The Wire again

[Tubby Isaacs]

I may not have liked it much, and felt excluded by all the threads on it, but I'm glad I can sort of get this sharp pop culture reference from the Tories:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8219482.stm

What a surprise, he doesn't mention anywhere specifically.

[Ginger Yellow]

The Wire again

On a somewhat related subject, how on earth did it happen that 48% of Brits, including 24% of Labour voters, think the Tories would improve the NHS? Do these people have no memory? I mean, I realise Labour's NHS reforms haven't been great, but almost all of them were effectively adopted from the Tories. And the likelihood of an increased NHS budget under the Tories is just about nil.

[Jimmy Bignutz]

The Wire again

I wonder if Grayling will heed any of the lessons of The Wire, such as the failure of the war on drugs, the erosion of work in western countries, the inadequacy of unencumbered capitalism, or the damage done by an education system based on targets. Or maybe it's just a soundbite, I don't know.

[Incandenza]

The Wire again

I get the impression that The Wire is a far bigger deal in the UK than it ever was here. Is it running on TV currently?

[Ginger Yellow]

The Wire again

It's showing every day on the BBC. Obviously this is a generalisation, but I think niche US TV is often a bigger cultural phenomenon in the UK, partly because we tend to get the cream of the crop, and partly because the buzz has already built in the US so critically acclaimed US shows get hyped early in the UK.

This isn't always true - Seinfeld, for instance, was basically a non-event in the UK because of the BBC's godawful scheduling. And most people haven't seen Arrested Development and so on. But your archetypal HBO shows get watched by proportionately more people, I reckon. Certainly among "opinion formers".

[Guest]

The Wire again

And Grayling was talking about Moss Side, S.Manchester.
Most of the locals who spoke in response, ridiculed the comparison with Baltimore, rather than The Wire.

[Ginger Yellow]

The Wire again

Oh, and it's probably also partly because you don't have to have a subscription to watch them over here (well, in most cases - BSG still hasn't been aired on terrestrial yet).

[E10 Rifle]

The Wire again

Sometimes, when listening to Cameron and his cleverly vapid cronies, it almost feels like we were governed by intellectual titans under Blair in comparisons.

That these tawdry and unconvincing bandwagon-hoppers are going to be in power in a year's time remains depressing to the core.

[Incandenza]

The Wire again

Ginger Yellow wrote:

Oh, and it's probably also partly because you don't have to have a subscription to watch them over here (well, in most cases - BSG still hasn't been aired on terrestrial yet).

Yes, I was wondering about that as well. Funny that The Wire has probably been seen by more people in the UK than it was in the US. Even as far as HBO shows are concerned, it was never a popular program apart from critics and a fanatical small audience (I read at its peak it had 4 million viewers, and in the final season it was below 1 million).

[Tubby Isaacs]

The Wire again

Is there a dog whistle going on here, perhaps? If you have too many blacks, it gets like The Wire?

[Hofzinser]

The Wire again

I can't imagine that the crossover is very large between people who get the Wire reference and people who would respond to a dogwhistle of that type.

[Ginger Yellow]

The Wire again

Funny that The Wire has probably been seen by more people in the UK than it was in the US. Even as far as HBO shows are concerned, it was never a popular program apart from critics and a fanatical small audience (I read at its peak it had 4 million viewers, and in the final season it was below 1 million).

I don't know if it's more than the US in absolute terms, but it probably is proportionately. It's shown at 11.20pm or so, and in very rapid succession, which will reduce the live viewing audience. The only statistic I've seen is a 600,000 total for the first episode.

[Tubby Isaacs]

The Wire again

That's a good point, Hof.

The Tories have made a promise of increasing NHS spending, which seems to be taken at face value at the moment. Of course it shouldn't. Quite how Cameron can say Britain is close to defaulting on debt repayments, but insist that spending's going to be increased on the second largest item in the budget, I don't know.

[Jimmy Bignutz]

The Wire again

I will say this, though - some of the things that happen in The Wire mirror my life exactly. Admittedly I don't live in the projects, but I have done some projects. They were really hard - I am rubbish at time management.

Sorry, what were we talking about?

[Bored Of Education]

The Wire again

On a somewhat related subject, how on earth did it happen that 48% of Brits, including 24% of Labour voters, think the Tories would improve the NHS?

No-one asked me

[Tubby Isaacs]

The Wire again

The Tories are probably regarded as better able to control costs, that's all. Many people, I expect, feel that the extra money hasn't been well spent, and think of certain well publicised drugs not being available on the NHS as evidence. Of course this doesn't take into account the cost of these drugs or the ageing of the population.

[Lucy Waterman]

The Wire again

Nice of the Tories to make it clear how utterly removed they are from any experience of British working-class life that they can only understand it in terms of an American cable TV drama.

[Ginger Yellow]

The Wire again

But the availabilty of those drugs wouldn't be changed by "controlling" costs. Quite the opposite.

Anyway, sign of the times: Fuzzy's has changed its serviettes from red to blue.

[Moonlight Shadow]

The Wire again

There was also that show with Fergie trying to convince the world that Sale Moor is a the grottiest of sink estates. I live next to Sale Moor, it's not scenic and there is the usual fair amount of scallies you'll find in the poorer estates but it's hardly as bad as it was portrayed.

[Tubby Isaacs]

The Wire again

GY, I was meaning controlling costs in other areas to make more money available for buying more cause celebre drugs. One area might be that the Tories could cut better PFI deals, for example. Like you, I think PFI is a bad thing but if Labour's going to continue with it, I reckon the Tories will come out of the issue better.

Executive pay is another thing that gives an impression of profligacy they can exploit. And the GP contract (which while probably not as generous as it's been made to sound) has, according to the government, raised GP salaries to the highest in Europe. Why Britain's doctors should be paid more, out of a smaller budget than other systems is not clear.

[Brandenburger Toro]

The Wire again

There was a lovely comment from the Lib Dems (after your man said he had only seen series one), to the effect that "the Tories should love season two".

[Victor]

The Wire again

Here in the States(I live in New York City)many of us feel The Wire is the best show that has ever been on TV. I certainly think it is the best time I have ever invested in watching a TV program. It really is a 60 hour movie.

It is a critics favorite here in the USA but never reached the pop status of The Sopranos. The reason for that is simple. The Wire was a truly integrated TV show that defied the categories that we use here(a Black show, a show watched by Whites, etc.). The Sopranos were mono-chromatic compared to the stories told on The Wire that involved the entrenched historical legacy of racism in Baltimore.

I would say that some White people in America watched The Wire and decided there were too many Black faces on the show and felt, "it wasn't about us" When The Wire ended its run on HBO the only cable outlet in America to pick it up for syndication was Black Entertainment Television. A&E which picked up The Sopranos passed on The Wire as did every other cable channel which has picked up other HBO shows that were ready for syndication after their run on HBO.

Homicide: Life on The Street suffered the same fate as The Wire. A critical hit but lost because it too was just too integrated for a country that is still too segregated.

I grew up in The South Bronx which is just as hard as West Baltimore and The Wire told it like it is on the streets, the precincts, in the media, on the docks, in the hood and in White working class neighborhoods.

I am looking forward to David Simon's next HBO project which is a look at the world of music in post Hurricane Katrina New Orleans.

[Tubby Isaacs]

The Wire again

Hi Victor. The Wire is regarded just as highly by nearly everyone here. Loads of threads on it, try the search function.

I did a semi-serious "The Wire is rubbish" thread, and haven't yet persisted with the series as I will, but otherwise, you'll find loads of detailed stuff written by people who agree with you.