Racist tendencies and aging.

[WOM]

Do people become more racist as they age? I've noticed a marked increase in 'casual/lazy racism' from my parents as well as Mrs WOM's, and it's led to some of those awkward 'trying to express disagreement and disapproval without ruining the evening' moments.

So, does it increase, or do they just stop worrying about trying to hide it, or is it something else - like that tendency to become more suspicious or fearful of anyone 'different'?

Anyone else experiencing this?

[Sommer]

Racist tendencies and aging.

WornOldMotorbike wrote:

Do people become more racist as they age? I've noticed a marked increase in 'casual/lazy racism' from my parents as well as Mrs WOM's, and it's led to some of those awkward 'trying to express disagreement and disapproval without ruining the evening' moments.

So, does it increase, or do they just stop worrying about trying to hide it, or is it something else - like that tendency to become more suspicious or fearful of anyone 'different'?

Anyone else experiencing this?

Yes, my father. Although I can't say it is his age, I think it more mine.

[Anton Gramscescu]

Racist tendencies and aging.

It's just you, white boy.

[EIM]

Racist tendencies and aging.

WOM - I'm noticing it in a lot more people generally, not just the old. I don't tend to worry about ruining the evening, or the moment, though. I just pull them the fuck up on it, and then go and do something nice on my own.

[Amor de Cosmos]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Well I don't think I have (but it's tough to judge subjectively.) La Signora — who had a typically Daily Telegraph upbringing — has definitely become more liberal since moving here.

I think people tend to become hardened in whatever opinions they already possess as they age. If they were judgmental when young they're likely to become intolerant when older. OTOH if they were always open to new experiences it's possible they'd become even more so. What a lot of people don't realise is that you actually have to work at staying open-minded, it doesn't happen automatically, and too many people can't be arsed.

[Moonlight Shadow]

Racist tendencies and aging.

It's when the person expressing a racist opinion thinks he/she is striking a blow against "political correctness" that it gets me...

[DCI Harry Batt]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Every bloody time I see a post by you I get this bloody earworm.

[Guest]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Crap, now I have it as well.

[Cavalry Trouser Tips]

Racist tendencies and aging.

A close family member who I was on the phone with the other day intimated that the reason there was a lot of cases of swine flu up North was "because all the pakis have it".

I found it very, very difficult to continue the conversation after that.

[linus]

Racist tendencies and aging.

There seems to be more acceptance across the board towards Asians and Blacks, but less towards middle easterners and Moslems, due in good part to negative media coverage.

Younger folk tend to me more immune to this as they have a chance to interact with those populations and develop a first hand opinion, whereas older people tend to derive their views (and biases) from the media. That's why in Quebec you have places like Herouxville leading the charge on the wrong side.

[Cavalry Trouser Tips]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Damn. All I can see now is Dave Angel - Eco Warrior walking down that country lane and then spinning round to point at the camera.

Edit: here we are.

[Bored Of Education]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Happily, I think it is different for me.

I have certainly become more bellingerently anti-racist as I get older and I think my parents have got more liberal as well. This is quite impressive considering they have moved back to the area where I grew up that is quite monocultural really. Indeed, I have met people there who haved back there from London as they found it too multicultural.

I have a vague feeling that people who have worries about immigration, multiculturism etc ironically end up moving abroad to places like Spain and Australia.

I find myself arguing the toss with people more on terms such as "gyppo", "pikey" and "chav" than any more general racist terms. Interestingly, I seem to be having these arguments with types who would generally regard themselves as liberal more.

Similar, I suppose, with the recent debate about "septic" on here

[Wyatt Earp]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Bored of Education wrote:

Similar, I suppose, with the recent debate about "septic" on here

Well, don't lets get into all that again, but no, not that similar on the face of it. There's the fact that Americans don't form a low-status, low-power group in society, for one thing. That doesn't license calling them what you like, but you could argue, and I think I would argue, that it makes it mainly a politeness issue rather than a political priority.

[Purves Grundy]

Racist tendencies and aging.

There are three possibilities here. One is that people do get more racist as they get older. Another is that we are culturally becoming more racist across the board. But what I think is actually happening is that the black people are getting worse.

[Bored Of Education]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Bored of Education wrote:

QUOTE:
Similar, I suppose, with the recent debate about "septic" on here

Well, don't lets get into all that again, but no, not that similar on the face of it. There's the fact that Americans don't form a low-status, low-power group in society, for one thing. That doesn't license calling them what you like, but you could argue, and I think I would argue, that it makes it mainly a politeness issue rather than a political priority.

I sort of go along with you on that apart from that there is a lot of anti-Americanism that is pointed towards low-status, low-power Americans i.e. "white trash" Americans with bad diets, for instance. I wold put that on a par with the use of "chav" but with a side order of xenophobia.

Broadly, though, of course I agree with you. I can't remember who said that when people are criticising political correctness in language are usually criticising just general politeness but I agree with them.

[Wyatt Earp]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Bored of Education wrote:

I sort of go along with you on that apart from that there is a lot of anti-Americanism that is pointed towards low-status, low-power Americans i.e. "white trash" Americans with bad diets, for instance. I wold put that on a par with the use of "chav" but with a side order of xenophobia.

Oh, totally, yes, and I hate that. Radio 4 Anti-Americanism. There was a lot of that when I was at Cambridge, unsurprisingly: you couldn't laugh at our working classes any more (this was pre-"chav"), so you laughed at theirs, with their artifical fibres and their habit of saying "Gee, that's so old!"

But that's not necessarily implicit in the use of a particular word.

[Bored Of Education]

Racist tendencies and aging.

No, you are right, "septics" is much more catch-all

[Tubby Isaacs]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Does it have to be directed at a low status group? Can't you go quite a long way by picking out a difference? My sister got bullied appallingly at school explicitly for not being part of a low status group- ie not living in a council house, being quite bright, having a mother who didn't drop h's and a father who owned a butcher's shop?

There may be some sense in which this isn't as bad as someone calling them chavs, but it escapes me. It's all about saying "you don't belong". I don't give two shits that butchers aren't an oppressed group.

[Wyatt Earp]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Tubby Isaacs wrote:

Does it have to be directed at a low status group?

Does what? Bullying doesn't, obviously. But political oppression does, and it's political oppression that gives certain types of bullying, or even simple rudeness, a political dimension.

My daughter's getting a bit of what your sis got. Kids are saying at lunch "You ea' laak you're eat'in' wiv the Quiin."

[Tubby Isaacs]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Does this (call it what you will) which is regarded with particular seriousness have to be directed at a disadvantaged group?

I'm sure it's of no comfort at all to the target that there's some political karma in her favour somewhere. Is it not supposed to hurt because of that? Broader society is of no relevance here- the dominant group at her school were council housed manual worker kids who hated anyone who looked like they were different to them. Why should we qualify condemnation of them in any way at all?

Had she called a kid "common" or whatever, would she be more in the wrong?

[Sommer]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Why on Earth... wrote:

Tubby Isaacs wrote:

Does it have to be directed at a low status group?

Does what? Bullying doesn't, obviously. But political oppression does, and it's political oppression that gives certain types of bullying, or even simple rudeness, a political dimension.

My daughter's getting a bit of what your sis got. Kids are saying at lunch "You ea' laak you're eat'in' wiv the Quiin."

No idea what the last sentence says..

My daughter was bullied at school when we were leaving to move to the Middle East. Her peers called her a traitor, because of going to a place, where they made suicide bombs.

So to concur with the gentleman earlier in this thread, not just the ageing folk.

[Wyatt Earp]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Tubby Isaacs wrote:

Does this (call it what you will) which is regarded with particular seriousness have to be directed at a disadvantaged group?

I'm sure it's of no comfort at all to the target that there's some political karma in her favour somewhere. Is it not supposed to hurt because of that? Broader society is of no relevance here- the dominant group at her school were council housed manual worker kids who hated anyone who looked like they were different to them. Why should we qualify condemnation of them in any way at all?

Had she called a kid "common" or whatever, would she be more in the wrong?

Sorry, Tubby, there are so many straw men in that that I feel compelled to ask you what it is that you think I'm saying here.

[Bored Of Education]

Racist tendencies and aging.

Does this (call it what you will) which is regarded with particular seriousness have to be directed at a disadvantaged group?

I'm sure it's of no comfort at all to the target that there's some political karma in her favour somewhere. Is it not supposed to hurt because of that? Broader society is of no relevance here- the dominant group at her school were council housed manual worker kids who hated anyone who looked like they were different to them. Why should we qualify condemnation of them in any way at all?

Had she called a kid "common" or whatever, would she be more in the wrong?

Of course, in microcosm, broader society's issues are not your daughter's but, on a macro level,it is absolutely caused by the issue of there being a dominant group within society and the view, if not fact, that that group benefits hugely in areas such as education, career oppurtunuties and health provision.

This dominant group engenders a "divide and rule" policy e.g. you have no jobs/houses because immigrants are taking them all - a byproduct of which is that they view with suspicion anyone who is different from them.

I add the caveat, of course, that there are very many poor and/or working class children that don't feel like that at all or, at least, don't act upon it.

On the micro-level, of course, it is just bullying that needs to be dealt with effectively. Unfortunately, as discussed elsewhere, bullying doesn't feature highly on Ofsted reports nor league tables so isn't huge priority with a lot of schools beyond lip service. This is despite the fact that bullying impacts upon a child's academic development as well as social and emotional.

In governors meeting at our school, we are given figures for racist, sexist or "disablist" complaints which are passed onto the council (for what, I do not know). There is nothing similar for bullying and my argument is that you have to look at bullying and "name-calling" from the start and stop that rather than get involved when it gets to these extremes.

[Tubby Isaacs]

Racist tendencies and aging.

What's been argued before on here is that some insults are made much worse by historical factors- oppressed groups, if you like. ie middle class kids calling poor kids "chavs". What I'm emphasizing is that the hurt of insults can derive from feeling exluded from the group, any type of group at all.

Here the target belongs, in broader society terms to a more privileged group. That amounted to not much as it happens- that she could work for her dad in a shop when she left school and inherit it in 35 year time- but even if it did, that doesn't mean anything to the target at the time. Are we seriously saying the target should have some longer perspective beyond being excluded from the group in the place where she spends most of her life now? It's what I was calling "karma", that's all.

I know I get uncharacteristically angry when I think of my sister's situation, but I think I've been as clear as I can.

[Wyatt Earp]

Racist tendencies and aging.

So you think I'm saying being bullied isn't hurtful, or isn't as hurtful, if you don't belong to an oppressed group?

If I tell you I'm not saying that, can we move on?