Originally posted by Diable Rouge
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Last edited by The Awesome Berbaslug!!!; 10-05-2019, 23:33.
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Ok, well, it was an interesting thread for a while. I look forward to the next one.
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Originally posted by The Awesome Berbaslug!!! View PostAngry left wing populism and angry right wing populism are very frequently two sides of the same coin. History would suggest that people make the leap a lot quicker than you'd think, it just depends on the level of anger. I'm extremely pessimistic about how things are going to turn out.
Also there's always a extreme right wing tinge in every independence movement. Something to do with the whole nationalism side of things.Last edited by Diable Rouge; 10-05-2019, 21:58.
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Angry left wing populism and angry right wing populism are very frequently two sides of the same coin. History would suggest that people make the leap a lot quicker than you'd think, it just depends on the level of anger. I'm extremely pessimistic about how things are going to turn out.
Also there's always a extreme right wing tinge in every independence movement. Something to do with the whole nationalism side of things.
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The Catalan independence movement does not have an extreme-right wing as far as I can tell.
Oh it almost certainly has. Every independence movement does. It's just not that easy to detect because the language they use before independence is a bit different. It wasn't necessarily very obvious during the irish war of independence, that a lot of the people involved were going to wind up in a fascist militia, less than a decade and a half later.
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I think the simpler explanation is that they are awful and ridiculous people.
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I believe that it actually is based on how voters in Catalunya voted in the recent elections, rather than their future intentions as regards party.
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Maybe they're just mildly pro-Catalan independence but really like Vox's other policies.
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I read this as a Catalonia poll. Which would mean they are planning to support Catalonian independent, then move to Spain and vote Vox.
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Perhaps 8% of Vox voters believe that without Catalunya (which in my experience is a fairly small c conservative place) they'd have more of a chance of grabbing at least a share of power in what was left of Spain. (I mean I know that shows an element of pragmatism not usually associated with fascists, but who knows)
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The Catalan independence movement does not have an extreme-right wing as far as I can tell.
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Vox are specifically and deliberately and loudly and importantly Spanish nationalist.
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I don't see why Catalonian nationalists can't also be fascists. They don't have to be Francoists.
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It's more like 8 percent of Northern Leave voters supporting London Secession.
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This is a bizarre stat - 8% of Vox supporters would vote for Catalan independence, which would be the equivalent of Brexit Party voters opting for Remain:
http://twitter.com/electo_mania/status/1126801167500156928
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There was a Guardian long read about 10 days ago by Meaghan Beatley about the virulent anti feminism in Vox and the PP rightward lurch, linking it to the ‘Wolfpack’ rape trial.
Really interesting and very good on the feminist mobilisations EXCEPT astonishingly, she didn’t mention the women’s general strikes, presumably because social media is more important.
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You do know right that Labour insisted that all of those measures be put in the programme for government against the wishes of their more conservative partners, and forced through the citizens assembly, to give enda Kenny the cover he needed to avoid dealing directly with such issues. Maire Geoghan Quinn takes a lot of the credit for the decrimininalization of Homosexuality, though I would probably suspect it has more to do with the gay, and the bisexual labour ministers that were in that cabinet.
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Originally posted by The Awesome Berbaslug!!! View Post
could this be because a major driver for the far right is the decline of male privilege, primarily to the benefit of women?
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Originally posted by Diable Rouge View PostA breakdown of votes by gender - as tends to be the case all over Europe, it's principally men who vote for the far-right (and indeed further to the left), with women favouring more moderate parties:
http://twitter.com/electo_mania/status/1124571024627064833/photo/2
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