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The Tech Sector Needs Union Representation

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    The Tech Sector Needs Union Representation

    EDIT: Removed
    Last edited by Johnny Velvet; 04-11-2021, 17:27.

    #2
    Unionise! Unionise! Unionise! Where are you based RC? That sector needs more unionisation, much more, probably its own self-contained one, though Unite might take it on. There was a time when some of us argued for gamers and developers and the like to come under NUJ auspices but not sure that's a flier.

    And of course greater enshrined rights at work is one of the key reasons we need a Labour government in the UK.

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      #3
      IWGB have done a lot to unionise people in the Gig economy

      They've been trying to unionise Video games workers

      Worth a call.

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        #4
        I've been saying this for twenty years. However, I don't think that the main unions have done even a fraction of what could be done to reach into the tech industry and get it organised.

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          #5
          Are you a contractor Reginald?
          IT is not an industry that lends well to overworking staff, especially the design and Implementation phase of project. Small mistakes can sometimes take a lot of time and money to remediate and are always very expensive.

          People shouldn't really be standing for this rubbish and companies shouldn't expect this as it will hurt them really badly in the long run.

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            #6
            It's not always been clear to me what the correct union should be, but the tech sector needs a union, and tech freelancers in particular need proper representation. There is a "freelancers union" in the US, but it's not a proper trade union - it does, at least, offer health insurance and advocacy for freelancers who might otherwise be unable to get it, but it's not really enough.

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              #7
              Originally posted by San Bernardhinault View Post
              It's not always been clear to me what the correct union should be, but the tech sector needs a union, and tech freelancers in particular need proper representation. There is a "freelancers union" in the US, but it's not a proper trade union - it does, at least, offer health insurance and advocacy for freelancers who might otherwise be unable to get it, but it's not really enough.
              Ohhh, I can tell a million stories about how organisations try and shaft their IT Contractors. However, that pales into comparison with the sharp practices of the IT recruitment agencies.

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                #8
                I work for a software firm in Munich (we produce software and hardware). We're not unionised, but there's a very active works council and no one seems to work more than 40-45 hours a week. In fact several people work ten-hour days and take Friday off.

                If you needed to work on a weekend, that would be quite a big deal.

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                  #9
                  Unite is one of the few unions that covers Ireland as well as the UK. I was a workplace rep in the electronics sector for 30 years before I retired going back through all the previous incarnations - ASTMS, MSF, Amicus then Unite, back to the days of Clive Jenkins (who seemed to be always propping up the bar at the old Bishops Stortford training centre whenever I went there). The unions really do need to get involved with the changing work patterns and short term contract/gig sectors.

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                    #10
                    Reg, I'm with the CWU, when I joined they were the postal workers union but they've expanded all over the place, you could try them as well.

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                      #11
                      Originally posted by Reginald Christ View Post
                      This phenomenon is known as "crunch" and it's particularly brutal in the games industry where employees hardly see their families from one month to the next and receive no financial compensation for the extra work they put in. By way of illustration, one of the best devs I've worked with and who still works on my old team told us that in his last job he and two other developers were promised bonuses of €3,000 each if they delivered a particular feature on time. They did - and received less than half of what they were promised because "certain steps weren't achieved."
                      Right on!

                      AdeC jr was planning on working in gaming and got offered what sounded like a decent opportunity at one of the biggest companies based out of Toronto. Through a confluence of circumstances he had to turn it down, which annoyed him immensely at the time, but now he's glad he did. Three of his friends were hired. Two are still there, have been for over three years. They each make CDN $19.50 per hour. They too have worked crazy hours to meet deadlines and were also promised bonuses if they did. A year later they still haven't seen a cent. The third friend, a woman, quit after six months, not only because of bad pay but the climate of good old toxic masculinity in the upper echelons was more than she could take. She now only works for tech companies, gaming and animation, on a short-term contract basis. It's fucking appalling.

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                        #12
                        EA do seem like scum sucking maggots.

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                          #13
                          That doesn't seem a liveable hourly rate for Toronto at all. At least the Microserfs of the dot com boom were remunerated.
                          Last edited by Lang Spoon; 23-08-2019, 18:28.

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                            #14
                            Originally posted by Reginald Christ

                            I wonder if some of this is to do with the prevailing orthodoxy in software development that's been fostered by Silicon Valley startup culture: "You're being paid a fortune to do something you're supposed to love - you should be happy, little code monkey. This is something that you devote your life to!"
                            I think this is part of it. There are also other strands of Silicon-Valleyism at work:

                            Sure, there's the: Why are you complaining? You're doing something you love. You're a nerd, why on earth do you want to go out at the weekend rather than sit in front of a screen writing code for banks?

                            But also for freelancers there's a sort of deep belief in libertarianism. This is the true freedom of the market at work. Silicon Valley loves the market. You get paid for your actual end product. Isn't that great? Why do you want obsolete leftist ideas like unions interfering in your ability to become as obscenely rich as Sergey Brin?

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by Lang Spoon View Post
                              That doesn't seem a live ale hourly rate for Toronto at all. At least the Microserfs of the dot com boom were remunerated.
                              It really isn't. One of AdeC jr's friend is a Serbian immigrant who lives alone in a tiny studio apartment. The other, from a Chinese family, lives with his parents who aren't at all happy that he's without, what they perceive, as a proper career.

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                                #16
                                Originally posted by Lang Spoon View Post
                                EA do seem like scum sucking maggots.
                                This was Ubisoft, who seem to be equally bad.

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                                  #17
                                  I always think they are French for some reason.

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                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Reginald Christ

                                    Another good point, yeah. Because of the high salaries, the sector tends to attract people who have a toxic combination of greed and a sense of their intellectual superiority. Neither of those traits are conducive to the kind of thinking that would allow collective bargaining or organised labour movements to thrive. I'm sure you've had the same experiences where you've chatted to colleagues in the sector who've either boasted about their pay packet or complained that the €90,000 per year they're earning is an insult to them because the boss gets paid three times that.

                                    You can imagine that kind of person saying something like "Union dues? That's the kind of shit my grand dad had to deal with and I'm no manual labour stooge like he was!"
                                    And I think this will be an issue for any union trying to organise the tech sector, and particularly the freelance tech sector. They have to present it as offering value to right-wing arseholes, rather than as a traditional labour organisation. The PFA, for all its faults, might be a reasonable template.

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                                      #19
                                      Companies have also successfully sold the idea that any developer can be the next Brin / Gates / Notch so why bother with unions.

                                      I think EA have reformed working practices a fair bit - the current cunch of bunts is Rockstar.

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                                        #20
                                        Aye they seem some bastards. Did Benzies win his case against those horrible Hauser cunts?

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                                          #21
                                          Never been disclosed. Which I reckon is a yes.

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                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by Lang Spoon View Post
                                            I always think they are French for some reason.
                                            A friend of mine worked for Ubisoft in Montreal for a while. The best thing I've learned from him was the French Canadian expression for when something got completely borked in the code: "c'est fucké".

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