I don’t know what any of that means.
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Loyalist paramilitaries have apparently been getting the vote out for the DUP, and discouraging other unionist parties from running against them in certain constiuencies. Everyone knows about this, but the DUP are trying to back away from it, because basically it means that at this stage they are far more into paramilitarism than Sinn Fein. It would seem that the have hurt the feelings of the loyalist paramilitaries.Comment
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A tweet containing these words just wafted its way on to my timeline......
"The Sunday Times is fundraising so children living in poverty can have hot meals and activities during the holidays. I went to visit an *extraordinary* primary school. Please donate if you can, and please RT. Use this link - it’s outside the paywall."
.....which was nice.Comment
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The Sunday Times is fundraising inviting readers to replace the money its proprietor avoids in taxes, to support the failings of the government it has supported more or less uncritically for the last 9 years.Originally posted by Kowalski View PostComment
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Did I do the one on here or was it the other place about introducing legislation to legalise fox-hunting in England?
(I reckon spring 2021 at the latest.)Comment
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Remember. Corbyn was coming to steal all the houses.Originally posted by Satchmo Distel View PostComment
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Good. It'll remind the Great British Public what a pack of twats they've just elected. It would be a strategic mistake for the Tories as there's a weird crossover between brexiteers and pretty zealous pet-lovers I've noticed on FB.Originally posted by Guy Profumo View PostComment
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Campbell busy retweeting people who say Labour weren't Remain enough and should have stepped aside for the inevitable wave of Lib Dems.Comment
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It turns out that this election has proved literally everybody correct in their pre-existent political views.Comment
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Thanks for the kind words.Originally posted by Cesar Rodriguez
I fail to live by them. I've been super depressed lately, TBH and do not know how it's going to improve.Comment
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Not so. I accept that most of my predictions were wrong, but on the other hand I am more electorally popular than Gorgeous Galloway...Originally posted by San Bernardhinault View Post
Grr! Wendi holds: a Bill thrashing in Midlands bellwether (8-10)Comment
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Some new stats.:
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It confirms to me that Labour was in an impossible position without a pact with other Remain parties, which wasn't going to happen with Swinson as LD leader.Comment
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Thanks you all, for your commentary on this and a number of other threads since the election. It is, genuinely, the only place I've come to for 'news', of any sort; since 3.30am on Friday morning. I have avoided all news, whether on TV, radio (I've shifted my normal listening from 5 Live/World Service to FIP), newspapers (I don't look at them in the shops), and social media (which I haven't been on) - genuinely for all I know, Johnson could be Queen, or dead. I've avoided everything, it's like that Likely Lads episode, except I'm trying to avoid the outcome of the result, not the result itself. This place is a godsend, so much less manic than just about everywhere else.
It was the manic-ness of everywhere else that got me, cos the few weeks leading up to the election was full-on - constant arguing/positing on Twitter; keeping abreast of all developments; canvassing/leafletting my arse off etc - which meant waking up at 4am and immediately thinking politics, and thus developing an ongoing muscular tension across my chest that is only now starting to abate.
It was, quite literally, the hope that got me; I met hundreds of people - many young and amazingly positive - who wanted things to change, and I got caught up in the optimism. That their efforts have come to nought really breaks my heart, I just hope they can bring themselves up again, and try to effect change however they see fit. The other thing that breaks my heart is, well, everything; but most poignantly at the moment - having just walked from Brighton Station the 15 minutes home - is the 9 homeless people I just counted. What the fuck is to become of them? I can't see any hope.
For me, there's a nub of it there; I saw a fair bit of 'I don't like Corbyn' in the weeks leading up (in person twice, from acquaintances; once on the phone canvass) and in the media, and my internal reaction - not expressed publicly! - was 'who gives a fuck? There's people on the streets, get over yourselves'. I couldn't believe the insularity.
However, there was a chance to turn the whole thing around, and we (Labour) muffed it. I'm sure there's analysis-a-go-go all over the place at the moment, but having not seen any of it, here's my two penn'orth...I have some issues with Corbyn, and generally wish he'd have stated his case(s) more forcefully within and without the party; however, I think that his instincts, since the Referendum, seem to have being proved right - Labour were losing their heartlands on this, particularly when added to the gradual desertion of those areas by the party anyway. The 'left' media (ho ho), much of the party grandees (ho ho ho) and the membership were giving the 'tack towards Remain and we'll gain 20% in the polls' line, and they (regardless for the mo of whether it was actually the correct 'moral' line to take or not) were all wrong. If/when I ever get back to looking at news and analysis, I'll be keen to see how many admit it. Brexit was the key, and we lost everything else because of it. (As a side-point, it is interesting that all of that ground-game stuff achieved almost fuck-all, and I would imagine will matter even less in future - the election seems to have been won by paid-for fake information on Facebook. I have no idea how Labour will ever be able to counter that.)
Today, I've felt better, hence this post. Never particularly a big fan, but me and Ms johnr went to see Madness at the Roundhouse last night, and their Bullingdon Boy song was a tonic. There's people like me out there.
Sorry for the rather self-pitying nature of this. Anyway, for what it's worth, my dream ticket for the leadership would have been Raynor for Leader, Lewis or Butler-Brent for Deputy - though from what I've seen on another thread that looks unlikely. I'm going to be looking for some community-volunteering role(s) in the New Year - if I can't effect any national change (for now!), I guess I'll have to go local.
Lots of people don't believe they can have nice things. Oh well. Onwards.
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Thanks JohnR I also can't watch the news any more- and the glee and attempt to drive the left into the ground is simply vile
This is a good piece of analysis I thought
https://twitter.com/meadwaj/status/1207009659988709376?s=20TWEET]https://twitter.com/meadwaj/status/1207009659988709376?s=20
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Ta Nef - though I'm not accessing that as it goes via Twitter, and if I open that up there will be all sorts of notifications and things to respond to (I run the local ward account) which won't be good for me. Best I leave it all till after the New Year I think - at the moment I don't even want to read the stuff I might agree with, cos it'll just stress me out with ' Why oh why doesn't everybody see that this is the right way forward?' sort of thing...
Woe is me. I'll cheer up soon.Comment
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Sorry John - regardless of political differences, I can relate to your pain and I wish things were otherwise. I hope you can have a nice Xmas.Comment
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Then sir, you are no more than a "hyena dancing on the grave of a lion"Originally posted by Duncan Gardner View Post
Or then again, perhaps not...Comment
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Here it is, John direct to the article.
That's decent of you Lucy. can I ask how you feel now?
Lots of people in the PLP are kicking Corbyn this evening- Mary Creagh for example- the former Islington Councillor who couldn't hold Wakefield, but given that Corbyn has gone is there nothing to learn from what was acheived in policy terms , and in popuising issues, like bringing back secure tenancies or building council houses, that shouldn't be extreme for the Labour party.Comment
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johnr - from the few times I have conversed with you on here, you are a principled geezer, and did not deserve to be on the losing side. Even if I did not vote for your bloke.
I am, as I have said before, a lot less politically motivated than the majority on here. My one bit of advice to the Labour fans is - stop slagging off the people you want to support you. In 2016 you did it to the leavers, some of whom who were very undecided, but thought "hmm, don't like being governed by abroad" but were instantly told "RACIST-TORY-FASCIST" and had to retreat into Brexiteer as their main political option, rather than being persuadable. Likewise, and I hate to say it but I saw a lot of it on here, Labour supporters wanted Lib Dems to tactically vote for them. Not by saying "hey, vote for us", but by saying "You Blue Tory stupid cunts". That does not help you win votes.
Again, john, it's not you, but certain people need to be aware that abusing anyone who does not share your exact view is not the way to win elections.Comment
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Speaking of the feline one:Originally posted by Duncan Gardner View Post
https://twitter.com/workerspartyGB
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"I just don't like Corbyn" is the UK's "But her emails!"
the election seems to have been won by paid-for fake information on Facebook. I have no idea how Labour will ever be able to counter that.)
I think the only way to counter that is for reality to get ahead of the lies. If the UK economy goes into a recession and/or there really isn't billions more for the NHS like the Tories promised, a lot of people will become disillusioned.
Unfortunately, it is still hard to overcome lies and people's unwillingness to change their mind in the face of overwhelming evidence, so things will have to get a lot worse for several years before it will move the needle. Same in the US. But my understanding is that there are enough persuadable people "in the middle" who vote based on their own perception of reality rather than what they read on facebook. That's actually bad, for the most part, because those people can easily be convinced that the furrners are taking all the jobs or that global warming isn't real because it snowed last week, but in this particular case, they may come in handy if and when Brexit turns out to be a disaster. They may still be racist and antiimigrant and that sucks, but they don't strongly identify with either party and they care primarily about their own economic prospects.*
My reading of the Guardian the past few days - yeah, I know. I know! - made me a bit less depressed for the UK. It suggests that the UK is going to probably end up conceding a lot of issues to the EU and ultimately will end up in conceding a lot of the "sovereignty" that the dumber parts of its constituency want so desperately. Johnson will still be able to claim he made Brexit happen, but eventually, I think, more and more English people will ask what the point of it was if the EU still has the upper hand in the relationship. The only difference will be that the UK doesn't get a vote in the EU parliament. And, of course, the whole NI issue.
It will be bad for Britain in the short-run, but probably good for the world in the long run, if the EU doesn't let Johnson have his cake and eat it, even if it costs the EU economically a bit. They need to nip this shit in the bud and not give any other countries any reason to think leaving is a good idea.
But perhaps that's either so obvious that I'm stupid for saying it or I just completely don't understand what "a customs union" or "freedom of movement" really mean for the purposes of this discussion.
* I just read an analysis that showed that if Hillary had just done as well with white non-college voters as Democratic house candidates did in 2018, she would have won the key rust belt states and the election, even though it was only about a two percentage point difference! Likewise, Labour didn't really much worse than it did two years ago, but it was enough to make a huge difference in the outcome. So maybe there's a paralell there.
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Corbyn was a terrible candidate if a good man, and it's time the left faces up
to that rather than laying the blame with dodgy Facebook campaigns/Kuennsberg. These things had an effect, but so did the Brexit triangulating/bullshit whataboutery re Syria/Craig Murray levels of bollocks re Salisbury/bullshit positions re Scotland. I really wish it was McDonnell's turn to do the quixotic leadership campaign in 2015, he's more of a cunt, but he might have lost less badly.Comment
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Thanks for the responses folks, genuinely appreciated - but I'm alright, generally, it's the poor fuckers who are going to really be impacted by the Tories (too many constituent individuals/groups to mention here...and y'all know who they are) that do me in.
LS, fair points (if debatable), but forgive me if I duck out of any debates at the moment.Comment
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