

    I was a unionist, understanding this dynamic would be key to heading off the threat of the independence movement - in particular that identity crisis among the Anglo-Welsh which is exacerbated by the post-devolution failures of English-based media and the paucity of English-language Welsh media. The risk is of course that it's the separatists building bridges while the "unionists" come up with stuff like "isn't welsh a funny language, it's all consonants you know, they'll never vote for independence they're too poor, thank god."
    Last edited by Bizarre Löw Triangle; 15-02-2021, 12:27.

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      It's definitely the case that the Independent movement seems friendly and inclusive while the unionists seem more like condescending pricks who think the Welsh should know their place, and self-hating ashamed-of-Wales quisling tip the hat to the master gollums like Andrew Right Twat Davies.

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        it's funny that everyone can have sat there watching brexit unfold and still think "voters will never vote to make themselves poorer".

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          Bizarre Löw Triangle Hastings is as ill-informed about NI as everywhere else. It hasn't been the Orange State he describes since 24 March 1972 (my 10th birthday ). The decades of violence then stasis since can't be blamed wholly on current DUP hacks, let alone Basil Brooke . The culpable stretch from every Brit Government and opposition since through nationalists on both sides of the border to everyone's favourite Buzzcocks fan Ursula vdL

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            https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/w...guage-19858158

            A director of Iceland frozen foods made some pretty awful comments about the Welsh language but the company acted quickly and sacked him. Iceland are based in Wales.

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              That's nothing - get a load of what this guy - an anglican vicar no less - said about Wales and the Welsh.

              There is no present in Wales,
              And no future;
              There is only the past,
              Brittle with relics,
              Wind-bitten towers and castles
              With sham ghosts;
              Mouldering quarries and mines;
              And an impotent people,
              Sick with inbreeding,
              Worrying the carcase of an old song.
              Last edited by Bizarre Löw Triangle; 18-02-2021, 13:00.

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                Originally posted by Bizarre Löw Triangle View Post
                That's nothing - get a load of what this guy - an anglican vicar no less - said about Wales and the Welsh.

                There is no present in Wales,
                And no future;
                There is only the past,
                Brittle with relics,
                Wind-bitten towers and castles
                With sham ghosts;
                Mouldering quarries and mines;
                And an impotent people,
                Sick with inbreeding,
                Worrying the carcase of an old song.
                "Thomas was an ardent supporter of the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament (CND) and described himself as a pacifist, but also supported the terrorist Meibion Glyndŵr fire bombings of English-owned holiday cottages in rural Wales. On this subject he said in 1998, "What is one death against the death of the whole Welsh nation?"

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                  A brilliant poet, by the way.

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                    Originally posted by Bizarre Löw Triangle
                    Worrying the carcase of an old song.
                    Welsh Bands suck
                    They're so backdated
                    And sing in Welsh
                    Though everyone hates it

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                      Originally posted by Sporting View Post

                      "Thomas was an ardent supporter of the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament (CND) and described himself as a pacifist, but also supported the terrorist Meibion Glyndŵr fire bombings of English-owned holiday cottages in rural Wales. On this subject he said in 1998, "What is one death against the death of the whole Welsh nation?"
                      He also resigned his RSPB membership over the introduction of non-native red kites. He was a very strange man.

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                        The Isle of Man as a tunnel interconnector:

                        https://twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1363447724285263874

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                          the worst part of this scheme is it doesn't go far enough*

                          *the worst part about this scheme is it's a wholly unserious flight of fancy by a meglomaniac who happens to be in charge of this unfortunate country but ykwim

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                            Why would they have TWO tunnels from NW England..?

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                              Comments on Twitter that Wales isn't even included in the batshit plans.

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                                Originally posted by Felicity, I guess so View Post
                                Why would they have TWO tunnels from NW England..?
                                More escape routes?

                                (Sorry)

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                                  To funnel twice the money to his mates in "consultancy and feasibility study fees".

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                                    Originally posted by Snake Plissken View Post
                                    To funnel twice the money to his mates in "consultancy and feasibility study fees".
                                    That's hugely plausible.

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                                      The Garden Bridge was just a trial run.

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                                        Meanwhile hammersmith Bridge is shut for the foreseeable future for the want of ongoing maintenance

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                                          Unionism's problem really is that the best arguments against it are the people advocating for it.

                                          https://nation.cymru/news/giving-wal...ion-unit-head/

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                                            The complete shambles of the EU and Irish governments rollout of the vaccine compared to the NHS has probably put a hold on any prospect of Irish unity in the short term. I'd say even Gerry Adams is having second thoughts.

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                                              Originally posted by Bizarre Löw Triangle View Post
                                              Unionism's problem really is that the best arguments against it are the people advocating for it.

                                              https://nation.cymru/news/giving-wal...ion-unit-head/
                                              It's been oft said that Jacob Rees-Mogg has been one of the best recruiters to Yes Cymru.

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                                                Originally posted by Bizarre Löw Triangle View Post
                                                Unionism's problem really is that the best arguments against it are the people advocating for it.

                                                https://nation.cymru/news/giving-wal...ion-unit-head/
                                                I already had a headache so I've no idea why I went ahead and read that, but here we are.

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                                                  Originally posted by elguapo4 View Post
                                                  The complete shambles of the EU and Irish governments rollout of the vaccine compared to the NHS has probably put a hold on any prospect of Irish unity in the short term. I'd say even Gerry Adams is having second thoughts.
                                                  Even before that recent shambles there was no chance of the Nationalist parties in NI getting anything near 50% in an election- which is the most obvious trigger for a single question referendum.

                                                  That said, I wouldn't overstate the NHS--both its 2021 successes and longer established popularity- as a guarantee of winning that referendum. Free at point of use is at real threat across Britain generally, and in NI the service was close to breakdown before lockdown. Diable Rouge & Awesome Berbaslug will have details

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                                                    Originally posted by Patrick Thistle View Post

                                                    It's been oft said that Jacob Rees-Mogg has been one of the best recruiters to Yes Cymru.
                                                    "We're forming a unit to save the union"
                                                    "Do you want to know what the problems facing Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are?"
                                                    "Absolutely not"

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